What is the right number of speeds?

[Erik Timmerman]

So many options now!

For the last few years it has basically been 10 and 11. Now SRAM has Eagle 12, and for a while they have had a 7-speed DH group which has it's own merits. Shimano is up to 12, and still uses 10 for it's DH group (which while being a great group is long over due for an update).

New entries:

Box components - wide range 9-speed

Rotor - hydraulically shifted 13 speed!

TRP - 7 spd DH group

I'm perfectly happy with 11 speed Shimano, but would like to try their 12. What about you?

 

[Tom K.]

I was perfectly happy with 11, but as age advances, I've come to (mostly) love the Eagle 12 speed. I suspect Shimano's shifting performance will be better, but the need for yet another driver prevents me from going that direction.

I use the "mostly" qualifier on Eagle due to the occasion crap shift from 3 to 2, caused by 2 and 1 using wide/narrow profiles. If the shift mis-times by half a link, it has to clunk into place. So inelegant!

 

[Erik Timmerman]

I have a hard time fathoming the use of a 50 or 51 tooth cog. I rarely use my 40 because you just go so slow. If it's that steep that I'd need a 50, I feel like the struggle for traction and balance (not doing wheelie) would be a real problem. When I hear of them paired with a 30 or even a 28t chainring, I wonder what is going on. Could make sense at a high altitude Moab, no air, and unlimited grip. If I did a big trip to the Alps or some such place I'd definitely like to have the option of a real "bail out" gear.

 

[Philpug]

For me it is the spacing more than the numbers, I was just as happy with the Shimano 12 on last years verison of my Trigger as with this years 12 speed Shram. I do use my 52 (I think it's that) small cog but I will have to see how different that is from the largest on the Shimano when taking the front chain ring into account for both bikes.

 

[luliski]

I’m going from a 9 speed to a 12 speed. I went down to a 30 t front ring on my 9 speed (46 t largest cog in back). Having lower gearing let’s me do longer rides, with more climbing, with less fatigue. If climbs are technical, I really like the lower gearing that usually comes with 12 speeds.

 

[Josh Matta]

I am seriously considering if I build my next bike to just run a 11-40 10 speed cassette. I just installed one on Diane's bike and it cost 50 dollars and weighs less than a 200 dollar sram 11 speed cassette. Shifts smooth as well.

not to mention you can find SLX/XT level 10 speed rear derail and shifter for like 50 dollars.....I d rather spend money on Suspension/wheels, IMO they matter much more with how a bike ride than with how many gears on it. I

I do think on 29er especially with 2.5+ tires lower gears can help more.

BTW that Box group reviewed by Pinkbike had pricing way off. IMO I wish box would come out with some 10 speed stuff because I have more 10 speed chains laying around.....I havent run 9 speed since the 00s.

 

[Erik Timmerman]

Josh I have a mint 10 spd XTR drivetrain I'd sell you

 

[Josh Matta]

I dont have a frame to put on yet I am also not sure if XTR can take the 40/42 10 speed cassette.

 

[martyg]

I have a hard time fathoming the use of a 50 or 51 tooth cog. I rarely use my 40 because you just go so slow. If it's that steep that I'd need a 50, I feel like the struggle for traction and balance (not doing wheelie) would be a real problem. When I hear of them paired with a 30 or even a 28t chainring, I wonder what is going on. Could make sense at a high altitude Moab, no air, and unlimited grip. If I did a big trip to the Alps or some such place I'd definitely like to have the option of a real "bail out" gear.

Moab isn't high, as far as mtn bike destinations.

I'm all about my 51 on certain days. Today's training objective, for example, is an easy 3 hour ride w / HR not exceeding 140. With a 51 I can achieve those training objectives (and right now I am just procrastinating getting on the bike). Race something like the Breck Epic, and you'll be all about a 51.

Dialing in your most efficient tire pressure with a roll down test will go a long way towards better traction. As far as balance, that is a learned skill. Today, for example, I will go up technical sections as slow as possible to make them an exercise in intentional, focused, movements. If you are popping wheelies... lower your chest to the bars.

Overall, the more gears the better. As Wayne Stetina said, a 1X is biomechanically useless for sustained climbing. With a 12 speed, those jumps between gears are decreasing in size for me, so I am realizing better efficiencies. A 12 speed is getting close to my ideal, which is is a Di2 2X Syncro.

 

[Erik Timmerman]

I've never ridden with a HR (well, I did once), but I think I'd be too impatient to ride below 140 for a whole ride. So with a double, what is your lowest gear? How slow are you going with that? 1.5 mph? If I ride a 34/40, I think my speed is something like 3 mph! I've got places to be!

 

[Erik Timmerman]

Oh, and btw, this is one more reason why I like Shimano. They give MartyG the choice to run a double if he wants to.

 

[Josh Matta]

Moab isn't high, as far as mtn bike destinations.

I'm all about my 51 on certain days. Today's training objective, for example, is an easy 3 hour ride w / HR not exceeding 140. With a 51 I can achieve those training objectives (and right now I am just procrastinating getting on the bike). Race something like the Breck Epic, and you'll be all about a 51.

Dialing in your most efficient tire pressure with a roll down test will go a long way towards better traction. As far as balance, that is a learned skill. Today, for example, I will go up technical sections as slow as possible to make them an exercise in intentional, focused, movements. If you are popping wheelies... lower your chest to the bars.

Overall, the more gears the better. As Wayne Stetina said, a 1X is biomechanically useless for sustained climbing. With a 12 speed, those jumps between gears are decreasing in size for me, so I am realizing better efficiencies. A 12 speed is getting close to my ideal, which is is a Di2 2X Syncro.

I have friends who race the breck epic on 34 x 21 29er single speeds.....

 

[martyg]

I have friends who race the breck epic on 34 x 21 29er single speeds.....

Yeap. But being hard wired as a sprinter, it will never be me.

 

[4ster]

This thread motivated me to count the 50 teeth on the dinner plate of my rear cassette. I am coming from a 2X to 1X12 with a 32 in front. Last fall when I got the bike I rode it up the steepest long hill that I regularly ride to make sure I had an easy enough gear for me.
It passed the test & I have not had any issues since.
I really like the 1X12 gearing and find that every gear is meaningful as opposed to my old 2X.

 

[EricG]

I'm plenty happy with 1x11 XTR (& XT) 11x40 & 11x42, I've tried the 11-46 but I can't stand the shift from 37T to 46T. If Shimano comes out with a 12sp setup I'd probably move over to it when the time comes. I don't do SRAM, we just don't jive, my fat bike has SRAM X01 and I am ready to toss it in the trash.

 

[Doug Briggs]

I have friends who race the breck epic on 34 x 21 29er single speeds.....

Without meaning any disrespect, I'll wager a beer that they are running with their bikes frequently. There is a lot of vertical with lots of steep grades in that race. Running (or walking if not racing) with a SS is kind of part and parcel of SSs, isn't it?

 

[Doug Briggs]

My 5010 is 1x11 with 32x10-42. I find the spacing quite adequate. I'm torn between down sizing the ring to a 30 or 32 (maybe even oval) or upgrading to 1x12 SRAM Eagle. The cost difference is huge: one ring vs a cassette, derailleur and shifter. I'm finding the durability of the chain, despite the narrower width (vs 9 or 10 cogs), quite good. I used to break chains a lot. I think the narrow wide and advances in tech have made the difference. My riding hasn't improved that much.

 

[scott43]

Without meaning any disrespect, I'll wager a beer that they are running with their bikes frequently. There is a lot of vertical with lots of steep grades in that race. Running (or walking if not racing) with a SS is kind of part and parcel of SSs, isn't it?

I've actually seen people riding tandems in XC races..I mean, you can..but...

 

[Josh Matta]

Without meaning any disrespect, I'll wager a beer that they are running with their bikes frequently. There is a lot of vertical with lots of steep grades in that race. Running (or walking if not racing) with a SS is kind of part and parcel of SSs, isn't it?

I have no idea to be honest, I do know that I have done some 100 mile races SS and really was nt walking climbs......about 10k of climbing over 100 miles....

his average speed was over 10 miles per hour most days, its kinda of hard to run with your bike for long periods and still average that.

https://www.strava.com/activities/2624747005

https://www.strava.com/activities/2619282204

so who knows. I also know the same guy just won the SS class Shenandoah 100 in about 8:30.

 

[Josh Matta]

My 5010 is 1x11 with 32x10-42. I find the spacing quite adequate. I'm torn between down sizing the ring to a 30 or 32 (maybe even oval) or upgrading to 1x12 SRAM Eagle. The cost difference is huge: one ring vs a cassette, derailleur and shifter. I'm finding the durability of the chain, despite the narrower width (vs 9 or 10 cogs), quite good. I used to break chains a lot. I think the narrow wide and advances in tech have made the difference. My riding hasn't improved that much.

I think most chainbreak used to occur from front shifts going south, and or the chain popping off the front and then the first hard pedal and smack!!