When to go Fat?

[s15199d]

How much fresh do you want on the ground before switching to a fat ski?

Last year I skiied the 170 Volkl Kendo (90mm waist) in CO and UT and I was a big fan (almost bought a pair). But, a guy convinced me to try some Blizzard Brahmas before I buy (88mm waist). And looking now, I like what I'm reading about the the Volkl Mantras (96mm waist). I'm headed to Big Sky in a couple of weeks and the long range forecast (for what that's worth) is calling for up to 8" freshies one day. Wanted to try the Brahmas on this trip, but afraid that won't be enough ski. Thinking maybe Mantras, but on the flipside I'm afraid that might be too much ski if the snow doesn't come in.

I'm advanced/intermediate ski level. Emphasis on the intermediate. I tend towards shorter sliding pivot turns. Mostly on piste, but my buddies are a bit more adventurous and I'll follow them off piste some.

 

[Josh Matta]

the brahma will work fine in 8 inches of probably light dry montana powder. With out knowing how much you weight(way more important than your height) I wouldnt know the proper length.

I personally go fat when I can float on the surface but will go back skinner if no float is available. I have skied my 88mm brahma in 12+ inches of dry powder but have skied my 128mm renegades on an uncrowded wet slop day with 3-4 inch of mush with a rain crust. Also length of the skis, and skills, tactic play a way more important rule in what skis will work and what will be most fun. With the proper skills+tactics many more ski will work well but will not always be the most fun.

Also why not learn to ski a round turn, instead of shorter sliding pivot turns? .Those tend to work better everywhere including powder.

 

[Tom K.]

Can you take two pair? An 88 and a 100 should cover you fine at Big Sky. Be ready to glance off at least a few rocks in the challenging terrain.

For me, the steeper the area, the less I need a super-wide ski. At my home base of Mt. Hood Meadows, a fat ski in just 4 inches lets me plane on the more boring pitches that don't get obliterated in the first hour. On trips to Jackson Hole, a decent-planing 100 mm ski is wide enough for me (and less tiring in cut up crud).

 

[s15199d]

Thanks @Josh Matta . I'm a bigger broski 6' 250 at present.

To be honest deep stuff kicks my butt. I'm not the most graceful skier. I'm more cautious than my compatriots. I tend to take more short turns to better control my decent. Which last year, we got some pow at Snowmass and it wore me out. I know it's a function of my ski style. Not seeing my skis and not knowing where the bumps are under the snow I tend to go even more cautious. A couple of inches of fresh no problem. But, the deeper it gets (6-7"+ i'm thinking) that's when it starts to get a lil tougher for me.

 

[cantunamunch]

I'm a bigger broski 6' 250 at present.
. .. But, the deeper it gets (6-7"+ i'm thinking) that's when it starts to get a lil tougher for me.

At your size, on a 170cm Kendo, that is completely predictable. That ski is not even close to fat enough.

The Mantras will not make you happy - again not enough float, but also more tiring when you try to pivot them.

At 250#, which is going to be closer to 270# suited up, float will start at 177cm+ 110mm+ and even then you have to be careful about flex and rocker.

Seriously, you would be much happier on an old Volkl One than on a new Mantra, both in pow and in slush.

 

[s15199d]

Can you take two pair? An 88 and a 100 should cover you fine at Big Sky. Be ready to glance off at least a few rocks in the challenging terrain.

For me, the steeper the area, the less I need a super-wide ski. At my home base of Mt. Hood Meadows, a fat ski in just 4 inches lets me plane on the more boring pitches that don't get obliterated in the first hour. On trips to Jackson Hole, a decent-planing 100 mm ski is wide enough for me (and less tiring in cut up crud).

@Tom K. we rent our skis through BlackTie. They'll swap out skis for fat skis if we want, but we'll only have 1 pair at a time.

 

[Josh Matta]

Thanks @Josh Matta . I'm a bigger broski 6' 250 at present.

To be honest deep stuff kicks my butt. I'm not the most graceful skier. I'm more cautious than my compatriots. I tend to take more short turns to better control my decent. Which last year, we got some pow at Snowmass and it wore me out. I know it's a function of my ski style. Not seeing my skis and not knowing where the bumps are under the snow I tend to go even more cautious. A couple of inches of fresh no problem. But, the deeper it gets (6-7"+ i'm thinking) that's when it starts to get a lil tougher for me.

yeah so you need a much longer ski, and you need the skills to drive it, so it may be a catch 22..

Short turns are fine they need to be round and offensive, though and not skidded and sideways.

I am not as big as you but at 200lb to truly float I normally need at least 185cm that is 100mm underfoot with a healthy dose of tip rocker.

If its case that you on the bottom and hitting bumps and narrow skis will be better. Most places out west have drier enough snow most of the the time that float doesnt really come into play.

 

[markojp]

Going to go out on a limb here, but for the OP and his stated skill set/ turn shape and size preference, a 188 Soul 7 would work great for a pow ski.

 

[Winks]

I ski a 100+ waist as a daily and that usually covers everything up to a foot of snow, anything over the bigger sticks are definitely coming out. As mentioned earlier, whenever the terrain starts feeling floaty the larger skis come out.
Also having a roofbox with 4-6 options helps

*Start with the largest ski and work your way down based on the changing conditions

 

[Marker]

I'm a 6'6", 230 lb intermediate working to round out my turns. I ski a Ranger 115 Xti in 188 cm to get float. I'll admit a Ranger 102 FR, Soul or Super 7 might better fit my current skill set, but I aspire to that higher level. In really deep eastern crud, the Rangers are a machine! Since it sounds you can swap and demo skis, just give those recommended here a try and report back.

 

[Winks]

I'm a 6'6", 230 lb intermediate working to round out my turns. I ski a Ranger 115 Xti in 188 cm to get float. I'll admit a Ranger 102 FR, Soul or Super 7 might better fit my current skill set, but I aspire to that higher level. In really deep eastern crud, the Rangers are a machine! Since it sounds you can swap and demo skis, just give those recommended here a try and report back.

Rangers!!

 

[s15199d]

So sounds like I need a longer wider ski if it gets deepish. Trying to find a fat ski that likes to turn...any thoughts on the Blizzard Rustler 11's?

And though this thread is titled about when to go Fat...you guys know so much...what would you recommend for my ski style on a not so deep day?

 

[markojp]

Rustler 11 would be fun.

 

[Henry]

"I tend towards shorter sliding pivot turns. "
"To be honest deep stuff kicks my butt. "

It's really hard to slide the skis around when they are down in the snow. In this case rent the widest they have for the 8" day. You'll be more on the surface and more able to skid the skis around.

You get flotation from wide skis, long skis, fast speed. You get skiing control partly from skis with a flex pattern that suits the type of snow. The longest skis in a model line are the stiffest with the least flexibility--which don't work as well for someone who makes tight turns and likes slower speeds. But, you're a big guy.

So...maybe the next-to-longest in the widest skis they offer for that 8" day? (And learn to roll your skis up on edge so they turn you. Picture an airplane banking in its turn in the sky. Now picture your skis on edge down in the snow curving you around a turn.) (Is curving a word?)

Get the feel of the tempo the snow allows you to move. Continuing a turn a bit uphill for speed control will be smoother than jamming in another short turn. Get the feel of where the skis want you to balance over them. You do not want to sit back on the skis. On an easy straight section in deep snow ski straight. Push your feet a couple of inches ahead and feel how the skis like that position. Pull your feet a couple of inches back under you...how do the skis perform in that balance position? Find the place those skis perform best for you. Note the feel of your shin against the boot cuff. That's the sweet spot for those skis. Return to it. Now--ski with your feet and just balance over your skis. If you're sitting back or doing other things that work really poorly, stop, take a couple of deep breaths, re-balance, and ski on.

 

[James]

"When to go Fat?"
- When you're tired of eating seeds and berries.

 

[cantunamunch]

In re @Josh Matta 's point about skidding and sideways and @Henry's point about smoothing instead of jamming:

Jammed, skidding, sideways turns trigger far more snowslides than smooth rounded ones. This becomes quite important when skiing not-too-steep terrain with weak snow layers (*cough*Colorado*cough*), and when skiing between tree wells.

 

[Prosper]

If you get 6+ inches of new snow, get the mid 100mm-115mm skis and consider taking a lesson that day. Tell the instructor what you struggle with and what you'd like to work on, much like what you posted above. Hopefully you'll get a fully certified instructor, small group, have a fun time and come away with a few things to continue working on to improve your skiing. An added benefit is you'll get to cut lift lines on a powder day.

 

[Ogg]

Around the holidays?

 

[cantunamunch]

Around the holidays?

.........

 

[EricG]

Don’t forget that if your not used to a fat ski, they can get tiring if you try to man handle them into short quick turns. I’m trying to develop the patience for wider skis, but we just haven't had the quality snow back East this year to practice. The one decent day we had I rolled on my 108’s and just had to be patient and let the skis do their thing. When I was patient they were awesome, when I got frustrated or nervous they were tiring.