Pacific NW/AK/BC Why close lifts due to cold? We dress for it....

[mcpowell]

From Whistler’s Twitter feed:
“#WBOps Alpine lifts are closed for the day due to cold temperatures. This includes 7th Heaven Express, Glacier Express, Showcase T-Bar, Symphony Express, Harmony 6 Express & Peak Express.”

I’m not trying to turn this in to a VRI flaming thread, I’m just wondering why WB is closing the alpine area when it seems like the temperatures they are experiencing are common for other ski resorts. I’ve skied Vail at -15 degrees F, and I don’t remember them closing any lifts due to cold.

Is this a “Canada” thing? Is there some wind that isn’t in the forecast?

 

[CalG]

Sometimes, exposure is a risk to the lift operators. 'Can't run without them, and a frost bite claim can put a pinch in all operations.

Also, cold can effect equipment (bearings etc.) There are usually a stack of good reasons to not operate certain areas of the mountain. But only one is used to announce the status. NO SKI AREA tries to close terrain or lift access. Happy customers spend more! Well, until the final week of the season anyway.

 

[Beartown]

I was at SS/LL this past week and SS didn't open at all Sunday or Monday. LL was open, but only had the gondola and Grizzly chair open. I asked ski patrol, and they said if a lift broke and people required rescue that there could be potentially fatal consequences of being exposed that long. Temps were -28F in the mornings at least. Norquay couldn't get the Cascade lift motor started on Monday morning. Opened about 40 minutes late. My main complaint wasn't lift closures, but how hard it was to find out that the majority/all of the lifts would be closed. Conditions hotlines, Facebook/Instagram/Twitter, etc were pretty cagey about that info. I suppose they don't want to drive customers away, but it sucks to have to drive all the way to a resort to get that info.

 

[headybrew]

Not sure about everyone else but I do not dress for sitting around in freezing weather, I dress for a high output cardio workout. When the temps are in the 20's I am often wearing nothing more than boxer briefs and a long sleeve t-shirt under my shell's and would be in a heap of trouble even at 25 degrees if I had to wait 2 hours for rescue...

 

[mcpowell]

Not sure about everyone else but I do not dress for sitting around in freezing weather, I dress for a high output cardio workout. When the temps are in the 20's I am often wearing nothing more than boxer briefs and a long sleeve t-shirt under my shell's and would be in a heap of trouble even at 25 degrees if I had to wait 2 hours for rescue...

Interesting. I may be overdressing. I usually dress to what I estimate will be a “little cool” on the morning lift, and then I open vents to cool off as my work rate increases.

But then again, I’d rather be a little warm than a little cold when on the mountain.

 

[KingGrump]

I dress for a high output cardio workout.

Are we still talking about DOWNHILL skiing?

 

[Sibhusky]

Since last Sunday, it has been well below zero many days, rising to I think 7 one day. The days they had restricted operations were the days that the wind chill was minus 40 to minus 50. Both days chair one was closed, as I predict it will be tomorrow. And guess what? Other chairs closed down during the day with problems the day the main lift was closed, proving that there was a good reason to not run chair one. The days chair one was operating were pretty scanty traffic-wise any way. Now today (I had a migraine, darn it) the fresh snow (knee to hip deep) brought out a lot more people, but nothing like a typical powder Friday as far as I could tell looking at the web cams. @Fuller should report.

Tomorrow's forecast below. They will not be running many lifts, I am sure.


I am dressing with two layers of long underwear, a turtleneck, a down liner and a shell, two face masks, helmet, mittens, liners. On the days that were -3 and +4 with mild wind I was fine. High winds? Forget it. Would need another layer. And I have been out in that as they didn't used to close the lifts. But supposedly because of worrying about the lifties they no longer do. I'm sure that part of the issue, tho, was lack of skiers. Yes, they end up inside when they come, but they are not going to do that day after day. They'll just go shopping in town. Plus they've already had one lift evacuation this year.

 

[Ogg]

Not sure about everyone else but I do not dress for sitting around in freezing weather, I dress for a high output cardio workout. When the temps are in the 20's I am often wearing nothing more than boxer briefs and a long sleeve t-shirt under my shell's and would be in a heap of trouble even at 25 degrees if I had to wait 2 hours for rescue...

I don't dress quite that light but usually all I wear under my shell and shell pants is a lightweight base layer and a light fleece top down to about 15F. Below that or if it's a firm day with a lot of fast groomers I may put on warmer bottoms and a gaiter.

 

[François Pugh]

Not a Canada thing. I've patrolled in -45 C wind chill. They won't run the lifts if it is below -30 C -22F, not counting wind chill at one hill here.
We do have labour laws about unsafe work conditions. Just say'n.

 

[Fuller]

Upper mountain closed today (-20 temps, 35mph wind gusts). I'm crazy about skiing but I don't want any part of that. But I'm OK with it as we had thigh deep powder and a mellow crowd scene yesterday. One of the top 3 days I can remember here in my 5 year history. I didn't see my skis all day!

Last Wednesday it was about 0 degrees with a moderate wind blowing right down the lift line. We were in men's group lesson and a couple of us had white noses when we got to the top. We took 2 10 minute warm up breaks that day. So that's right at the safety limit for me.

So yeah, frostbite is a real thing and it ain't worth it for the extra runs you are getting.

re: High cardio output for downhill skiing? For very a short period maybe, then a 7 minute cool down. My VO2 max drops way down in ski season and I have to really work to get it back for triathlon.

 

[Fuller]

Whitefish Update:

All chairs closed today. Two weekends in a row, it must be killing them to lose the revenue but only a fool would be skiing today (and I'm a skiing fool).

 

[Sibhusky]

Full snow report, for those who enjoy them::

8:30 SPECIAL NOTICE: All Chairs will be closed today. The Base Lodge and Ed & Mully's will be open. Again, this is decision is based on the extreme conditions on the upper and lower mountain. Rest those legs up, hibernate for the day and get ready for tomorrow. With all this blowing snow, new snow, and snow from the trees, Sunday's going to be another great powder day!

7:15 Update: Chairs 1, 8, 7, 11, 5, and the T-Bar will not open today. Check back for possible closures on the frontside/lower mountain lifts. These conditions are not meant for humans or even a Yeti for the matter...

6:00 a.m. Report: Dispatch from the Rebel Base on Hoth... It's a full-on blizzard up here. Temperatures are in the negatives across the mountain and we're looking at a high of -9 for the summit today and a wind chill factor as low as -52 with sustained winds at 33 mph. Chair 1 (as well as all the lifts it services) will likely close today. While we'd like to have all normal chairs running, safety is our first concern. Check back with the Snow Report around 7:45 a.m. this morning for updated info on closures and conditions.

Please note that widespread blowing snow is likely playing with today's reported new snow and settled base numbers. Trails are being covered almost immediately after being groomed. Dry snow in the trees is being whipped off and adding to new snow totals. Depths across the mountain will vary widely.

Special Note: Night Skiing for this evening has been canceled due to the low temps, sustained winds and wind chill factors. Today's kids' programs are canceled due to weather as well. Group and Private Lessons will be available. Sunday kids' programs are still scheduled at this time, however we will update this report and contact parents if conditions change.

The Whitefish Whiteout Race has been postponed to February 23rd due to the extremely cold temperatures and will chill as well.

 

[pause]

In my experience, temps that ski areas will close for varies widely, especially since most areas see below -20F infrequently.

However, a good example to consider is the local ski areas around Fairbanks, AK. Fairbanks is one of the coldest cities on the planet and Skiland is the farthest north ski area in North America. The locals there are hardy, to say the least, with temps in town plunging to -50F nearly every winter and -30s are treated like an ordinary day. However, Skiland and Moose Mountain close at -20F ambient. Even with people used to living daily in colder temps (and almost no skiers from out of town) the risk of serious cold injuries if something bad happens—broken/stalled lift (yep, it’s happened there), a bad fall requiring ski patrol evac, etc...— is too great for them to operate.

After two winters skiing nearly every weekend up there, I agree with them. -20F ambient is a pretty thin safety margin and generally as cold as I will ski, both alpine and cross country.

There are a lot more “it depends” if you start adding wind chill temps into the equation.