Graduating from Adv. Intermediate to Expert

[HardDaysNight]

What about aerials as practiced by Chinese gymnasts who can’t ski at all but essentially use skis as a launching ramp. How expert do you think, say, Hirscher would be at that? Or at rails for that matter? Or big hill ski jumping?What the hell do these essentially unrelated sports have to do with alpine skiing? Idiotic.

 

[Chris V.]

I Just watched this video and guess what? I am an Expert !!! So be it, damn it I can make parallel turns on groomed black runs. So I am just going to forget that I don't consider any groomed run a black diamond. Because then I would be just a good skier, having fun, waiting for the powder so I can ski the trees and get some face shots.

That settles it. I only want to be an expert at having fun.

 

[peterm]

No, it's not. Same terrain for advanced and expert, but skied differently.
If you are not familiar with the mountain, you won't know what Eagle and Sunrise chair access, as opposed to Hawk an Whiskey Jack chairs. I just thought I could help out a little by showing what type of terrain the advanced and expert terrain includes.

Too bad the demo is only of groomed skiing. For that skiing, the main difference seems to be flexibility, dynamics, bigger angles, clean carving, less skidding and go there turns as opposed to don't go there turns.

The observation from +Sibhusky, which you seem to be disagreeing with but I guess there're some wires getting crossed, is that the descriptions of the levels 4 and 5 in the Mt Washington link you posted are the same. The observation is correct. Both of them say:

"Our programs are dynamic and fun, the way skiing and riding is supposed to be. Please use as a guide only.

• Strong parallel turns with a pole plant on all Blue and easy Black groomed runs
• Skis at a moderate pace off piste but are still cautious
• You are confident in your skills in the Green terrain park

Terrain: Skis Blue/Black Terrain on the Eagle and Sunrise Chairs
Goal: Linking turns in the bumps, explore the Green park and pole plant"

Probably they forgot to update the description of the expert level.

 

[François Pugh]

The videos are certainly different.
The descriptions must have been updated by a snowboarder.

 

[teejaywhy]

I generally ignore most signs when skiing. I used to ignore them all, but now that I'm old and risk averse and a ski patroller with extra onus to follow the rules, if I see seventeen no trespassing signs with skull and crossbones and the words death will result, I won't go there.

If only sixteen, then it's OK!

 

[mdf]

if I see seventeen no trespassing signs with skull and crossbones and the words death will result, I won't go there.

If only sixteen, then it's OK!

Reminds me of the border between Big Sky and the private Yellowstone Club. There is a no-trespassing sign about every ten feet. They threaten financial, not bodily, death.

 

[geepers]

The observation from +Sibhusky, which you seem to be disagreeing with but I guess there're some wires getting crossed, is that the descriptions of the levels 4 and 5 in the Mt Washington link you posted are the same. The observation is correct. Both of them say:

"Our programs are dynamic and fun, the way skiing and riding is supposed to be. Please use as a guide only.

• Strong parallel turns with a pole plant on all Blue and easy Black groomed runs
• Skis at a moderate pace off piste but are still cautious
• You are confident in your skills in the Green terrain park

Terrain: Skis Blue/Black Terrain on the Eagle and Sunrise Chairs
Goal: Linking turns in the bumps, explore the Green park and pole plant"

Probably they forgot to update the description of the expert level.

So the updated description should have read...??

yadayada
Goal: Linking turns in the bumps, explore the Green park and face plant"

 

[abcd]

But perhaps not the best bump skier we've seen on vid...

Can someone elaborate what makes it not an expert bump skiing? She navigates pretty challenging terrain in control and (from what it seems) at a very high speed. I don't think there are many people on my mountain who would bullet down such course at this speed and survive. I can see how the form might not be quite there but the function is. If anything, what makes it a "non expert" skiing?

 

[crgildart]

What about aerials as practiced by Chinese gymnasts who can’t ski at all but essentially use skis as a launching ramp. How expert do you think, say, Hirscher would be at that? Or at rails for that matter? Or big hill ski jumping?What the hell do these essentially unrelated sports have to do with alpine skiing? Idiotic.

Agreed. We need to bring back bigger prize money for the all around overall freestyle championships. Make it worth their while to encourage all the athletes to ski all disciplines, add slopestyle as the third discipline since ballet is dead, maybe even work some old school ballet tricks in with slopestyle. Smaller prizes and endorsements for individual events and huge prizes for all around rankings. Adding bumps to X-Games events would also be cool.

 

[Andy Mink]

Agreed. We need to bring back bigger prize money for the all around overall freestyle championships. Make it worth their while to encourage all the athletes to ski all disciplines, add slopestyle as the third discipline since ballet is dead, maybe even work some old school ballet tricks in with slopestyle. Smaller prizes and endorsements for individual events and huge prizes for all around rankings. Adding bumps to X-Games events would also be cool.

Let's go full Monty! The Combined Combined Combined. All aspects of alpine, nordic, park, bumps, and throw in snowboarding for good measure! Last one standing wins.

 

[Prosper]

Let's go full Monty! The Combined Combined Combined. All aspects of alpine, nordic, park, bumps, and throw in snowboarding for good measure! Last one standing wins.

You forgot about the event which really separates the true experts from the pretenders, the Chinese downhill.

 

[crgildart]

You forgot about the event which really separates the true experts from the pretenders, the TELEMARK Chinese downhill.

Fixed it for you

 

[tromano]

Being able to ski in control of speed and line, with rythm, on black/ double black terrain is a big milestone.

To draw a video game analogy, once you get to that "max level", the true end game progression begins. With numerous "paragon levels" and achievements to unlock for surface snow conditions, powder, ice, all the flavors of crud, bumps, trees, chutes, steeps, gates, park, etc... These unlock greater efficiency, the ability to ski all day long for days in a row, increased enjoyment and appreciation for bumps and crud, and compliments from other skiers like, "he's not bad", "he's good for a dad with three little kids", and "your smooth".

Expertise also implies knowledge of the sport, reading terrain, care for your gear (basics of tuning), selecting proper gear (boots and skis).

 

[geepers]

Can someone elaborate what makes it not an expert bump skiing? She navigates pretty challenging terrain in control and (from what it seems) at a very high speed. I don't think there are many people on my mountain who would bullet down such course at this speed and survive. I can see how the form might not be quite there but the function is. If anything, what makes it a "non expert" skiing?

She does an ok job getting down that pitch. (It's slomo which tends to smooth things out.) But expert bump skiing it is not.

Technical points I see is collapsing at the waist and lack of leg mobility are affecting ability to manage pressure, lacks steering and has difficulty controlling line. Her stance is too wide for bumps and she occasionally stems. The coordination of her movement patterns still developing.

 

[crgildart]

^^^Shopping for turns instead of owning the line.

 

[Wasatchman]

Before even trying to define what an expert skier is, consider this.

Most people are not even experts in their chosen career, much less a recreational activity that they occasionally do..

Are you planning on striving for a professional career in skiing or being a full time ski bum? If not, then you pretty much have no shot at.getting to expert to begin with.

Don't worry about the labels and enjoy the journey. Things that are advanced now won't be in 3 years. As you pick up skills, that will unlock more avenues to continue to improve. Have fun and be safe.

 

[slowrider]

A middle aged man told me I was a pretty skier the other day. Umm thanks.

 

[HardDaysNight]

Before even trying to define what an expert skier is, consider this.

Most people are not even experts in their chosen career, much less a recreational activity that they occasionally do..

Are you planning on striving for a professional career in skiing or being a full time ski bum? If not, then you pretty much have no shot at.getting to expert to begin with.

Don't worry about the labels and enjoy the journey. Things that are advanced now won't be in 3 years. As you pick up skills, that will unlock more avenues to continue to improve. Have fun and be safe.

Best post on the thread! So true

 

[Snowflake2420]

I'll add for those being too modest you can be an expert and even say you're an expert without claiming you're the best skier on the mountain. And there is a difference in my mind of being a low expert vs. high expert.

Maybe instructors and ski professionals will be disagree with me here, however, I think what the OP is bringing up here is being an expert is not only the what, but the how, which can be much more difficult to measure than the binary of I completed said ski run.

Personally, sometimes I feel like an expert, but other times I don't at all. When I'm going on a guided trip that is not in truly extreme terrain I feel comfortable saying I'm expert as I know this is generally a qualification and often others will overstate their ability so if I say I'm advanced, I'm just diminishing my chance at fun, ex. Steamboat Powdercats. I've also been to Japan and Argentina for backcountry trips too.

Reading Powdercats description for Level 3 sounds like you have to be just below pro and I'm sure there are groups of hard charging young guys who are, but it's more about your ability to handle all types of terrain and conditions that is how I personally define expert. Or being able to quickly and successfully extracting yourself from a challenging situation, ex. you have to make one particular turn on steeper terrain. Backcountry skiing quickly brings this to light. Of course certain skills are required to execute these moves like jump turns or slip turns vs. picking up your inside ski on a tight turn as you get going.

 

[SSSdave]

Can someone elaborate what makes it not an expert bump skiing? She (picaboo) navigates pretty challenging terrain in control and (from what it seems) at a very high speed. I don't think there are many people on my mountain who would bullet down such course at this speed and survive. I can see how the form might not be quite there but the function is. If anything, what makes it a "non expert" skiing?

Picaboo now with a lot more time to ski the whole mountain is now at an ADVANCED level at many of these other sub skills and likely content.

As I noted on page 4 post #71 most of us don't like being referred to as EXPERT because it is the result of an ancient ski industry marketing gimmick but rather ADVANCED. So it is annoying to read some here still blabbering about what/who deserves EXPERT in a broad sense as though it matters. Yeah don't call me EXPERT or I'll cringe.

A couple recreational ADVANCED bump skiers that are experts at having FUN in bumps and similar to my own relaxed recreational mogul style. Notice how this is not at all the frantic warp speed comp pro mogul style but rather a balanced relaxed slower style. Here's Craig:

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And here's Ron I skied with some earlier this week.

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