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Mike King

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martyg

Making fresh tracks
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Would be really, really interesting. A few years a go when we had a low snow season Wolf Creek was reporting 45 minute lift lines during spring break, as per ski instructor buddies. Mostly Texans. I could see Pagosa being flooded with Texans in this precarious time. Not a good thing.

Would love to see how they will enact social distancing. Wolf Creek is not exactly known for its safety record.
 

Ski&ride

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I don’t exactly understand why the governor resist letting them open.

Lay out the conditions. Let them open. If they can’t police themselves, he can always close them down.

It’s hard to convince people to prevent something that never happens. Much easier to let it happen and then act accordingly

(When I say “let it happen”, I’m not talking about COVID-19 outbreak, which has long incubation period and people’s life at stake. I’m talking just about social distancing)

If WC can keep the mountain open while keeping social distance, it’s win-win. If not, they’ll have to close.

Given Colorado is still shelter-in-place, there can’t be too many people traveling down to WC. But if there’re too many, it may justify the governor shutting them down. Much like other places, too many out-of-towers? Close.

Wait for another 3 weeks, if there’s no outbreak, let them travel!
 

Tricia

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I don’t exactly understand why the governor resist letting them open.
We don't know that Governor Polis is not letting them open. The article says that the county has approved based on consulting with medical professionals and county officials, and how he has an application in to the state officials who told him it will take 3 days to approve.

I hope that his plan is enough to have a controlled opening.
I wonder how Baldy is doing.
 

Tricia

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Would be really, really interesting. A few years a go when we had a low snow season Wolf Creek was reporting 45 minute lift lines during spring break, as per ski instructor buddies. Mostly Texans. I could see Pagosa being flooded with Texans in this precarious time. Not a good thing.

Would love to see how they will enact social distancing. Wolf Creek is not exactly known for its safety record.
Did you read the article?
This is from the article based on what the county approved:
No more than 500 passholders. Day tickets are capped at 120. All skiers need to make online reservations 24-hours in advance to secure their spot on the hill. Parking and lift lines are spaced to prevent crowding. Masks are mandatory. Lift lines would be spaced. He’s not offering food service. Decks are closed. He’s idled all his shuttle buses. He’s even described the cleaning fluid his team will use in the restrooms every hour (1/3 cup of bleach per gallon of water.)
 

Gary Stolt

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There could be issues with opening other ski areas? If he allows Wolf Creek to open, will he then have to allow A-Basin to open? Don't get me wrong, I would love to see some ski resorts open. Generally speaking, people are spaced out at ski resorts - how many people can a 2500 acre resort handle while respecting social distancing? However, allowing Wolf Creek to open makes it difficult to keep A-Basin from opening if he has reservations about doing that.
 

Tricia

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I had to go search for this article that I knew I read a few days ago.
This perplexes me on the new order from Gov Polis and the exemption request for Eagle County.

Snip from the article:
Congratulating Eagle County on Thursday for its response to COVID-19, the state’s top public health official, Jill Ryan, granted the county’s request for exemptions from state orders on stringent stay-at-home requirements and gatherings of less than 10.

The exemptions will also allow for the opening of certain parks and businesses including retail and service, provided social distancing guidelines are followed.

Ryan, the executive director of the Colorado Department of Public Health and Environment and a former Eagle County commissioner who lives in Edwards, attended a meeting of the Eagle County commissioners in-person to grant the request.
 

Ken_R

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There could be issues with opening other ski areas? If he allows Wolf Creek to open, will he then have to allow A-Basin to open? Don't get me wrong, I would love to see some ski resorts open. Generally speaking, people are spaced out at ski resorts - how many people can a 2500 acre resort handle while respecting social distancing? However, allowing Wolf Creek to open makes it difficult to keep A-Basin from opening if he has reservations about doing that.

If WC opens the caravan of cars from the front range will be humongous. :roflmao: :huh:
 

Ski&ride

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There could be issues with opening other ski areas? If he allows Wolf Creek to open, will he then have to allow A-Basin to open?
The lifting of restrictions are location specific. So this disparity will happen.

It’s really up to the county official to decide when to lift their local restrictions, with the blessing at the state level. In WC’s case, he expects his clientele come from outside of his county. So he needs the blessing of those neighboring county too

What the county need to convince the governor is:

1) they have spare medical capacity to handle the uptick in cases, which is a scientific certainty;

2) they have the testing capacity to keep track of HOW FAST (or slow) the cases are happening.

I’m guessing it’s the latter that could be the sticking point?

(I don’t see any mentioning of those 2 points though. Maybe the behind the scene answers are both “no”? Hence no lifting of travel restrictions, and the other restrictions)

I don’t know if the governor had outlined how he’s going to monitor the spread of Covid-19 elsewhere. But without the transparency in that, it LOOKS rather arbitrary how he decides when to lift what restrictions.
 
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Ski&ride

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If WC opens the caravan of cars from the front range will be humongous. :roflmao: :huh:
Not if there’s still a travel restrictions. There will be ZERO caravans.

That’s what the owner of WC want the governor to lift, which was answered with a categoric “NO”. :(

So far, most of the decisions to “open” appears to base SOLELY on the local case number. But with long distance travel, that case number can explode quickly.

Unless there’s a change on the testing protocol (e.g. random sampling of workers in business that are open, instead of wait till they show symptoms), we’re heading right back to the same dark area we were in early March!

Namely, we’ll have spread of the virus undetected for many weeks, multiplying exponentially. Then scramble to contain it with wide area across the board lockdown again!
 
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Tricia

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The lifting of restrictions are location specific. So this disparity will happen.

It’s really up to the county official to decide when to lift their local restrictions, with the blessing at the state level. In WC’s case, he expects his clientele come from outside of his county. So he needs the blessing of those neighboring county too

What the county need to convince the governor is 1) they have the medical capacity to handle the uptick in cases, which is a scientific certainty; and 2) they have the testing capacity to keep track of HOW fast or slow the cases are happening.

I’m guessing it’s the latter that could be the sticking point?

(I don’t see any mentioning of those 2 points though. Maybe the behind the scene answers are both “no”. Hence no lifting of travel restrictions)
Who is the pass holder base for WC? Locals?
From the article:
No more than 500 passholders. Day tickets are capped at 120. All skiers need to make online reservations 24-hours in advance to secure their spot on the hill.
 

Jerez

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I have been to the hospital in Pagosa. It is TINY. A friend had an incident (not ski related) and would have been handled at an urban ER but required airlift to Denver. IMO no way it could handle a COVID outbreak with out of towners.

that said if they limited it to locals from the three countries it could work. It would be a shame if the 120 day tickets went to folks from TX, NM and front range who would then be in hotels etc. Even if WC could manage to stay within physical distancing guidelines, they would not be able to monitor Pagosa and South Fork fallout.
 

Ski&ride

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Even if WC could manage to stay within physical distancing guidelines, they would not be able to monitor Pagosa and South Fork fallout
It’s not WC’s job to monitor the outbreak at hospitals in Pagoda. It’s the county’s duty to monitor and tell WC to stay open or close base on what happens in the hospitals.

That said, I think by the time patients start arriving at hospitals with symptoms, it may very well be too late. They need to be proactive in testing workers who has high contact potential with customers, IF they want to get an accurate picture of the virus spread before it explodes.
 

martyg

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Did you read the article?
This is from the article based on what the county approved:
No more than 500 passholders. Day tickets are capped at 120. All skiers need to make online reservations 24-hours in advance to secure their spot on the hill. Parking and lift lines are spaced to prevent crowding. Masks are mandatory. Lift lines would be spaced. He’s not offering food service. Decks are closed. He’s idled all his shuttle buses. He’s even described the cleaning fluid his team will use in the restrooms every hour (1/3 cup of bleach per gallon of water.)

Would love to see it in action, but not worth the 90 minute drive for me.

How many season's passes are held by non-locals? How many day tickets will be sold to non-locals? Hotel rooms in Pagosa? Food? Bringing pathogens to a mtn community with a tiny hospital?

If they limited it to locals only, I'd be all for it. If contact tracing of infected residents pointed to an non-local, and that non-local was then responsible for the entirety of that resident's medical bills and lost wages, I'd be all for it.

Non-residents tend to be the supidest people on the hill, in the woods, on the roads, and in town. I wouldn't expect that they'd simply attain a higher level of consideration now.
 
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martyg

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I have been to the hospital in Pagosa. It is TINY. A friend had an incident (not ski related) and would have been handled at an urban ER but required airlift to Denver. IMO no way it could handle a COVID outbreak with out of towners.

that said if they limited it to locals from the three countries it could work. It would be a shame if the 120 day tickets went to folks from TX, NM and front range who would then be in hotels etc. Even if WC could manage to stay within physical distancing guidelines, they would not be able to monitor Pagosa and South Fork fallout.

Yeap. It is a factor that people in cities forget, and why residents of mtn towns are not going out of their way to me friendly to those with out-of-state plates.

Your second paragaph sums it up nicely. IME, those people with out-of-state plates tend to treat mtn towns and their toilet. They do stupid things, wih little concern for others.
 

Jerez

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It’s not WC’s job to monitor the outbreak at hospitals in Pagoda. It’s the county’s duty to monitor and tell WC to stay open or close base on what happens in the hospitals.

That said, I think by the time patients start arriving at hospitals with symptoms, it may very well be too late. They need to be proactive in testing workers who has high contact potential with customers, IF they want to get an accurate picture of the virus spread before it explodes.
You are right of course. I should have said:
Even if WC could manage to stay within physical distancing guidelines, they would not be able to monitor Pagosa and South Fork fallout, nor should they be expected to..

Testing workers could prevent infecting guests. I would worry more about guests infecting workers if I sat on any of those county commissions.
 
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Mike King

Mike King

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I've given up. No more lift served skiing likely for me. I'd been thinking about a summer trip to NZ for the Rookie Academy, but I seriously doubt that it will be feasible. While NZ is planning to open the ski fields for skiing, it also appears they are going to require inbound travelers to quarantine for 14 days before entering the population. That makes it pretty unattractive...

And with Colorado's Safer at Home restrictions to recreating within 10 miles of your home, it isn't likely that there will be any skinning in my near future either.

Mike
 

mikel

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1st thing to note is we are not in a shelter in place mode on the state level. It is now called safer at home. Each county gets to decide what and when they want to do as long as the restrictions are at least at the current state level or stricter. There are 2 counties that filed for an exception, Eagle and Mesa, and they were granted. It didn't happen over night. It took several days.

I was extremely positive that A Basin would reopen this spring but also stated in several posts that if it didn't happen it would be because Summit kept it from happening. Lodging is also still not happening and an issue. Summit is still in locals only mode. Not wanted - out of state or frangers although the Summit Daily worded it much nicer.

I was surprised to see the late night ruling from the Gov. last night. It sure sounded like WC had dotted their i's, crossed their t's, and had it figured out. *MAYBE* opening dates could be the end of the month? Depending on what Pitkin County decides possibly even include reopening Highlands. That said, I'm no longer optimistic about reopening and even question early season wrod for 20/21.
 

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