Foot flare/leg length/heel shim/cant

[Matti]

Hello,
I am a Mammoth ski patroller of 11 years and have been struggling with finding a fix for my imbalance. Resources are limited in this area and it’s been hard to get solid answers...

Problem: my right leg reached a point of feeling almost useless while skiing. It was hard to impossible to tip the right ski on its inside edge. Every left turn feels as though my right ankle is rolling outwards (downhill), and the right foot is not in the same linear plane as the right ski.

Here is what I’ve tried: I stated with shimming the inside cuff with folded trail maps and duct tape. I’ve had the right navicular and medial right ankle punched to help me feel like I can roll the ankle inward. I now am shimming my right heel as the chiropractor thinks I may have a leg length difference (working on getting X-rays). The 7mm heel shim has made me feel the most capeable of using my right leg, however it is definitely still not neutral. These symptoms are all obviously exaggerated with wide skis on firm snow. Now my right knee has started to hurt and my back goes out. I can’t help but think it’s all related.

Any help for what to do with the right boot would be greatly appreciated! I spend almost as much time in boots as out of boots so it will make a huge difference. Thank you in advance

 

[Rod9301]

Leg length discrepancy doesn't matter to much.
When you are turning, one leg is straight, while the other is bent. So you can imagine the an inch or two would not make that much of a difference.

 

[AmyPJ]

What HAVE you had done by a boot fitter? Canting? Alignment?

And there are those who would argue that a leg length discrepancy absolutely makes a difference.

I have what sound like similar issues with my right foot/leg. In addition to having a torn MCL in that leg, I have found that much of it comes from my hips and shoulders. I have to work very hard to keep my pelvis from over-rotating on left turns (still a massive work in progress.) I have to really focus on what my glutes and hamstrings are doing on left turns. I have to focus really hard on keeping my right leg pulled back during left hand turns.

 

[CalG]

Matti

Not that it is of any help, but I have had similar 'difficulties' for years as well. (18 years of patrol work)

that is:
"Problem: Every left turn feels as though my right ankle is rolling outwards (downhill), and the right foot is not in the same linear plane as the right ski."

Your observations may be just what I might need! That is, I need a bit more space around the medial maleolus. That spot is always red (or white) when the boot and sock come off. And that over quite an assortment of boots. But ALWAYS the same spot on my ankle.
I've brought up the 'rolling ankle sensation' issue with a boot fitter who looked at alignment and called it all good. I may have not been able to explain the issue clearly.

This sort of sensation can be a real problem when hauling a 240# patient down a steep section. ;-)

 

[Erik Timmerman]

Have yo done canting on the bottom of the boot?

 

[CalG]

Have yo done canting on the bottom of the boot?

Which way? Match or counter? I've thought hard, and tried both "The warren Witherell way" with tape.

 

[Erik Timmerman]

For the OP I'd do it on the AFD under the big toe.

 

[Average Joe]

That such different feelings exist in your left vs right turns should lead one to look first at the bigger picture.
Warren Witherell was also adamant that canting was last, not first.
I'd first get evaluated by a good trainer and/or pedorthist who is skilled at identifying skeletal issues such as leg length discrepancies. For leg length, a large caliper level on the hips is sometimes used, others with different training measure or adjust by eye. I need a 5mm correction in my left boot, after the modifications, the improvements were immediate.
Canting is done after footbeds, height, fore and aft, and cuff alignment. Done first, without addressing what is possibly the cause, the modifications often are backwards.

 

[Average Joe]

Leg length discrepancy doesn't matter to much.
When you are turning, one leg is straight, while the other is bent. So you can imagine the an inch or two would not make that much of a difference.

I disagree. I have a 15mm discrepancy in my leg length. Corrections added to my shoe orthotics eliminated 20 years of lower back pain, and in my ski boots, a 5 mm lift outside, and a 3mm lift inside, led to immediate improvements.

For me, the difference was more in the transitions than the apex of the turn. Before correction, I believe that the start of each turn had been compromised, probably because the brain couldn't process the causes or needed adjustments, so it compromised both turns.Likely a more defensive stance.
It's overly simplistic to believe that we are always on one long leg or the other, despite terrain differences.

Small changes to alignment can yield huge improvements.

 

[Rod9301]

I disagree. I have a 15mm discrepancy in my leg length. Corrections added to my shoe orthotics eliminated 20 years of lower back pain, and in my ski boots, a 5 mm lift outside, and a 3mm lift inside, led to immediate improvements.

For me, the difference was more in the transitions than the apex of the turn. Before correction, I believe that the start of each turn had been compromised, probably because the brain couldn't process the causes or needed adjustments, so it compromised both turns.Likely a more defensive stance.
It's overly simplistic to believe that we are always on one long leg or the other, despite terrain differences.

Small changes to alignment can yield huge improvements.

I believe that leg left discrepancies makea difference in walking and biking.

I have this myself and in mountain biking, i put a thicker insole in one shoe and it makes a difference. Otherwise, my shorter leg hamstring gets stretched too much.

But i don't see how it affects skiing, even in a transition. Perhaps you could explain

 

[Matti]

Wow I am overwhelmed by the responses. To try to answer all the questions:

I have spent many many hours, or maybe days now of my life at the local bootfitter. I’d say they are above average but not so much so as to be able to decipher the subtleties of such an issue. I have not adjusted the cuffs or canted the soles. All I have done is add the 7mm heel lift and it has helped some. I have always skied zip fits or other cork style plug liners, and custom superfeet.
For what it’s worth my bike shoes are also a source of frustration and I am constantly adjusting the cleats to try to keep things even, which I have also never achieved.

 

[Average Joe]

I believe that leg left discrepancies makea difference in walking and biking.

I have this myself and in mountain biking, i put a thicker insole in one shoe and it makes a difference. Otherwise, my shorter leg hamstring gets stretched too much.

But i don't see how it affects skiing, even in a transition. Perhaps you could explain

I think you just answered your own question. Your stance is compromised on one side by the body reacting and compensating.
Without realizing it, I'd guess that while biking, your short side compensated with changes in it's movements. Your pelvis may have tilted down towards the short side, dragged downwards perhaps?
On snow, we work to level our pelvis and match angles for a predictable outcome of each turn. It's equally important in walking, running, bicycling, skiing, skating.....

in my situation, compensating my stance on one side ended up "dragging down" my stance on the other side, it's just that I didn't know it had been happening until after the corrective work was done.