Wide Skis, Sore Ankles?

[CYJ]

Two weekends ago was my first time skiing fat, wide skis (Atomic Bentchetler 120). The conditions didn't really warrant it but with Spring skiing soon arriving, I thought it was about the best conditions to try out my Bents.

The skiing went fine (such a playful, smear-able ski), but when I took my boots off after a few hours, I was experiencing some major soreness/boderline pain right in front of my ankles. My best guess from just searching google images, I think it's the Extensor Hallucis Longus? Basically the soreness/pain only comes when I extend and point my feet down.

This is my 3rd season skiing and my only other ski up to this point are the Black Crows Atris (108), which have never caused this or any kind of pain before. I mounted my Bents on the line ( -3.5? from true center) and pretty much skied the same way I do with my Atris (more centered and balanced) as they're both generously rockered.

Is this issue just a reality of owning fat skis, or am I missing something in terms of technique? I know people talk about wider skis leading to sore knees, but haven't seen much about ankles (and my knees felt fine). I should mention the skis felt significantly heavier on my feet than the Atris (obvious, but man did it result in some damp suspension over crud) which I assume probably plays a part in this.

I'm really excited about the next time I'll be able to pull out the Bents again, but at the same time, am dreading the ankle pain will return...

P.S. - Wasn't sure where to post, mods feel free to move where you guys see fit if needed.

 

[Philpug]

I get that, wide skis want to be in the snow...not on it. I notice ankle and knee fatigue when I am on a wider ski and the conditions do no warrent it.

 

[James]

So your only skis are a 108 Atris and a 120 Bent Chetler?
Really, do yourself a favor and get even a cheap used ski under 85.

 

[Tricia]

When the narrow ski in your quiver is 108....
You need something narrower for your daily driver and a 120mm ski is (potentially) overkill.

 

[CYJ]

A narrower ski is definitely next to be added to my quiver. 2 days on the Bents was enough for me, ankle pain or not, to decide it's almost a novelty ski that'll get called upon only on the deepest of days. The Atris does fine up to about a foot of pow; not quite on top but not submarine status either.

It is interesting however what turns up when I do a quick google search of what width skiers are on in my area (PNW) as their daily driver; no less than 100 seems to be the general consensus.

When the narrow ski in your quiver is 108....
You need something narrower for your daily driver and a 120mm ski is (potentially) overkill.

Given the similarities in snow between PNW and Tahoe, what do you guys consider a DD width for someone who skis mostly off piste?

Back to the topic on hand, so it seems the fatter the ski, the more work it creates for my legs and feet and not much else but to deal with it?

 

[James]

Just so we're clear, in the 3 yrs you've been skiing it's been the 108 Atris and recently the 120 Chetlers?
What are the boots? Did you get them at a shop? What work was done?
Got a photo/diagram of where the pain is?

Calling @markojp , pnw skier and boot guy.

 

[CYJ]

Just so we're clear, in the 3 yrs you've been skiing it's been the 108 Atris and recently the 120 Chetlers?
What are the boots? Did you get them at a shop? What work was done?
Got a photo/diagram of where the pain is?

Calling @markojp , pnw skier and boot guy.

Minus the rentals my first season, yes just those 2 skis.

Boots are Krypton 130s. Went down a size from measured foot, heat molded liners tossed in with the orange trim to fit sidas footbeds (sized to my arch length and not foot length). Played around with the flex and lean options; stiff tongue, no flex inserts, large forward lean wedge with raised spoiler seem to be the combo that's working for me.

No punches, grinds, stretches... Feet feel pretty locked in and haven't had issues so far (~20 days and counting).

5' 11" 185 lbs.... Salomon STH2 mounted on the Bents.... Think I've covered everything?

Again, no idea exactly what muscle or ligament that I'm feeling the soreness in, just highlighting where I'm feeling it below. Right above the ankle bone on the lateral side of each foot.

Is it possible I'm just still new to the game and muscles aren't used to skiing???

 

[Tricia]

A narrower ski is definitely next to be added to my quiver. 2 days on the Bents was enough for me, ankle pain or not, to decide it's almost a novelty ski that'll get called upon only on the deepest of days. The Atris does fine up to about a foot of pow; not quite on top but not submarine status either.

It is interesting however what turns up when I do a quick google search of what width skiers are on in my area (PNW) as their daily driver; no less than 100 seems to be the general consensus.

Given the similarities in snow between PNW and Tahoe, what do you guys consider a DD width for someone who skis mostly off piste?

Back to the topic on hand, so it seems the fatter the ski, the more work it creates for my legs and feet and not much else but to deal with it?

Me and most of the people I ski with are on skis under 90mm under foot as a DD.
I'd say the average skier at Squaw is on something between 90-100, while some of the more technical skier like @Alexzn are probably closer to the 90 range (or below) than the 100 range.

Lets face it, if you've only been skiing 3 years, its probably a good idea to get on something narrower for those cascade concrete days.

And, to be clear, I'm not judging your skiing because I've never seen you ski but when you say you've been skiing 3 years and you're on skis that are 108 as your DD, I picture someone who doesn't have their technique refined and am likely to think your ankle pain has more to do with your ski technique and skis that are ridiculously wide as a combination.

I've also seen people who learn to ski and excel in skills in a short time, and you could be one of those people.

 

[Andy Mink]

I'm guessing you used some muscles and the corresponding ligaments and tendons that you haven't used as much before to control the Bents on harder snow.

Trying to keep a 120 going straight on firmer conditions requires a lot of "micro" adjustments. The Bent also has a lot of rocker at the tip and tail so only about 40% of the ski is on the snow on those firmer conditions.

 

[Wilhelmson]

Maybe you just took a crooked step out of your car and didn't notice it then hit a hard bump or two sideways on the trail and didn't bother to ice or rest it and now it hurts.

 

[Tom K.]

I get that, wide skis want to be in the snow...not on it. I notice ankle and knee fatigue when I am on a wider ski and the conditions do not warrant it.

QFT.

The wider ski is a longer lever arm.

 

[trailtrimmer]

Wide skis + hard snow = joint stress.

Find a 76-84mm ski for groomer days, your ankle and knees will thank you.

 

[Andy Mink]

Wide skis + hard snow = joint stress.

Find a 76-84mm ski for groomer days, your ankle and knees will thank you.

I definitely feel it in the knees with wider skis on firmer conditions.

 

[Alexzn]

Check your boots. Wider skis exaggerate some boot issues- higher lever. 108 mm is wide for a daily driver but entirely possible. 120 should come out only in proper snow. Both should not cause pain in properly fitted boots.

 

[cantunamunch]

Check your boots. Wider skis exaggerate some boot issues- higher lever. 108 mm is wide for a daily driver but entirely possible. 120 should come out only in proper snow. Both should not cause pain in properly fitted boots.

^This. And have an instructor look at your stance.

 

[dovski]

So I had a similar issue come up this year, luckily I have an amazing PT who was able to diagnose and help correct the issue. Good ski form has you driving the skis which means knees forward and hinging at the ankle to put pressure on the tips of your skis. When you do not have enough natural flexibility in your ankle and/or a tight calf you end up flattening the arch of your foot to get further renge with the ankle … this is bad. Doing this puts a lot of strain on the tendons/ligaments and muscle which in turn leads to a sore ankle. The fix for me was doing bent knee calf stretches with the ball of my foot elevated. The goal here is to increase natural range of motion in your ankle and stretch your calf thus alleviating the flattening of your arch while driving your skis. This has made a huge difference. My daily drivers are enforcer 93s my fat skis are enforcer 110s. Not sure the fat skis were a factor in my soreness but the ankle and calf flexibility definitely was. In effort to continually improve I had adjust my style of skiing to really push my knees forward hinging at the ankles knees and hips and while this was great ski form, my ankles and calves needed to get used to it and I had to work on my ankle flexibility and also stretch out my calves …. it is all connected now

 

[CYJ]

Me and most of the people I ski with are on skis under 90mm under foot as a DD.
I'd say the average skier at Squaw is on something between 90-100, while some of the more technical skier like @Alexzn are probably closer to the 90 range (or below) than the 100 range.

Lets face it, if you've only been skiing 3 years, its probably a good idea to get on something narrower for those cascade concrete days.

And, to be clear, I'm not judging your skiing because I've never seen you ski but when you say you've been skiing 3 years and you're on skis that are 108 as your DD, I picture someone who doesn't have their technique refined and am likely to think your ankle pain has more to do with your ski technique and skis that are ridiculously wide as a combination.

I've also seen people who learn to ski and excel in skills in a short time, and you could be one of those people.

Fair enough, as much as I've progressed in the 3 years I try to be as cognizant of my technique as possible and am still learning every season. I came off of snowboarding for 10+ years and felt the same way when the reverse camber craze hit the scene.

 

[Tricia]

Fair enough, as much as I've progressed in the 3 years I try to be as cognizant of my technique as possible and am still learning every season. I came off of snowboarding for 10+ years and felt the same way when the reverse camber craze hit the scene.

While skiing powder is very different than skiing on groomers, good skills on technical skis on groomers will translate to better skiing on powder days.
Hope that makes sense. I am not sure it came on paper like it sounded in my head.

 

[Josh Matta]

The better your balance and tipping skills are the more stress hard snow will cause ankle,foot, and knee pain on wider skis.

 

[dovski]

The better your balance and tipping skills are the more stress hard snow will cause ankle,foot, and knee pain on wider skis.

True dat