Are light materials helpful for beginner?

[mister moose]

The only Manhattan attraction still hold my interest is the theater district.

I keep hearing about the pizza.

 

[Philpug]

The only Manhattan attraction still hold my interest is the theater district.

The delis are still good.

 

[KingGrump]

I keep hearing about the pizza.

More bad than good. The oil dripping foldable thin crust with real cheese from the '70's is much harder to find nowadays. Anyway, not really a pizza person.

The delis are still good.

Lots of the salumeria (pork stores) and good Jewish delis are long gone. Still few left. Probably more down in Brooklyn and outer Queens than Manhattan. Lots more of other interesting ethnic food though.

 

[Wilhelmson]

We take our kids to NYC in the summer to check out the city. They like the change of pace. I like the noise and walking far. Dont stay out that late anymore. Its always changing there. It was actually more fun post lockdown last year. Its just a place to go.

I was looking for delis… not much

 

[Swede]

When you ski, weight has no real impact on the performance. If you are going to hike/carry your gear a long way, it has a big impact.
I'd imagine for jumping, big air kind of stuff, doing tricks, also a big difference. But for skiing on the snow, turning, carving, skidding ... not a big deal, if any at all.
Now, most skis that are high performance also do weigh quite a lot due to the materials and the construction, but they are not high performance because of their weight. Weight is just a consequence of high end materials and construction. There has been a lot of experimenting with lighter material, not really to enhance performance, but because people seem to like lighter skis. They sell better. But full wood core, glue, some fiber glass, rubber and two layers of metal is still the rule of thumb. It's not light.

 

[Wilhelmson]

When you ski, weight has no real impact on the performance. If you are going to hike/carry your gear a long way, it has a big impact.
I'd imagine for jumping, big air kind of stuff, doing tricks, also a big difference. But for skiing on the snow, turning, carving, skidding ... not a big deal, if any at all.
Now, most skis that are high performance also do weigh quite a lot due to the materials and the construction, but they are not high performance because of their weight. Weight is just a consequence of high end materials and construction. There has been a lot of experimenting with lighter material, not really to enhance performance, but because people seem to like lighter skis. They sell better. But full wood core, glue, some fiber glass, rubber and two layers of metal is still the rule of thumb. It's not light.

So with optimal technique, 20 pound skis would be better or worse for skiing moguls?

 

[Swede]

So with optimal technique, 20 pound skis would be better or worse for skiing moguls?

With lead core. Soft flex but very heavy.

 

[Wilhelmson]

Really what I am getting at here and there is that we seem to drift into a “you’re not skilled or experienced enough for good skis”, perhaps forgetting that the thread was titled

Are light materials helpful for beginner?​

To which the general response was no, although I do question whether the responses were more of a tail wagging than thoughtful. Which leads up to a follow up question- why is rental gear so darn heavy?

 

[geepers]

why is rental gear so darn heavy?

Rental bindings?

 

[Swede]

Really what I am getting at here and there is that we seem to drift into a “you’re not skilled or experienced enough for good skis”, perhaps forgetting that the thread was titled

Are light materials helpful for beginner?​

To which the general response was no, although I do question whether the responses were more of a tail wagging than thoughtful. Which leads up to a follow up question- why is rental gear so darn heavy?

My daughter learned to ski on an Elan RCX plate. Heavy as f**k. She did very ok. So I don’t think light is nessecarily better or easier for normal piste skiing.

 

[MikeHunt]

Heavy boots and skis are heavy when one is just standing on a flat surface or going uphill.

They get lighter once you are moving downhill. The downward trajectory and momentum will further assist taking the boots and skis downhill.

If you take off your boots and skis and click them together and leave them on a downward slope, they will go down the mountain by themselves. Check out 11 seconds in this video.



With the assistance of your body, the boots and skis will go even faster downhill, given the right technique.

 

[Wilhelmson]

My daughter learned to ski on an Elan RCX plate. Heavy as f**k. She did very ok. So I don’t think light is nessecarily better or easier for normal piste skiing.

Hey it worked for us forget about it.

 

[cantunamunch]

Rental bindings?

+ "durable" build skis + loose boots that make the entire thing more difficult to control.

 

[Tony Storaro]

So with optimal technique, 20 pound skis would be better or worse for skiing moguls?

He mentioned “doing tricks” tho, didn’t he?

 

[Tony Storaro]

Really what I am getting at here and there is that we seem to drift into a “you’re not skilled or experienced enough for good skis”, perhaps forgetting that the thread was titled

Are light materials helpful for beginner?​

To which the general response was no, although I do question whether the responses were more of a tail wagging than thoughtful. Which leads up to a follow up question- why is rental gear so darn heavy?

Because lightweight gear is not good for people who rent gear?

 

[Tony Storaro]

+ "durable" build skis + loose boots that make the entire thing more difficult to control.

Beginners have to understand one thing: the ski is a vehicle you need to learn to drive. They are not skates, they are a train. You are not supposed to lift the train, or the motorcycle, you learn how to navigate the mountain on them. No lifting of feet, no forcing them to go left or right, it is your body that has to move, not the ski. This is the tricky part-to learn how to move with the ski, not how to move the ski.

 

[geepers]

loose boots

Loose boots make a ski heavier? 'Cause the question was 'why is rental gear so darn heavy?'

OTOH your points are perfectly valid if the question was 'what makes rental skis suck (typically)?' And you may have added 'lamentable state of tune - probably last done 3 seasons ago if ever' to the list.

Because lightweight gear is not good for people who rent gear?

The skis that are good for a beginner are the skis they wearing when they decide skiing is great fun and want to do more. Which may be any one of a number of things depending on the beginner and the conditions at the time. Light, heavy, narrow, wide.... What you would like may not suit an other.

 

[Tony Storaro]

Loose boots make a ski heavier? 'Cause the question was 'why is rental gear so darn heavy?'

OTOH your points are perfectly valid if the question was 'what makes rental skis suck (typically)?' And you may have added 'lamentable state of tune - probably last done 3 seasons ago if ever' to the list.



The skis that are good for a beginner are the skis they wearing when they decide skiing is great fun and want to do more. Which may be any one of a number of things depending on the beginner and the conditions at the time. Light, heavy, narrow, wide.... What you would like may not suit an other.

No beginner as in beginner has ever said: Skiing is great fun tho. You will hear all kinds of descriptions of skiing, none of which will include fun.

The enjoyment part comes considerably later.

 

[Swede]

Hey it worked for us forget about it.

Works for anyone who is willing to try. Many of the lighter skis with foam core and what not, might be easier to handle for someone who twitch, push and jerk around—not uncommon for beginners. A woodcore construction with a nice flex and some torsional rigidity will be heavier and perhaps seem ”clumsy” when forced or pushed around. A light ski will be more compliant of such ”techniques”. If the skier in question don’t have any ambitions to learn how to ski and just want to ”get down”, sure go with a light ski. It will probably be fine.
But if a beginner wants to learn, the lighter skis will be worse as they encourage bad sking and do not award correct technique with the stability, grip and control of a full woodcore ski.

 

[Cheizz]

@paulsalzburg to all of the questions you have asked here recently (about radius, weight of material, etc.) I would say:

Rent some different skis and boots (with different radii, different waist widths, lighter skis, heavier skies, lighter boots, heavier boots etc.) and work out for yourself a. whether it makes a difference, and b. what YOU actually prefer.

Keep in mind that what you prefer right now (at your current level) may be different in a few trips time, or when you've had some lessons. That would be my second piece of advice: get some lessons in first, and once you've developed an actual style and preference, go shopping.