Working Towards PSIA Alpine Level 3 Certification

[karlo]

I decided to go for a PSIA Alpine Level 3 certification. This thread is for those aspiring to or considering Level 3 certification to pose questions and to post experiences and updates. And, it is for those that have already achieved the certification to answer questions, offer advice, and share experiences.

Here’s a question. One of the requirements is to have Advanced Level teaching experience under the belt. What is that? I posed the question to my region’s PSIA office (East), and the reply is that there is no absolute. The guidance shared is to teach on advanced terrain, since Teaching and Skiing Exams will be on such terrain. But, what does that mean exactly? There are Beginner, Intermediate, and Expert trails, then Double Blacks. Are Intermediate trails advanced terrain? But, I assume that terrain selection goes hand in hand with skier Level? So, e.g., is teaching someone on a Blue trail to advance from a wedge christie to parallel skiing, is that Advanced Level teaching? I see why the answer from the PSIA office says there is no absolute. So, any examples to map the range would be appreciated.

 

[Nancy Hummel]

It is my understanding that Level 2's can teach up to Level 7 skiers. Level 3 certs teach 8&9 skiers. So, the MA is more nuanced and the skiers you are teaching are capable of skiing most double black terrain.
You need to be able to teach anything, anywhere. That said, you can teach difficult maneuvers on easy terrain.

 

[Tlri]

Been a long time since my level 3 exam.
From what I recall we spent most of the time on steeper blue and black terrain. We were teaching and doing MA on each other and the skills that go with upper level skiing on that terrain.
Think about giving a clinic to a group of coaches working for their level 3 skiing exam and that was the teaching exam in a nutshell.
We took turns 1 candidate at a time on the side with the examiner watching the group and doing a running MA to the examiner then formulating and executing group lesson based on what we saw.

 

[LiquidFeet]

It is my understanding that a LIII instructor needs to be able to teach people skiing at a LIII instructor level to do something new and worthy. In other words, you'll need to be able to teach your peers in the certification exam something worthwhile that genuinely applies to their personal skiing. You'll need to be able to watch and evaluate each candidate's skiing and potentially help each person increase their skill level. There are no "let's pretend" exercises any more that involve fictional students, at least here in the East.

Because your exam is done in a group setting, you'll need to come up with some progression that addresses at least one person's real skiing. Then you'll need to lead the group through that progression with the goal of helping that one person, and who knows, maybe the rest too. Examiners like seeing something new that they haven't seen before, so keep this in mind. Your demos for this progression should be solid. I think this goes on all day in the exam so you may get to do this several times (I'm not totally sure of the format in the east since it's new), so as the group moves over the mountain's terrain, tactical choices may also be in play.

In a private conversation with the examiner on the chair after you do your thing you'll need to explain why you did what you did. This is when you showcase your MA abilities, your solid understanding of turn mechanics with an emphasis on cause and effect, and your experience with tactical choices relating to changing terrain and conditions.

 

[karlo]

Level 3 certs teach 8&9 skiers.

spent most of the time on steeper blue and black terrain

Got it. I need to be sure I have experience instructing Level 8&9 skiers, on blues and blacks.

Because your exam is done in a group setting, you'll need to come up with some progression that addresses at least one person's real skiing.

And, in Teaching Exams, I’ll need to demonstrate that experience by applying it to other candidates.

 

[Erik Timmerman]

It is my understanding that a LIII instructor needs to be able to teach people skiing at a LIII instructor level to do something new and worthy. In other words, you'll need to be able to teach your peers in the certification exam something worthwhile that genuinely applies to their personal skiing. You'll need to be able to watch and evaluate each candidate's skiing and potentially help each person increase their skill level. There are no "let's pretend" exercises any more that involve fictional students, at least here in the East.

Because your exam is done in a group setting, you'll need to come up with some progression that addresses at least one person's real skiing. Then you'll need to lead the group through that progression with the goal of helping that one person, and who knows, maybe the rest too. Examiners like seeing something new that they haven't seen before, so keep this in mind. Your demos for this progression should be solid. I think this goes on all day in the exam so you may get to do this several times (I'm not totally sure of the format in the east since it's new), so as the group moves over the mountain's terrain, tactical choices may also be in play.

I was teaching a L3 clinic yesterday and that was definitely a conversation that we had. Try to make a difference in someone's skiing. Be adaptable, and realistic when you start your teaching segment. Don't do something that nobody in your group can do. Especially, don't choose a task that you can't do really, really well. If you find yourself at a fork in the road where one of the candidates needs some help, take the fork and make it work for them!

 

[CalG]

Clarify the OP

There terrain types that are compared to the other terrain offered at THAT SAME MOUNTAIN!

"easiest" = green circle

"More Difficult" = Blue Square
N.B. these trails are intermediate DIFFICULTY relative to other ski trails on that mountain. Skier ABILITY has nothing to do with the designation!

"Most Difficult" = Black Diamond

"Expert"= Double Black Diamond. A concession to ski are marketing, but does mean there are significant skills and perhaps athleticism required to negotiate the terrain.

There is no "intermediate skier" terrain anywhere on any mountain in North America.

 

[karlo]

Right

green, blue, black, double black Trails

then,

Beginner zone, skiers skiing Green and groomed Blues

Intermediate Zone, skiers skiing all Blue and groomed Blacks

Advanced Zone, skiers skiing all terrain and all conditions

So, Level 3 instructors need experience teaching Level 8 & 9 skiers in all terrain and all conditions.

https://www.thesnowpros.org/Portals/0/Documents/National Standard/PSIA_Alpine_Certification_National_Standards_6_1_2014_FINAL.pdf?ver=2016-09-06-113044-140

 

[Erik Timmerman]

So, Level 3 instructors need experience teaching Level 8 & 9 skiers in all terrain and all conditions.

https://www.thesnowpros.org/Portals/0/Documents/National Standard/PSIA_Alpine_Certification_National_Standards_6_1_2014_FINAL.pdf?ver=2016-09-06-113044-140

It sure would help, but the reality is that very few do. That's just not where our business is, is it? There are not a lot of 7-8 lessons, and if you are not a L3 yet, you probably aren't getting them. Exception would probably be seasonal kid's programs. It would help though to have whoever does your scheduling try to get you some more advanced lessons. I've said this before, but the way to prepare for a teaching "assessment" is to do more teaching. There is a difference between an experienced teacher and a training junkie and you can be sure that the examiner knows the difference.

 

[karlo]

There is a difference between an experienced teacher and a training junkie

Yup, gotta get the experience. Shadowing a Level 3 instructor in advanced level lessons is another possibility.

 

[mdf]

Yup, gotta get the experience. Shadowing a Level 3 instructor in advanced level lessons is another possibility.

Years ago my son and I were the only ones in an upper-level group lesson at Crested Butte. Our instructor asked us if I minded having a couple other instructors join us. At one point the group consisted of us two students and five instrutors.

 

[Nancy Hummel]

Find other people who are working on Level 3 and take turns teaching each other.

@Mike King and I ski together regularly and do MA and make suggestions to each other.

Watch skiers from the lift. Choose the one thing you would focus on to change their skiing and come up with a plan of what you would do to change or improve their skiing.

Write it down or record on your phone. After doing this several times, you will have a nice library of lesson plans that you can modify or add to as you go along.

 

[Seldomski]

In my experience as a student, the difference between a L2 and L3 teaching an advanced lesson is pretty large. In one case, the skiing proficiency was also noticeably worse for the L2 - i.e. the L2 fell a few times doing demos during the lesson. Lately, I do usually ask what the certification level of an instructor is during my lesson.

 

[Erik Timmerman]

the L2 fell a few times doing demos during the lesson.

Ouch, that's embarrassing.

 

[Skisailor]

In my experience as a student, the difference between a L2 and L3 teaching an advanced lesson is pretty large. In one case, the skiing proficiency was also noticeably worse for the L2 - i.e. the L2 fell a few times doing demos during the lesson. Lately, I do usually ask what the certification level of an instructor is during my lesson.

In my experience, the lines seem to be much more blurred between what skier levels an L2 vs. an L3 can teach than what is being described here. Perhaps it has to do with the size of our ski school. Perhaps it has to do with the extensive advanced and expert terrain at Big Sky. We have many L2s who competently lead lessons of high level students in expert terrain. And you are more likely to find L2s with extensive skiing and teaching experience who simply did not have the personal goal or time or money to pursue L3 certification.

 

[Mike King]

In my experience, the lines seem to be much more blurred between what skier levels an L2 vs. an L3 can teach than what is being described here. Perhaps it has to do with the size of our ski school. Perhaps it has to do with the extensive advanced and expert terrain at Big Sky. We have many L2s who competently lead lessons of high level students in expert terrain. And you are more likely to find L2s with extensive skiing and teaching experience who simply did not have the personal goal or time or money to pursue L3 certification.

Well, there can be a difference between the certification level attained and the level at which the instructor teaches. There are certified Level 3 instructors who no longer ski at the Level 3 standard, there are Level 3 certified instructors who teach stuff that is no longer current or, for that matter, correct, and there are Level 2 certified instructors who teach and ski at a Level 3 standard.

In Aspen, we do not send guests at the 8 and 9 sign out with Level 2 instructors regardless of their skiing/teaching proficiency except in rare cases (running out of qualified instructors).

 

[Skisailor]

Well, there can be a difference between the certification level attained and the level at which the instructor teaches. There are certified Level 3 instructors who no longer ski at the Level 3 standard, there are Level 3 certified instructors who teach stuff that is no longer current or, for that matter, correct, and there are Level 2 certified instructors who teach and ski at a Level 3 standard.

In Aspen, we do not send guests at the 8 and 9 sign out with Level 2 instructors regardless of their skiing/teaching proficiency except in rare cases (running out of qualified instructors).

Yup. Totally agree with what you wrote. Which also bolsters my point that "the rules" vary from ski school to ski school.

 

[Kneale Brownson]

For OP: Ski schools generally support certification and want to help train for it. Every one I've worked at would offer LIIs the opportunity to teach higher levels to prepare for III exams. Ask to be allowed.

 

[karlo]

the lines seem to be much more blurred between what skier levels an L2 vs. an L3 can teach than what is being described here. Perhaps it has to do with the size of our ski school

there can be a difference between the certification level attained and the level at which the instructor teaches

Absolutely. I took L2 exams with instructors who have a ton of experience. I learned so much from them that I have literally wondered if I can take the L2 exams again.

As for matching appropriate instructor to student, that’s something a proactive ski school should do. Cert level is just one criteria towards a ski school’s decision to hire, as is a law degree to land a position at a law firm. But, if a ski school wants to ensure satisfied customers, it needs to go beyond that and rate for itself each instructor’s capabilities.

And, btw, an instructor’s own skiing is not an indication of how good an instructor he or she is either. If that were the case, Mikaela Shiffrin wouldn’t be able to find coaches.

 

[Mike King]

And, btw, an instructor’s own skiing is not an indication of how good an instructor he or she is either. If that were the case, Mikaela Shiffrin wouldn’t be able to find coaches.

There is some truth to this, but there is a catch: clients learn visually, as well as from auditory and kinesthetic experiences. So, if the coach isn't able to demonstrate the movement changes desired, some other accommodation may be necessary to obtain that input. Perhaps it might be photographs or video, but those are likely not as timely as a good demonstration from the coach. So, for most guests, the ability to ski at a level appropriate to the client does matter.