Why do my brakes lock together at times?

[justplanesteve]

Spring 2021 i got back on skis essentially first time in 30 yrs.
Started with new boots and my old straight skis.
Soon got a second hand pair of shaped Atomic Vantages, probably ex-rental skis, on the advice of a young guy.
When i was getting used to them, the brakes sometimes interlocked, and i put that down to skiing 1960's era with skis too close together.
I worked on carving more and avoided the problem.

2021/2022 season i bought a pass and took a 6 week course, started learning to use the skis better, don't recall locking them up at all last year.

This year 2022/2023 started out fine.
Then a couple days ago after teaching classes all day, i went up to free ski by myself and just let it all out.
I just let it rip (well for a slow old guy ) down through the steeper sections mostly short swing and kept it going along the edge even tighter where the slope gentles out; and suddenly my skis are locked up again.
I unconnected them briefly, and then they hooked up again whereupon i went back end over tin-cups.

OK, "obviously" i am skiing with skis too close together.
Or am i?
Today this post went up on ski talk as an exemplar of mogul-type/prep skiing and skis can't physically get closer?

Deb Armstrong Zipper Line Moguls

I've no intent of zipper lining moguls, so was pleasantly surprised at how much I could learn from this video. The drills, quick angulation, and rock solid upper body are amazing. Olivia's competence in transition from ga to zipper is so complete.

www.skitalk.com

So, 2 questions:
1.) is there anything obviously wrong about the brakes?
2.) are my skis too close together for a loose snow/slightly bump ridgeline?

I'll ask one of the L3's about my skiing at work, hopefully Thursday if/when the rain stops, but maybe there are some obvious insights or equipment suggestions here?



Thank you.
smt

 

[Pacobillie]

The brakes look quite wide. They stick out too much outside the skis, even when “retracted”. What width are the brakes. I suspect they are 110 mm.

 

[Dwight]

Probably should have 85mm brakes.

 

[justplanesteve]

I can't tell you how re-assuring that is.

Across the shoulder just after the right angle bend; the measurement is very close to 4" (outside) = 102mm? when the brakes are open
So I just have to find a ski shop and get narrower brakes?

Thank you!
smt

 

[Tony Storaro]

I am not an expert but these brakes look too wide.

 

[Jilly]

Time for new skis!!

 

[GregK]

Your brake width should be as close as possible to the ski width to a max of about 8mm wider than the ski width or you risk catching like you are.
Those are 100mm brakes(so 17mm wider than the skis) and you want the 90mm Atomic/Salomon brakes swapped in there.
Don’t think Salomon makes a 85mm brake but 90mm should be perfect.

 

[Tony S]

OK, "obviously" i am skiing with skis too close together.
Or am i?
Today this post went up on ski talk as an exemplar of mogul-type/prep skiing and skis can't physically get closer?

The brake width problem is real and you should address it. Low hanging fruit.

Meanwhile you ARE almost certainly skiing with skis too close together. Don't cherry pick that one clip out of all the fundamentals videos out there to rationalize that.. Competition mogul skiing is its own bizarre little niche. You don't want to be emulating that until you know the rules, and are breaking them consciously in very specific circumstances. I.e., take a lesson.

 

[cantunamunch]

The brake width problem is real and you should address it. Low hanging fruit.

Meanwhile you ARE almost certainly skiing with skis too close together. Don't cherry pick that one clip out of all the fundamentals videos out there to rationalize that.. Competition mogul skiing is its own bizarre little niche. You don't want to be emulating that until you know the rules, and are breaking them consciously in very specific circumstances. I.e., take a lesson.

 

[justplanesteve]

After posting this, i took the brakes off and bent them in a vise as far as possible insofar as they would still open cleanly. that helped.
Then it occurred to me to check some of the $5 barrel skis picked up last year when i was looking for interesting bindings.
The Tyrolias raise, and then squeeze together. What a great mechanism!
One set of Markers sort of does the same, but not as cleanly.
So now i know what to look for.
The quick resolution seems to be to start looking for brakes that match the bindings but are a better width match for the skis.
Or possibly make/modify/machine a Tyrolia set to match the Atomic bindings.

Jilly - one piece of equipment at a time.
It was new boots again this year, and fitting; based on last years discussion.

BTW, i'm not "emulating" anything.
Leftover from the 60's. Old habits where my feet apparently gravitate when it feels like i'm in the zone rather than focused practicing.
I'll work on it with one of the senior instructors.

But this exercise has clarified the brake issue, possibly to precipitate better bindings.
Or maybe leave them alone as tough love reminder to keep my feet apart?

smt

 

[zircon]

The Tyrolias raise, and then squeeze together. What a great mechanism!
One set of Markers sort of does the same, but not as cleanly.
So now i know what to look for.
The quick resolution seems to be to start looking for brakes that match the bindings but are a better width match for the skis.
Or possibly make/modify/machine a Tyrolia set to match the Atomic bindings.

Been a while since I saw an Atomic/Salomon binding up close, but if you have the correct width brake for the ski it’ll retract fine. Those are just way too wide for the ski. Definitely don’t try to mod the Tyrolia brake to fit an Atomic binding. Plenty of online ski shops sell just the brake if you know what the binding is.

 

[justplanesteve]

PS:
Here's another example just browsed.
I doubt my feet are any closer than the guy at 1:28, or between 2:44 to 3:30, for example. Of course i don't claim their style or precision, but it is that type of skiing where at the transition, as the boots pass both up and down and fore and aft. Suddenly the brakes are entangled unless i stay really conscious. Which tends to distract from other inputs.

 

[James]

I thought it was going to be about carrying skis and you can’t get them apart.

If your brakes are locking up skiing- geez that’s just…not good. Get it fixed. You going to be Dale Snodgrass?

I wouldn’t worry too much about stance width. It usually sorts itself out. Balance on the outside ski- that’s important. But concentrate on the inside foot to start the turn.

(It’s possible you’re set up too much on your inside edges, but let’s not

Stop wedeling and do some big gs turns at speed. That should open your stance up.
(Don’t use Olivia in that mogul vid as a gs example. Decent U14’s would be better)

Some casual gs turns-

 

[BLiP]

As others have said, probably a combination of both. Brakes are too wide for the ski and your stance is probably a bit too narrow. Technique is much different than it was when you were skiing 30 years ago. But regardless of stance, get those brakes fixed (the right way).

I doubt my feet are any closer than the guy at 1:28, or between 2:44 to 3:30, for example.

Among other factors, the skis that you are on are much wider than those used by the skiers in the video. With wider skis and brakes that are sticking out, you have less room to work with.

 

[Tony S]

Are we doing videos now?

+++++++++++++++++++++

Why Do My Brakes
Lock So Bad?

Why Do My Feet
Ski So Close?