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Ron

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We definitely noticed a dip in mountain traffic over the weekend here. On Saturday, when we had 15", Ski-Ra and I never waited longer than 5 minutes to get on a lift. Interesting article on how Steamboat day pass is now $199 and also the effects of the blackout on the Ikon pass.

Did others who ski at Alterra resorts see a dip in skiers/riders?

https://www.steamboatpilot.com/news...DciXvhoKuLg4Ezpda1KobZ9IfnOLIuYhDHET_xaCGMvz8
 
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Ken_R

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We definitely noticed a dip in mountain traffic over the weekend here. On Saturday, when we had 15", Ski-Ra and I never waited longer than 5 minutes to get on a lift. Interesting article on how Steamboat day pass is now $199 and also the effects of the blackout on the Ikon pass.

Did others who ski at Alterra resorts see a dip in skiers/riders?

https://www.steamboatpilot.com/news...DciXvhoKuLg4Ezpda1KobZ9IfnOLIuYhDHET_xaCGMvz8

Guess that proves the crowding effect Season passes like the Epic and Ikon have... :huh: lets how A Basin fares next season in regards to crowds if they stay out of the Ikon. With the Epic it has been mayhem pretty much daily.
 

BS Slarver

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Woke up this morning to an email from Steamboat with a survey link wanting my personal info as to why i didn’t purchase a pass of any kind from them this year. Survey had major flaws but completed it anyway after choosing the other box more than once.
Kinda appeared to me like they are assessing, weighing in on the effects of the multi mountain / ikon pass on their skier experiences.
Here in Big Sky, no blackout dates and traffic is up, WAY up and by some accounts 75k + skier visits and although management won’t disclose actual numbers it was the front page article in our local paper.

As Mrs. C and I always use the singles line during holidays and peak times it has been rare not to ride with a ikon family, who can blame them with the escalating cost of the sport we all love. Only ones seam to be moaning are those now in the 45min tram line.

EDIT .... $ 199 WTF ?!?
 
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Ron

Ron

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WOW! thats a huge jump. I didnt get a survey.... Maybe its only going to out of towners?
 

BS Slarver

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Apparently they are only reaching out to those who frequented SB in the past and then fell off the radar ?
Angle of the survey appeared to focus on price vs crowd.
 

focker

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These $200 per day walk up rates are insane. That is all.
 

LKLA

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These $200 per day walk up rates are insane. That is all.

The prices are as insane as the logic behind buying them!

Why wait to buy at the window? Would you buy your airlines tickets at the airport counter or get a hotel room at the front desk the night of? Would you wait to buy tickets to a popular sporting event until the day of the event?

Be it via passes, multi-day packages, on-line discount pricing or other alternatives (buddy passes), paying straight-up window prices seems like the last thing one would want to do.
 

tball

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We definitely noticed a dip in mountain traffic over the weekend here. On Saturday, when we had 15", Ski-Ra and I never waited longer than 5 minutes to get on a lift.
It's also worth noting it was very cold and that probably kept folks indoors. That certainly helped at Copper.

The lift lines at Copper were not too bad in spite of it and WP/MJ being the only not-blacked out Ikon areas around on Sat and Sun. I was on the easy side of the hill with my family and there were no lines on the beginner Kokomo and Lumberjack lifts.

The beginner/intermediate Union Creek and Timberline lifts had full mazes (5-10 mins) the better part of Saturday and Sunday, but no worse than other weekends. Those are typically the worst lines on the mountain, and I expect over on the advanced side of the mountain the waits were minimal.

Again, the cold (5-10F) kept folks inside. We stopped for a late lunch at the Union Creek base on Saturday around 2:15 and it was still way overcrowded with nowhere to sit.

Monday (President's Day) the resort wasn't crowded at all and afternoon looked like a typical deserted Monday.

I'm curious how WP/MJ fared. Glad we are past all the Ikon non-blackout days. Still worried about weekends through March. We'll see.
 

fatbob

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Well the Boat had a 3/4 day from me that they wouldn't have had at all without Ikon (was on the road by 14.30 to drive up to Jackson) and at $199 window rate it would have been a swift "f*ck the f*ck off" if I'd stopped by on the off chance. I mean it's quite nice but does everyone have to pretend they are Vail/BC or Aspen these days? No way on earth I'd recommend it as a family vacation destination if those are the pass prices they aspire to.
 

Ken_R

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Im basically done with EPIC after many years. I am re-evaluating my pass purchase/s for next season...
 

UGASkiDawg

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It's also worth noting it was very cold and that probably kept folks indoors. That certainly helped at Copper.

The lift lines at Copper were not too bad in spite of it and WP/MJ being the only not-blacked out Ikon areas around on Sat and Sun. I was on the easy side of the hill with my family and there were no lines on the beginner Kokomo and Lumberjack lifts.

The beginner/intermediate Union Creek and Timberline lifts had full mazes (5-10 mins) the better part of Saturday and Sunday, but no worse than other weekends. Those are typically the worst lines on the mountain, and I expect over on the advanced side of the mountain the waits were minimal.

Again, the cold (5-10F) kept folks inside. We stopped for a late lunch at the Union Creek base on Saturday around 2:15 and it was still way overcrowded with nowhere to sit.

Monday (President's Day) the resort wasn't crowded at all and afternoon looked like a typical deserted Monday.

I'm curious how WP/MJ fared. Glad we are past all the Ikon non-blackout days. Still worried about weekends through March. We'll see.
Did not wait at all on Bee or the A lift, there was ~5 minute wait on Sierra on Sat from around 11-12 but nothing after that. or on Sunday Reso was a disaster the one time I went down there on Sat though. Xcelerator was never more than 3-5 minutes.
 

focker

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The prices are as insane as the logic behind buying them!

Why wait to buy at the window? Would you buy your airlines tickets at the airport counter or get a hotel room at the front desk the night of? Would you wait to buy tickets to a popular sporting event until the day of the event?

Be it via passes, multi-day packages, on-line discount pricing or other alternatives (buddy passes), paying straight-up window prices seems like the last thing one would want to do.

Agreed 100%. I've used Liftopia on my trips out west with great $ savings success and no complaints. Will be using them again next year in SLC.
 

RJS

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We definitely noticed a dip in mountain traffic over the weekend here. On Saturday, when we had 15", Ski-Ra and I never waited longer than 5 minutes to get on a lift. Interesting article on how Steamboat day pass is now $199 and also the effects of the blackout on the Ikon pass.

Did others who ski at Alterra resorts see a dip in skiers/riders?

https://www.steamboatpilot.com/news...DciXvhoKuLg4Ezpda1KobZ9IfnOLIuYhDHET_xaCGMvz8

This seems like a very positive result for Ikon resorts who have blackouts on the Base pass, be they partner resorts or the "premium" Alterra resorts like Steamboat and DV.

As expected, the proportion of traffic Ikon Base pass holders goes way down during peak holiday times. Their traffic on the mountain is hopefully replaced in some form by people purchasing day tickets. The resort is getting more money per ticket from the people buying day tickets, multi-day tickets, or tickets as part of lodging packages than they would get through people using their Ikon Base pass. Additionally, having the Ikon Base holders off the mountain means the mountain is less crowded for the day ticketers/season pass holders/non-base Ikon pass holders who remain.

Andrew Stoller, a manager at Ski Haus, noticed the ski gear and rental business saw fewer visitors from the Front Range during the holiday. Those guests tend to be Ikon passholders. Instead, he saw more people from eastern and southern states. Those customers filled the gaps left by a lack of people with Ikon passes.

This is good - the resort is bringing in money from out-of-state. These are probably people who will spend more not only on the their lift tickets but also on food, retail, lodging, lessons, etc.

I don't have the actual number here, but I remember someone posting something that as many as 75% of Ikon Passes sold are Base passes. That's really good news for the resorts with Base pass blackouts, because as @Ron has experienced, it keeps crowds down during the peak times, and helps bring crowds in during off-peak times. I wouldn't be surprised if Ikon is continually evaluating which days to blackout in conjunction with their partners. I have nothing to back this up, but I wouldn't be surprised if there are more blackout dates in the future.

This goes back to the Ikon Lightning Rod thread, but if Ikon is in fact driving more traffic to specific partner resorts than they can handle, that presents a compelling argument to raise the price of the Ikon Pass, OR add more blackouts to the Base pass and create more differentiation between the Base and normal Ikon Passes. Maybe the normal Ikon Pass becomes a truly premium pass, and less of an Epic Pass competitor? This forum is in no way a representative slice of all of the skiers out there, but it's feeling more and more like there's an appetite for a better experience (less crowding) even if that experience costs more. As @Muleski has suggested, Alterra has bigger ambitions than merely trying to mimic Vail and their pass product. The Ikon Pass is merely one step in a series of steps to increase the valuation of the company in preparation for an acquisition or IPO. Both Alterra and Ikon are in their infancy, and I'm curious to see what happens next.
 

HardDaysNight

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The prices are as insane as the logic behind buying them!

Why wait to buy at the window? Would you buy your airlines tickets at the airport counter or get a hotel room at the front desk the night of? Would you wait to buy tickets to a popular sporting event until the day of the event?

Be it via passes, multi-day packages, on-line discount pricing or other alternatives (buddy passes), paying straight-up window prices seems like the last thing one would want to do.

During the Christmas holidays non season pass holders could buy day passes at PCMR on line instead of paying through the nose at the window. Cost was a mere $169/day instead of the outrageous $179 per. As far as I’m aware there are no meaningfully discounted deals for Vail resorts.

$199 for Steamboat! Tulip mania comes to mind.
 

LKLA

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During the Christmas holidays non season pass holders could buy day passes at PCMR on line instead of paying through the nose at the window. Cost was a mere $169/day instead of the outrageous $179 per. As far as I’m aware there are no meaningfully discounted deals for Vail resorts.

$199 for Steamboat! Tulip mania comes to mind.

Did you say DURING THE CHRISTMAS HOLIDAYS?!?! I bet hotels and airlines and restaurants offer huge discounts during that time. AirBnB must be having a fire sale during the Christmas holidays

Stowe ticket for a random day - Friday March 8th - is $99 on their website. That is 35% off the window ticket price for that day (and that is surely not the best deal).
 

HardDaysNight

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Did you say DURING THE CHRISTMAS HOLIDAYS?!?! I bet hotels and airlines and restaurants offer huge discounts during that time. AirBnB must be having a fire sale during the Christmas holidays

Stowe ticket for a random day - Friday March 8th - is $99 on their website. That is 35% off the window ticket price for that day (and that is surely not the best deal).

Yes, you have a point. The window price at PCMR today remains $179. But you can now buy online for the bargain of $166, rather than $169! If you’d like to buy a ticket now for late March it’s only $139.

Leaving aside the idiotic mantra, “oh well that’s what people are prepared to pay”, do you think that this kind of gouging is a good idea for the long term health of the industry?
 

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