Nearly 75% of water-resistant products contain toxic PFAS, study finds

[Carl]

It's pretty hard to avoid products using forever chemicals if you play outdoors. Most of us probably own at least some clothing with them.

Nearly 75% of water-resistant products contain toxic PFAS, study finds

Chemicals used in everyday products have been associated with ‘a range of serious health problems’ including cancer and birth defects

www.theguardian.com

 

[Decreed_It]

And they still don't work worth a darn . . . about to toss a Patagonia H2No (I call BS) rain jacket.

 

[noobski]

And they still don't work worth a darn . . . about to toss a Patagonia H2No (I call BS) rain jacket.

I've never liked the H2No line. I've tried two jackets over the past 10 years and they just soak up water. It does seem like BS. However, the Arc 3 layer Goretex lines have been solid for me as has my wife's Stio Dermizax on her Environ.

Not sure if Stio is using PFAS or not, but hard to avoid on Goretex.

 

[teejaywhy]

If you live in California, it's worse. EVERYTHING causes cancer!

 

[AmyPJ]

If you live in California, it's worse. EVERYTHING causes cancer!

Running joke in my house is "Look, a Prop 65 sticker!" It's funnier because I lived in CA for so long and just grew accustomed to seeing it. My from-Utah husband would comment on the stickers that are on everything here, too. It kind of started when he bought a pocket knife several years ago with the sticker on it.

Anyway, I read another article on the PFAS and it's just...depressing.

 

[James]

The pozi screwdriver I bought had a cancer warning on it.

 

[mdf]

Running joke in my house is "Look, a Prop 65 sticker!" It's funnier because I lived in CA for so long and just grew accustomed to seeing it. My from-Utah husband would comment on the stickers that are on everything here, too. It kind of started when he bought a pocket knife several years ago with the sticker on it.

Anyway, I read another article on the PFAS and it's just...depressing.

Good intentions run amok.
I actually support the prop 65 intent, but flagging everything is functionally equivalent to flagging nothing.

If the waterproofing process is a big issue, it gets lost in the "warning fatigue".

 

[crgildart]

If you want legit waterproof it's gotta be shiny rain/sailing gear. Waterproof pretty much needs to also be air proof. Sure stuff that breathes will hang out in the rain for an hour or so. but sitting on a wet padded chair in a soaking rain and I don't care how much you paid for supposedly breathable waterproof ski wear. No such thing.

As far as clothing that's bad for you. I still have my doubts about synthetics in general, dry fit stuff especially. Rubber or plastic against your bare skin just seems like a bad idea to me long term. Spandex too. I think of it like synthetic food we eat.. GMO, corn syrup, etc..

 

[AmyPJ]

Good intentions run amok.
I actually support the prop 65 intent, but flagging everything is functionally equivalent to flagging nothing.

If the waterproofing process is a big issue, it gets lost in the "warning fatigue".

Yep! I support the intent, too but yes, it means nothing to consumers anymore.
Not sure when prop 65 passed, it’s possible I voted for it!

 

[Frank Ricard]

Hate to point it out, but the article doesn't seem to link to the "study" or current science on the effects on humans from contact with PFAS in this environment, and the article seems to be (IMPO) very artificial in nature. I hate to wonder this out loud, but is it a hit piece?

Additional links/info are required to construct a real argument, in my humble opinion.

 

[Tony Storaro]

And they still don't work worth a darn . . . about to toss a Patagonia H2No (I call BS) rain jacket.

Which model?

I found the River Salt to be pretty good, but compared to the rest of the H2No jacket it is a different animal-much thicker and tougher.
Not as good as 3 layer Gore Tex, but good.

 

[EricG]

The article is miscellaneous fodder without support. It should at least reference the study or link to the study showing the details and lab certification. Otherwise it sounds like some journalists with a kindergarten science kit playing with plastic slides trying to figure out how determine if the PFAS are trace ppt from their equipment (common) or from the material being tested.

 

[AmyPJ]

So, despite being a poorly-written article, it's not made up. There are countless articles, including from the EPA, stating different studies. Also a lot of videos out there, too. I can't recall if I saw it on CBS Sunday Morning or which show that did a report on PFAS. It's one of the reasons I rarely cook with teflon non-stick cookware anymore.

 

[crgildart]

I suspect there are all kinds of health/convenience trade offs involved when using petroleum or other chemical based products ingested, inhaled, or against our skin. It seems benign (pun intended) regarding stuff against the skin but remember that our skin is actually the largest organ part of the human body.. and it does absorb things touching it That's how patches work.

The genie is long out of the bottle, but causality and solid science isn't there regarding the ill effects of being around this stuff we are discussing. Now Asbestos, and other stuff has far more concrete conclusions. Doesn't mean nothing else is as bad as that, but until we see stronger correlation and more thorough testing and studies are carried out, it's just food for thought...

 

[Decreed_It]

Which model?

I found the River Salt to be pretty good, but compared to the rest of the H2No jacket it is a different animal-much thicker and tougher.
Not as good as 3 layer Gore Tex, but good.

Older Torrentshell.

I also think you'd have to either 1) grind it up and smoke it or 2) cook it and eat it somehow extract the chems out of these garments and ingest them in such a way to be a legit health threat. Zero science in this I am riffing off the cuff I am not a medical expert #joerogandisclaimer

 

[cantunamunch]

So, despite being a poorly-written article, it's not made up. There are countless articles, including from the EPA, stating different studies. Also a lot of videos out there, too. I can't recall if I saw it on CBS Sunday Morning or which show that did a report on PFAS. It's one of the reasons I rarely cook with teflon non-stick cookware anymore.

The jacket and the frying pan are miniscule sources. Are you walking on stain-resistant carpet?

Zero science in this I am riffing off the cuff I am not a medical expert #joerogandisclaimer

I really wish that was how bioconcentration worked - and there is gobs of science showing that biological concentration of PFOA and PFOS is on the scale of a thousand times larger than measurable environmental levels.

 

[Decreed_It]

I really wish that was how bioconcentration worked - and there is gobs of science showing that biological concentration of PFOA and PFOS is on the scale of a thousand times larger than measurable environmental levels.

Now THAT is some legit scientific thought, what happens to all this old gear? I presume this all ends up in the landfill, breaks down over time, and leeches into the environment, water and bio-concentrates like everything else - up the food chain to us

 

[cantunamunch]

Now THAT is some legit scientific thought, what happens to all this old gear? I presume this all ends up in the landfill, breaks down over time, and leeches into the environment, water and bio-concentrates like everything else - up the food chain to us

Fortunately, there is very considerable engineering thought going into recycling old commercial and residential carpet and cable insulation. Unfortunately what is built already is not built out to infrastructure levels and relies on commercial recycling supply sources (read: profitable ones, not environmentally thorough ones) for feedstock.

 

[neonorchid]

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Check it out

Are PFC and PFAS the same?
Google:
"The term PFC has fallen off the family tree, but it remains in the diagram as a reminder of past use. You may still see informational materials using the term “PFC” instead of PFAS. Current nomenclature favors “PFAS” which are per- and polyfluoroalkyl substances. The PFAS family includes hundreds of chemicals."

 

[James]

Well pfas and the like ruined the drinking water in Hoosick Falls, NY. and it’s reached into Bennington, VT.
Source was a St Gobain factory that made insulated wire.

Helly Hansen has their Lifa Infinity Pro fabric. Made “without chemical treatments” , and no DWR coating.