Traverse etiquette

[CalG]

A recent ski holiday at a Lake Tahoe ski area has me wondering....

What is the social expectation for "cutting" vert. with traverses in your area?

Here in the Ice Coast, there is no such thing, ;-)

Isn't it SOOOO annoying when the first 300 feet of the descent is scarred with horizontal ski tracks?!

 

[oldschoolskier]

Here in Ontario, if you traverse you are at the bottom before you even start skiing, so it doesn’t happen for skiers....snowboarders on the other hand isn’t that all they can do ? And using the term snowboarder and etiquette doesn’t go together.

 

[Fuller]

Considering there's not much you can do about it...

I thought this thread would be more about following other skiers along a traverse. When to pass them if you can, what to yell at the guy not going fast enough, what to say to the 100 angry skiers you're holding up. Important stuff like that.

 

[crgildart]

Follow them to the lift corral and make sure you're in line for the chair behind them.. Slide up and pop their heel piece as they're sitting on the chair... oops, sorry about that...

 

[CalG]

Considering there's not much you can do about it...

I thought this thread would be more about following other skiers along a traverse. When to pass them if you can, what to yell at the guy not going fast enough, what to say to the 100 angry skiers you're holding up. Important stuff like that.

On that note......

I passed a fellow standing in a "dip" under a tree, just off the traverse track. As it was uphill from there, and there was no one near behind, I made the comment "How do these kids do it?". (It was a LOOOOONG traverse out, with lots of up hill stepping and striding, to some good fresh).

The gentleman responded, "I feel like a 35mph skier in a 55 mph zone". By looks, the fellow was in his late 50s.
Me, I was trying to "keep up" with my "less than 30" son.

I hope everyone knows and uses the "Jackson shuffle" when stepping up a traverse. A real energy saver!

 

[Near Nyquist]

A recent ski holiday at a Lake Tahoe ski area has me wondering....

What is the social expectation for "cutting" vert. with traverses in your area?

Here in the Ice Coast, there is no such thing, ;-)

Isn't it SOOOO annoying when the first 300 feet of the descent is scarred with horizontal ski tracks?!

They are Californians they ski like they tend to drive, poorly

 

[slowrider]

 

[Fuller]

A traversity of justice...

At WMR I have my favorite place to go on a powder day but a lot of factors have to line up: A steep trail groomed by winch cat the night before, 18+ inches of powder on top and a lift that only runs on weekends. You also have to park above the main lodge area to ski to the lift. If you manage to arrange all these things when you eventually get off the lift it's a jeep track with a slight downhill to the right to some nice trees. Going left to my trail is a bit more work but if you get there first it's Warren Miller Time for sure.

All of this came together 2 years ago and I was on the 3rd chair of the morning. All but two folks went right and I followed a husband and wife couple to the left. The jeep track had been reduced to about 3 feet wide due to the drifting snow. So much snow that it almost obscured it entirely. So I was number three in the traverse, the snow was easily waist deep in places and it was slow going for about 100 meters. The guy was blazing the trail, his wife was following and I was drafting in their wake. I'm not a great skier but I can motor pretty good when incentivized. It got wide enough at the end to not be single file so I pushed ahead and we all sort of arrived at the same time.

Such a beautiful sight, I go to sleep dreaming of such an opportunity. I look back at the lift, no one is coming this way, just the three of us. Inexplicably these two folks are now having a conversation instead of dropping in. I think of my ambitions, the fact that I was the number three guy and he did do most of the work. Also they have season passes (as I do) and they are probably not masquerading as locals (as I am) they live here! I'm also thinking that I've never skied conditions this steep and deep and if I take off first I'm likely to biff it and I may need them to pull me out. So eventually they took off and skied it beautifully. I went third and muddled my way down with a shit eating grin and never had to cross their tracks. So I get the Gold Star for being a good Boy Scout.

But wait there's more! All those factors came together again this year only the wind picked up to almost whiteout conditions. I swear the same two people were ahead of me only this time they had their little daughter with them. We all went left the same way we did the year before and they stopped and talked and fussed with the kid like forever...

I burned 'em big time!

 

[Eric267]

Funny I've almost posted a few times sorta on this subject recently.

I've come across a lot of groups of people recently that just don't understand there an unwritten etiquette on the traverse...

MAINTAIN YOUR SPEED & NEVER STOP IN THE TRACK!!!

A couple weeks ago a group of 3 that I was holding speed right behind decided where they were at was a good place to just come to a complete stop about 1/2 way out a pretty long side slope traverse. I was forced to jump out up high and kick sluff down onto them. I decided I'd give them the advice (see above) as I skied past and they proceeded to call me an asshole and talk shit as I skied away. REALLY?? I'm quite patient out on the traverse compared to many I know.

Just yesterday on the high traverse at alpine there were 2 women that stopped right at the top of a 15' dip and lip. As I came around the corner they were at the top on the upside (they had not made it up and obviously just sidestepped up and decided to stop at the crest) with the cornice on their left.

At the last seccond while diving into the dip I realized they were not moving and did a speed check (so as not to launch off the lip on the other side and knock them off the cornice) and ended up not quite making it up the high side and was forced to fall over and pull myself up over the lip. Like WTF!?!? If someone had been behind me we could have been in big trouble since they would not have been expecting me to not make it up at the speed I'd been keeping out the entire traverse previously

As far as powder days out here in CA/Tahoe general rule is just to stay high and keep an eye uphill for people dropping in above you. Maybe the only time you as the down hill skier need to question, if you at that point have the right of way, or they do.. Likely if someone is dropping in above you it is something steep/gnarly at which point you yield to them as much as possible. I.e. Someone dropping idiots at alpine while you are cutting across the wolverine traverse to lower beaver or peeps cutting across chicken bowl while palisades are open at squaw

It is super annoying but you can't really tell someone that they can't ski something just cause they don't have the skills/balls to ski it from the top..

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.skimag.com/.amp/adventure/ode-traversing

** one point also worth mentioning is that many of the cross slope tracks are first cut on powder days by ski patrol on their morning bomb routes so people tend to follow them after the first tack is set

 

[raytseng]

Agree with Eric, the lower traverse tracks do not bother me that much tbh compared to the other issues with safety related or impeding related issues.
I agree everyone in a resort can ski anywhere if they like, if you don't like it, go hire a heli. The telling others what snow they can ski is starting to feel less about etiquette and more into a bit of ski elitism which I don't jive with.

What does it say about your skiing, if a couple traverse tracks in the line you picked 4turns down are throwing you off?
Also, does this just mean you didn't wake up early enough to get the first tracks? Or you aren't far enough out that there's still multiple tracks? Or the line you picked is dropping in too early that people are traversing further out?

 

[Tricia]

Funny I've almost posted a few times sorta on this subject recently.

I've come across a lot of groups of people recently that just don't understand there an unwritten etiquette on the traverse...

MAINTAIN YOUR SPEED & NEVER STOP IN THE TRACK!!!

A couple weeks ago a group of 3 that I was holding speed right behind decided where they were at was a good place to just come to a complete stop about 1/2 way out a pretty long side slope traverse. I was forced to jump out up high and kick sluff down onto them. I decided I'd give them the advice (see above) as I skied past and they proceeded to call me an asshole and talk shit as I skied away. REALLY?? I'm quite patient out on the traverse compared to many I know.

Just yesterday on the high traverse at alpine there were 2 women that stopped right at the top of a 15' dip and lip. As I came around the corner they were at the top on the upside (they had not made it up and obviously just sidestepped up and decided to stop at the crest) with the cornice on their left.

At the last seccond while diving into the dip I realized they were not moving and did a speed check (so as not to launch off the lip on the other side and knock them off the cornice) and ended up not quite making it up the high side and was forced to fall over and pull myself up over the lip. Like WTF!?!? If someone had been behind me we could have been in big trouble since they would not have been expecting me to not make it up at the speed I'd been keeping out the entire traverse previously

As far as powder days out here in CA/Tahoe general rule is just to stay high and keep an eye uphill for people dropping in above you. Maybe the only time you as the down hill skier need to question, if you at that point have the right of way, or they do.. Likely if someone is dropping in above you it is something steep/gnarly at which point you yield to them as much as possible. I.e. Someone dropping idiots at alpine while you are cutting across the wolverine traverse to lower beaver or peeps cutting across chicken bowl while palisades are open at squaw

It is super annoying but you can't really tell someone that they can't ski something just cause they don't have the skills/balls to ski it from the top..

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.skimag.com/.amp/adventure/ode-traversing

** one point also worth mentioning is that many of the cross slope tracks are first cut on powder days by ski patrol on their morning bomb routes so people tend to follow them after the first tack is set

I think there was a sign at the gate to the traverse on East Wall at Arapahoe Basin that said something like. "When stopping on the traverse, step up or down to allow traverse traffic to flow." Perhaps that is a sign that should be at all traverse entrances.

 

[DanoT]

I am finding that more often than not, people are passing me on cat tracks without letting me know that they are about to go by me, followed by cutting me off. So, on a busy cat track I have been known to hold my poles at close to right angles to my body, forcing the hot shots to give me my space.

 

[4ster]

** one point also worth mentioning is that many of the cross slope tracks are first cut on powder days by ski patrol on their morning bomb routes so people tend to follow them after the first tack is set

Proper etiquette would be for everyone to follow the high traverse that patrol painstakingly put in, drop into the falline & ski/ride it to the bottom of the valley. Snowboarders need to make their own boot pack just above the ski traverse. If it is a bowl, it should end up looking something like this and there is plenty of fresh tracks for everyone.

What is a crime to me is seeing a beautiful bowl completely covered in traverses from one side to the other at all different elevations top to bottom.

Years ago while skiing Kickinghorse they had rope lines running down the hill from the ridge in different sections with “no traversing” signs. This seemed to help a lot.

But you know what? I paid for my E ticket, so I’m gonna go wherever I please

 

[DanoT]

Years ago while skiing Kickinghorse they had rope lines running down the hill from the ridge in different sections with “no traversing” signs. This seemed to help a lot.

At Sun Peaks there is a traverse that under cuts a host of lines on the Chief Shoulder. It can be viewed from the Burfield (local's) Chair. Locals named it decades ago: The Perverse Traverse. Patrol puts up fencing to prevent the traverse but the Gorbs just go around it.

The farther you go out on the Perverse Traverse, the steeper the ski down gets. One time while riding the chair we saw a skier go out quite a ways and then turn back. My buddy started laughing and then said, "That is the first time that I have seen The Perverse Traverse In Reverse".

 

[Jim McDonald]

Met Farmer Dave several times; he's a very cool guy.

 

[tch]

Hate to be the fred here, but I find there to be a huge lack of civility on a lot of traverses at certain ski areas. At Snowbird this year, got lured onto Road to Provo, which is usually a groomed blue but had not been touched for several deep days. It had developed into a double-diamond traverse -- whoop-de-doo's that were knee to thigh high and an uphill wall that was up to my shoulders, combined with a track that was originally set with a lot of downhill. I was not the only one struggling -- folks were crashing and burning all around. At the same time, young hotshots were cruising through yelling obscenities at those of us stopped above or below the track and even skiing over other people's skis. While I understand some of the frustration, I was bummed by the aggro attitude that seemed predominant. A little patience and graciousness would have gone a long way there.

 

[givethepigeye]

What do you do? It’s a resort. Two weeks ago during the cycle at Snowbird, we were about the 5th or 6th out the bookends traverse. Got stuck behind somebody in the track, they finally moved out of the way. By the time we had gotten to the step and decided to ski down - the hoards had just traversed below, like 30 or so and skied or boarded that whole thing in one downward diagonal traverse. Just used them as gates and reminded them to “ski the fall line” as we went by. It was deep and fluffy so no big deal, but a smidgen irritating.

 

[SBrown]

There are many different situations here, as far as dropping early. It just seems dumb to go all that way yet lose so much of your vert. I don't really mind a well-set lower traverse, depending. The whole dropping-early-to-ski-a-line-30degrees-off-the-traverse, that makes little sense to me.

What about waiting for someone to drop? Was in Honeycomb Canyon last month and traversed almost all the way out; it was our 2nd or 3rd run after rope drop. There was a skier ahead of my friend, then my friend, then me, then Skier 1's friend behind me. Skier 1 stops when there were no further lines already skied, only pristine powder beyond. We got there about 5 sec after she did and went just past her while she waited for her friend. Skier 1 obviously was not dropping yet, and her friend was probably another 20 sec away. My friend dropped, and Skier 1 yelled, "HEY! That's my line!" I looked at her and thought (maybe out loud), I don't think you get to make people wait for you like that on a powder day. Then I dropped.

It was sublime, btw.

 

[SBrown]

Hate to be the fred here, but I find there to be a huge lack of civility on a lot of traverses at certain ski areas. At Snowbird this year, got lured onto Road to Provo, which is usually a groomed blue but had not been touched for several deep days. It had developed into a double-diamond traverse -- whoop-de-doo's that were knee to thigh high and an uphill wall that was up to my shoulders, combined with a track that was originally set with a lot of downhill. I was not the only one struggling -- folks were crashing and burning all around. At the same time, young hotshots were cruising through yelling obscenities at those of us stopped above or below the track and even skiing over other people's skis. While I understand some of the frustration, I was bummed by the aggro attitude that seemed predominant. A little patience and graciousness would have gone a long way there.

Yeah, I agree with that. Alta's High T of course is legendary for that. I understand the frustration, I get frustrated sometimes, but actually pushing people out of the way is going a little far. The thing is, the person in front of you isn't probably going to ski your line. If everyone waits, it's the same order, just a few seconds later than it would have been, and if you pass them (nicely), you're in even better shape than you would have been if you were behind some bros who were faster than you. So if the traverse is the only way into an area, and it isn't a major safety issue, I don't mind slow. A little slow, not a lot.

 

[Tricia]

Proper etiquette would be for everyone to follow the high traverse that patrol painstakingly put in, drop into the falline & ski/ride it to the bottom of the valley. Snowboarders need to make their own boot pack just above the ski traverse. If it is a bowl, it should end up looking something like this and there is plenty of fresh tracks for everyone.
View attachment 70009

What is a crime to me is seeing a beautiful bowl completely covered in traverses from one side to the other at all different elevations top to bottom.

Years ago while skiing Kickinghorse they had rope lines running down the hill from the ridge in different sections with “no traversing” signs. This seemed to help a lot.

But you know what? I paid for my E ticket, so I’m gonna go wherever I please

While skiing a few days ago with @Andy Mink we were admiring the powder farming lines on one of the faces at Alpine Meadows. Its nice when we see people who care about preserving powder.