Adjusting to longer skis

[stas]

All, I rode the 180cm Bonafide for 5 years and I recently bought the Enforcer 100 in 185cm without demoing them. Even though they are only 5cm longer, I'm finding that I'm having a hard time adjusting to that in tighter terrain. I'm either hitting the back of the skis on moguls and trees or late with the tips and having then clip the tree or side of the mogul or tree on turn entry. In general, in tight terrain I'm having an issue controlling the skis. I'm 220# 6'1 and I love the extra length on open terrain at speed but I bought this for off-piste skiing in trees and for bumps and Im very disappointed. Im sure its all me but an tips will be welcomed.

 

[Wilhelmson]

I'm the same height and a little lighter and noticed the same thing demoing the 187 bonafides. Lots of fun on open trails but too much for the trees. I wonder if the shape of moguls and woods features are partially determined by the the average length of ski, around 175 cm? On wide skis with metal I've also noticed that I can actually turn quicker on very steep trails because I'm getting lots of weight on the tips. Also the delta thread has me wondering if going from demo bindings to fixed bindings could have a subtle effect.

 

[James]

Wasn't the old Bonafide 96mm?

You may just have to make a slightly stronger movement of the skis at first. It might feel like a lot though. Really tell them what to do. That doesn't mean push. After a bit it might just seem normal.

 

[Yo Momma]

IMHO Hard to go from Bones to Enforcers. Demoed NE's many times w/ no love. Enforcer is an amazing ski, just a tough transition that takes time, adjustments and practice coming off the Bones.

I actually like having heavier and lighter skis in my quiver also different boot setups, binding setups. Keeps your technique fluid and flexible. I always mix it up a bit.

Alpine Gear:
Rossi E88's (180)
Bones (180) new & old
Sick Day 104 (186)
Line Sick Day 110 (186)
Volkl Kuros (186)
Mantra (2016) w/ Tour F12's (177)
Dynastar Cham 107 HM Atomic Touring binders (186)

Boots: Lange XT130's, Salomon Impact CS 120's, Impact Pro's

 

[stas]

IMHO Hard to go from Bones to Enforcers. Demoed NE's many times w/ no love. Enforcer is an amazing ski, just a tough transition that takes time, adjustments and practice coming off the Bones.

I totally agree. I can't figure out what the hell is going on. On paper it should be a completely natural transition. Ill take most of the blame but I find their dynamics completely different. Ill play with it for a bit more but very frustrating.

 

[Dwight]

Calling @Josh Matta

 

[Eric267]

Longer ski with a shorter turn radius. Possibly you are fighting the ski against its natural turn shape? I find shorter radius skis to be more grabby on the tail with less slarve factor. I have a lib tech wreck100 in my quiver this season that I have been getting out on a bunch. Normally go for a 23-28r ski but this ski only comes in at 19r in a 188. Got it for skiing bumps and trees. Took me about 5 days to really figure out how the ski wants to release. Definitely fought it at first!

Maybe take a gummy to the tips and tails. They might be catching a bit and throwing your balance off?

 

[Josh Matta]

What binding on each ski? Also what mount points?

 

[stas]

What binding on each ski? Also what mount points?

Marker Griffon mounted at the manufacturer recommended line.

 

[stas]

Maybe take a gummy to the tips and tails. They might be catching a bit and throwing your balance off?

I was thinking of detuning the ski but I love how it holds on hard snow and dint want to give that up.

 

[Yo Momma]

Try starting w/ the NE's in powder. Deeper, new 3D snow is where they will really outshine the Bones. That's how I slid into my Sick Day 104's. The Bones w/ 2-3 layers of metal depending on who you ask...... SLAY the hardpack like few others. Try soft snow and stay light on your feet.... (as compared to the Bones ).

Referencing what @Eric267 said, also realize that the Bones tail is easy to release, like nobody's business esp for such a beefy ski. That turns the Bones tail into a veritable quick draw weapon when you engage it, they ease out of site w/ such smoothness like butter when you don't. Crazy but it's like a tsunami crashing in when you do engage that sucker hard!

 

[Josh Matta]

ok so here is the deal. the Enforcer have much further forward mount point. If you compare my 187cm OG bones to my 185cm E100 the mount point on the E100 is VERY far forward, almost feels center mount. IMO the mount point is to far forward for anything. I am -2 on my E100 and +2 on my 187cm Bones. The E100 I feel even carved better at that mount point and carve better on soft groom than the Bones, on scratchy groom, crud, and chop the Bones are superior. You should also know the 180cm OG bones are only about 178cm in actual length and ski even shorter due to its rocker. I find the 180cm OG bone un palapity short for skiing even the east, and IMO the 187cm is too long for eastern tree skiing...I can do its but its not fun. The 185cm Enforcer are one of my favorite tree skis for 5 to 30+ inches of light powder and can deal with weird 3d snow pretty well even though I use some more fun shapey ski if the snow gets kind of weird.

So its either the mount point, tune(,mayube not entirely flat) or some sort of technique flaw.

If you ever in stowe and have my short BSL your welcome to try mine at -2

 

[Yo Momma]

Love it! I'm going to borrow that "OG (Original Gangsta) Bones"! Love my OG's! ........ but love the new Bones too!

 

[Josh Matta]

after skiing the new 180cm Brahma(which I post a review of soon) I am really curious about the new Bones...

 

[AngryAnalyst]

ok so here is the deal. the Enforcer have much further forward mount point. If you compare my 187cm OG bones to my 185cm E100 the mount point on the E100 is VERY far forward, almost feels center mount. IMO the mount point is to far forward for anything. I am -2 on my E100 and +2 on my 187cm Bones. The E100 I feel even carved better at that mount point and carve better on soft groom than the Bones, on scratchy groom, crud, and chop the Bones are superior. You should also know the 180cm OG bones are only about 178cm in actual length and ski even shorter due to its rocker. I find the 180cm OG bone un palapity short for skiing even the east, and IMO the 187cm is too long for eastern tree skiing...I can do its but its not fun. The 185cm Enforcer are one of my favorite tree skis for 5 to 30+ inches of light powder and can deal with weird 3d snow pretty well even though I use some more fun shapey ski if the snow gets kind of weird.

So its either the mount point, tune(,mayube not entirely flat) or some sort of technique flaw.

If you ever in stowe and have my short BSL your welcome to try mine at -2

I suspect this is the best answer you're going to get OP (and it's very good).

I would add that, generically, the idea of sizing up more heavily rockered skis depends on the skier being comfortable pivoting the skis in tight terrain. I don't know if your issue with the Enforcers is that you're not used to that kind of motion or something else. Josh seems like he's the right track for a more specific diagnosis and he has about 100x more info on the bones/enforcer comparison than I do.

 

[AltaFan]

I demoed the Salomon QST99 in 181, FX95 in 181 and the E100 in 185 recently and I had the exact same reaction you did to the E100. I had a hard time controlling the ski and felt like I had to work much harder to turn it. I think the post above about mount point may be accurate, but returned that demo after half a day.

 

[Yo Momma]

after skiing the new 180cm Brahma(which I post a review of soon) I am really curious about the new Bones...

The tighter and slower it gets, and the older I get, outta shape = New Bones
More wide open and no speed limit, deeper 3D bowls, chutes and drop-offs, and when my aching joints are feeling bulletproof, In top shape = OG's
Same familiar overall feel.

 

[stas]

Thanks all. Ill give it a few more days and a couple of post factory tunes and if it doesn't help will try remounting the bindings. I had such high hopes for this ski that ts a bit frustrating. But still skiing

 

[Yo Momma]

Rather than remount the same bindings, rec mount an adjustable demo or schizo type binding. I'm always tweaking where I ski on my wider, lighter drivers. Having that extra adjustment fwd/back can drastically change how a ski feels.

 

[stas]

Rather than remount the same bindings, rec mount an adjustable demo or schizo type binding. I'm always tweaking where I ski on my wider, lighter drivers. Having that extra adjustment fwd/back can drastically change how a ski feels.

That would be nice but I don't have a set of demo bindings lying around so probably have to guess with these ones.