Ski techs who don't ski

[GB_Ski]

It's a failure of communication. Open minded people generally are more fun and easy to deal with. Closed minded people are a waste of time.

 

[fundad77]

There is a big chain where I live and they have a centralized shop. Apparently the CDL drivers from their summer business do the mounts and tuning. I had always wondered why my forward pressure was off until I found this out. Now I am driving an hour to a better shop but I don't need to worry anymore.

 

[Hankj]

Food for thought... maybe a tech can't get out & ski much because the tech is in the shop earning a living.

Yeah I think this is at least partially the case.

 

[Hankj]

Was this EVO Seattle? Just want to chime in that I've had really good knowledgeable service from them too. Other outfits are... questionable.

Yep. Their shop has really improved over the years. For bikes too. This is probably a management thing - someone overseeing that part of Evo is doing a good job

 

[Hankj]

What we have here is a failure to communicate.
And the 1st tech clearly didn't know how much base material that ski actually had.
The ski was so base high, he thought in order to get it flat he would have to grind all the way through the base. Rather than buy you a new pair of skis when he did that or explain he would keep going until you said enough, or let you take the risk, he tried to save you some money.

Did the 2nd tech get it completely flat or just fix the bevels?

Completely flat.

The ski was right in front of the first tech. Obviously plenty of base material, not terribly warped. Post three sanding passes at Evo the ski still looks like it has a lifetime of base tunes left in it.

Evo did such a good job. Carefully scanning the edges I can see that there are just a few little tiny areas at the outside of the edge the belt didn't touch. Edge bevel will easily capture these. Someone was really careful to do exactly enough but not too much.

 

[SlideWright]

First shop, first tech. Pretty clearly didn't ski anymore. Told me Nordica sucks, always warped, skis skiing like they were supposed to, just only use them on powder days, can't flatten cause burn through base, buy some carving skis, kids over at EVO probably fucked these up, etc, etc, blah blah blah. Had no clue really what these skis can do and what they should feel like. A long time trying to sweet talk the guy into working on my skis at some high fee. But eventually I gave up.

My first thought was you were talking to an Architect or Interior designer who doesn't listen to clients and never worked construction......

There are plenty of individuals who are very skilled at the technical & performance side of things and don't get to test out the thing. Take F1 builders and mechanics vs the F1 drivers.

 

[Noodler]

Or at least no longer ski. I don't trust them. Too much psychology going on.

Today I took new to me used skis to a tech - '23 Enforcer 110's. They skied like shit when I tried them. ice cubed sideways on clearly center high bases. Straight edge at home confirmed, plus file guide showed base bevel well over 1%. And railed at tips and tails. I really liked how the previous Enforcer 110's I skied felt and wanted to make mine like those.

First shop, first tech. Pretty clearly didn't ski anymore. Told me Nordica sucks, always warped, skis skiing like they were supposed to, just only use them on powder days, can't flatten cause burn through base, buy some carving skis, kids over at EVO probably fucked these up, etc, etc, blah blah blah. Had no clue really what these skis can do and what they should feel like. A long time trying to sweet talk the guy into working on my skis at some high fee. But eventually I gave up.

I drove to EVO. Kid at counter listened, looked, yep bad bevel and base high under binding. We'll run 'em through the sander a couple few and get them dead flat. You got ten minutes bro? We can do it now. Where'd you ski this last storm? I skied Stevens, was killer, etc etc. $11 buck and 9 minutes later my profoundly dead flat skis and I walk out the door, ready for a fresh edge bevel and home tune.

The best surf board shapers in the world surf. A lot. There's no other arrangement that produces great surfboards. I propose that the same is about right with ski techs. If is seems like they 9-5 in the workshop but never press an edge into snow you might do better elsewhere.

I know this wasn't the point of your post, but since no one else has mentioned it, it is not advised to have your skis flattened by a belt sander. It's just a really poor tool for the job. Not only does it result in torn p-tex (easily felt and seen through a loupe), but the base usually comes out with "waves" where the ski has not been ground consistently from end-to-end. In the future, only use stone grinds for your skis.

 

[Hankj]

I know this wasn't the point of your post, but since no one else has mentioned it, it is not advised to have your skis flattened by a belt sander. It's just a really poor tool for the job. Not only does it result in torn p-tex (easily felt and seen through a loupe), but the base usually comes out with "waves" where the ski has not been ground consistently from end-to-end. In the future, only use stone grinds for your skis.

Thanks Noodler. Knew this going in, but the improvement over "I won't ski these ice-cubing POS's" is going to be huge. Neither shop would stone grind the problem out anyway, of the table at both. And these are cut pow soft day resort skis, so not such a big issue.

So enemy of the good etc. Won't be perfect, but going to be so much better than wanting to throw them in a tree well.

 

[oldschoolskier]

Skier or not a good tech, knows how to tune and set up, knows the ski brands/models and what to expect when doing the work.

While the first tech may have giving you advise that didn't sit well, he may be right based on the experience, the second just went sure we'll grind it without knowing the chance of grinding through the base.

Personally, I think an informed choice would have been best, with "we see this a lot on this ski, we can attempt to tune it but the risk is grinding through the base, are you ok with the risk?" Informed choice.

In both your tuners, you had no choice.

 

[Primoz]

But none of

Then there are still the Ernie "Let's play two" Banks of the ski world that still cannot get enough, ie the Daron Rahlves and Glen Plakes who still find any reason to ski.

But none of these two works as technician or coach nor are active racers. I know plenty of ex-racers (me included) who think there's nothing better then day on skis. But that's once you finish your career. During career I don't really know for anyone, who would go out on day off to ski. Sure on end of season you still ski for fun, but that's more like xc skiing/ski touring for alpine skier and alpine skling/ski touring for xc skiers. For technicians and coaches, it's most of time packing stuff and heading to seaside

 

[James]

“Are you telling me I don’t know how to drive my own car??”
-No. But if you ask me, this isn’t really your car. Your car is more like a Plymouth or Studebaker.”

> Loses another customer.

 

[Hankj]

“Are you telling me I don’t know how to drive my own car??”
-No. But if you ask me, this isn’t really your car. Your car is more like a Plymouth or Studebaker.”

> Loses another customer.

Yeah that's about it. Except I think my guy just didn't want to do more than touch up an edge and belt on a little wax.

I've snowboarded my whole life and ski all the effing time. I also pay close attention. I'm over being told that my experience some sort of foolish mirage.

 

[François Pugh]

Clearly first tech had a lot of room for improvement, but I don't see any evidence that the reason is is because he doesn't ski. Could just be coincidence, or maybe you reversed cause and effect - he doesn't ski cause he sucks at it because he does his own tuning that he also sucks at.

 

[markojp]

The guy the OP mentioned seems like an arrogant idiot. It's a general problem with his personality or mind, not a lack-of-skiing problem.

My guy can indeed seem arrogant, but he just knows a damn lot... and actually cares alot. Even about your skis.

 

[markojp]

When his first statement is "Nordica sucks!". I would have just grabbed my boards and left. I don't have the patience for that anymore.

In general, maybe right, but every season, name a manufacturer, there's almost always one with base/edge issues. A few seasons ago, Storm Rider 88's were a mess. Another season, Black Pearls... could be Enforcer 110's this year, who knows? But folks who've tuned alot of skis over a number of years have indeed seen it all.