International (Europe/Japan/Southern Hemisphere) Skiing near Milan?

[Swiss Toni]

If the roads are clear, its less than 2.5 hrs drive to Martigny, in winter you have to use the Grand Saint Bernard tunnel as the pass is closed.

It’s pretty straight-forward to get over to other valleys. Drive to Frachey, and from there take the funicular followed by 2 chairlifts up to the Colle Bettaforca. From there, you can ski down to Staffal. If you want to go over to Alagna, you take 2 gondolas up to the Passo dei Salati. Keep an eye on the wind, if the winds are too strong they have to close the lifts. It’s a long taxi ride from Alagna to Antagnod.

You don’t have to worry about steep black runs, because there aren’t any. This is the black that runs from the Passo dei Salati down to Alagna.

 

[James]

You don’t have to worry about steep black runs, because there aren’t any. This is the black that runs from the Passo dei Salati down to Alagna.

What about the “freeride paradise” in Alagna?

 

[Jwrags]

I've decided that my wife's happiness is more important than my skiing

You are a very smart man! A little slow to figure it out, however, you figured it out

 

[Nola Mike]

So just discovered bormio

Looks like a cool town, thermal spas would be appreciated. Huge vert.

So bormio v antagnod?

 

[JoeSchmoe]

Hopefully this question can add to this thread.

Ignoring high end fine dining, is the food usually better at the Italian mega resorts or at the smaller less touristy ones?

If I ever make it to Italy, I think I'd prefer ma and pa homestyle Italian Alps cooking more than eating at a place that sees a thousand people a day and just cranks out the orders. That said, I've seen a lot of Dolomites trip reports where the food looks fantastic. So I guess the question is... Is the food even better at smaller resorts like Antagod, Alagna, or in the Aosta Valley (or similar)?

Here in North America, any tourist destination is going to have generally underwhelming food unless you really pay through the teeth. This is one reason our gang likes going to SLC... Better food and better prices in the city. It does look like the Dolomites and other mega resorts do a much better job than over here... But again, does it get even better out of the busy ski areas?

 

[JCF]

Oh WOW - that run is going on the list

 

[Cheizz]

Bormio is great. Make sure to actually ski all three parts: Bormio itself (where the Worldcup run is - very much a sporty vibe), San Colombano (the quite bit with local ski clubs and just a very relaxed atmosphere) and Santa Caterina with its glacier-like back bowl.

 

[Nola Mike]

Bormio is great. Make sure to actually ski all three parts: Bormio itself (where the Worldcup run is - very much a sporty vibe), San Colombano (the quite bit with local ski clubs and just a very relaxed atmosphere) and Santa Caterina with its glacier-like back bowl.

View attachment 222917

Have you been to both places?

 

[Cheizz]

Yes I have been to all three parts.

 

[Swiss Toni]

What about the “freeride paradise” in Alagna?

The OP specifically mentioned black runs, the freeride paradise run from the top of the Passo dei Salati - Punta Indren lift down to Gabiet is off piste. In 2021 the Italian parliament passed a new law governing skiing (DECRETO LEGISLATIVO 28 febbraio 2021, n. 40) https://www.gazzettaufficiale.it/eli/id/2021/03/19/21G00047/sg Article 26 Para. 2 states that: Individuals engaged in ski mountaineering or off-piste skiing or hiking activities in snowy environments, including by means of snowshoes, where, due to snow and weather conditions, there is a risk of avalanches, must equip themselves with appropriate electronic signaling and search systems, snow shovel and probe, to ensure appropriate rescue action. I wouldn’t have thought that the OP is planning on bringing avi gear.

Is the food even better at smaller resorts like Antagod, Alagna, or in the Aosta Valley (or similar)?

Not really, there are some good restaurants in the Aosta valley resorts, but in the in general the food tends to be a bit rustic https://aosta-valley.co.uk/discover/food-wine/ The food in the Dolomites is much better.

 

[Cheizz]

The food in the Dolomites is much better.

Agreed. The Aosta Valley is way too close to France for good food.

 

[BLiP]

Edit 2: More interesting info "Tourists may also use their valid American driver’s license if accompanied by an official translation in Italian."

That’s exactly what an international driving permit is. It verifies that you have a valid license and translates it into 10 or so different languages. Very easy and cheap to get. In the US you go to AAA to get one.

 

[Nola Mike]

Yes I have been to all three parts.

I meant champoluc vs. bormio.

The OP specifically mentioned black runs, the freeride paradise run from the top of the Passo dei Salati - Punta Indren lift down to Gabiet is off piste. In 2021 the Italian parliament passed a new law governing skiing (DECRETO LEGISLATIVO 28 febbraio 2021, n. 40) https://www.gazzettaufficiale.it/eli/id/2021/03/19/21G00047/sg Article 26 Para. 2 states that: Individuals engaged in ski mountaineering or off-piste skiing or hiking activities in snowy environments, including by means of snowshoes, where, due to snow and weather conditions, there is a risk of avalanches, must equip themselves with appropriate electronic signaling and search systems, snow shovel and probe, to ensure appropriate rescue action. I wouldn’t have thought that the OP is planning on bringing avi gear.



Not really, there are some good restaurants in the Aosta valley resorts, but in the in general the food tends to be a bit rustic https://aosta-valley.co.uk/discover/food-wine/ The food in the Dolomites is much better.

Definitely not bringing avi gear. I'm not sure what the european definition of "off-piste" is. US there's a definite difference between "out of bounds" skiing and "not groomed/maintained". And I'm certain I'll find some good food. At least it won't be british food.

That’s exactly what an international driving permit is. It verifies that you have a valid license and translates it into 10 or so different languages. Very easy and cheap to get. In the US you go to AAA to get one.

Not quite the same. But yes, I got one and it took about 10 minutes and $20.

 

[dbostedo]

I'm not sure what the european definition of "off-piste" is. US there's a definite difference between "out of bounds" skiing and "not groomed/maintained".

You need to read up on that and understand it.

In Europe, off-piste and out-of-bounds are often the same thing. I.e. anything at all off-piste, not groomed, is out-of-bounds and considered back-country. There are no North American style "resort boundaries". And if you're out-of-bounds/off-piste, you can also need to have bought insurance to pay for any rescue or patrol assistance, or you'll be billed. Others with more familiarity can probably help with particulars on that.

The usual recommendation if you're going off-piste (off the groomers) is to hire a guide (which can be fairly affordable), and have/rent avy gear.

 

[Cheizz]

Yes, I have both skied the Monterosa area and Bormio. Very different places. Champoluc/Monterosa is rougher terrain-wise, with more of a high alpine off-piste adventure vibe. Bormio has more of an Italian sophisticated, perfectly groomed racy vibe. And Bormio is a much nicer town to stay.

 

[Cheizz]

You need to read up on that and understand it.

In Europe, off-piste and out-of-bounds are often the same thing. I.e. anything at all off-piste, not groomed, is out-of-bounds and considered back-country. There are no North American style "resort boundaries". And if you're out-of-bounds/off-piste, you can also need to have bought insurance to pay for any rescue or patrol assistance, or you'll be billed. Others with more familiarity can probably help with particulars on that.

The usual recommendation if you're going off-piste (off the groomers) is to hire a guide (which can be fairly affordable), and have/rent avy gear.

Here are two threads on that difference between America vs Europe when it comes to off-piste skiing:

International (Europe/Japan/Southern Hemisphere) - Powder skiing in Europe versus North America

Seeing as a European powder trip post seeking resort advice is getting side tracked with talk about differences between inbounds powder skiing in North America and off-piste skiing, and we were talking about opening a separate thread, thought I'd open it here. The problem with any post like this...

www.skitalk.com

The Dangers of Skiing Off Piste In Europe

As illustrated by the Jerry of the day. As you can see, he’s not far from the lift and there are other tracks in that area, but there are no warnings above the cliff he flies off. Gotta scope your line before you ski it, bro.

www.skitalk.com

 

[BLiP]

Not quite the same. But yes, I got one and it took about 10 minutes and $20.

From AAA: “Your IDP is a valid form of identification in 150 countries worldwide and contains your name, photo and driver information. It translates your identification information into 10 languages — so it speaks the language even if you don't.”

Potato potahto. But ultimately, who cares! You’re covered. Have a great trip.

 

[charlier]

Bormio is great. Make sure to actually ski all three parts: Bormio itself (where the Worldcup run is - very much a sporty vibe), San Colombano (the quite bit with local ski clubs and just a very relaxed atmosphere) and Santa Caterina with its glacier-like back bowl.

View attachment 222917

Bormio - outstanding food and relaxing thermal springs, On windless blue bird days, Santa Catarina is outstanding for off-piste skiing. Agreed with previous posters. It worth hiring a guide. If you are interested, I can make a few suggestions (IFMGA guides). And the Refugio’s offer amazing food at Bormio and Santa Caterina.

 

[Nola Mike]

Yes, I have both skied the Monterosa area and Bormio. Very different places. Champoluc/Monterosa is rougher terrain-wise, with more of a high alpine off-piste adventure vibe. Bormio has more of an Italian sophisticated, perfectly groomed racy vibe. And Bormio is a much nicer town to stay.

This part sounds more like alagna as far as off piste? So where is the groomed skiing better, and is it *much* better or a little better?

You need to read up on that and understand it.

Done, thanks. Never even occurred to me that there would be that big of a difference. I'd possibly be up for this at another time. One of my kids might be up for it, but it would be too much for the other. So I'll now say that I'm sticking to on piste.

Bormio - outstanding food and relaxing thermal springs, On windless blue bird days, Santa Catarina is outstanding for off-piste skiing. Agreed with previous posters. It worth hiring a guide. If you are interested, I can make a few suggestions (IFMGA guides). And the Refugio’s offer amazing food at Bormio and Santa Caterina.

I like outstanding food (though for this I'd like more rustic/traditional), I only saw the one thermal spring in Bormio?
As mentioned above, looks like I'm staying on piste.

Here are two threads on that difference between America vs Europe when it comes to off-piste skiing:

International (Europe/Japan/Southern Hemisphere) - Powder skiing in Europe versus North America

Seeing as a European powder trip post seeking resort advice is getting side tracked with talk about differences between inbounds powder skiing in North America and off-piste skiing, and we were talking about opening a separate thread, thought I'd open it here. The problem with any post like this...

www.skitalk.com

The Dangers of Skiing Off Piste In Europe

As illustrated by the Jerry of the day. As you can see, he’s not far from the lift and there are other tracks in that area, but there are no warnings above the cliff he flies off. Gotta scope your line before you ski it, bro.

www.skitalk.com

Helpful, thanks

Ok, you guys have been great. So I think if I can get these questions answered, I'll (finally) be able to make a decision:

So Bormio vs. Champoluc:

1. Is the on piste skiing significantly different between the two? It looks like both have enough variety to keep me entertained for 5 days, and neither will be super challenging. So I'll be enjoying long runs, variety, and scenery, which is fine.
2. Are the towns different enough that you'd definitely choose one over another? Like I said, I'd like good but simple food and a couple of decent pubs and restaurants. Won't be a party animal.

Right now, the accomodations that I got in Antagnod look nicer than Bormio. Has a gym, sauna, hot tub, which would be good for my wife. Bormio has the thermal springs, which should even that out I hope.

So given all of that info, you guys that have been there, which would you choose?

EDIT: Bormio it is!

 

[Slim]

Agreed. The Aosta Valley is way too close to France for good food.

Haha!

Indeed, we were in the Aosta valley Last year, and ate wonderfull food. Note not “Italian” food that people think of in the US, but the same is true for the Dolomites. The regionality of culture and cuisine is what makes Italy great.

Aosta valley is great for sightseeing, full of castles, and the town is wonderful, with lots of Roman buildings/ruins.

Lots of little ski lift areas, and some big ones.

we only did ski touring, but here is the trip report:

International (Europe/Japan/Southern Hemisphere) - La Dolce Vita, or: skiing is not the most important

As I mentioned in several other threads, my wife and I took a trip to Italy in March. Originally, we were going to meet up with friends from Holland, for a week of skiing in Italy. In the end they were unable to make it so, it was just the two of us. From home, we flew to Milan. Starting off on...

www.skitalk.com