Who uses the spoiler inside their boot cuffs?

[moreoutdoorYuri]

Here's the OP, as originally posted:

Just wondering who discards these things as soon as they get the boots home from the shop, and who skis with them stuck to their liners.
Which boot, what's its forward lean, and why do you need it?
Is there some history to the use of these inserts?
Comments?

Ok, maybe I didn't quite read it correctly...
...not important which boot I currently use, nor it's forward lean except to note that 'spoiler's are 'in' to get me into my preferred balance posture.
history of 'spoilers'/inserts is long, storied and glorified. My 1st encounter was with these...

All Things Jet Stix

All Things Jet Stix High-Back Boot Accessory From my collection (gift from @TimD59)

www.pugski.com

except I put their attachment strap between 4 & 5 buckle...
grandmommy of the evolution boot design to the modern boot - with the usual extreme swings, like the Nordica Astral Olympic, superhigh models from San Marco and Strolz and the incomparable Hanson Exhibition (remember waxing customers so tight and hot that the overflow came out of their ears... LOL!)
Of course, modern 'spoilers' serve a somewhat other varied purpose - to adjust forward lean. But the old Jet Stix was the one ring to rule them all, at the time. Maybe ebcuase they were essentially the ONLY one (a few cheapo imitations which blew apart quicky...)
it was great to find a thread about some seriously laughable stuff we tried/used and totally enjoyed back in da day...
life is great - skiing is the cream icing!

 

[moreoutdoorYuri]

This year I'm looking for some padding for the top of the tongue. My shins are already battered and bruised. Ouch!

I found cutting/shaping 2-3mm thickness sections from an old wetsuit to my boot tongues (leg side), adds just the right amount of padding to take up space when the tongue has compressed a bit. From the bend at the instep to the top of tongue.No realized change to the lower leg angle of my chicken legs and helps keep me in my preferred balance posture. Works great, cause I still tend to drive the start of turns without having to drop my hips a significant amount.

 

[Tony Storaro]

Lange RS 130 Spoiler in

Same same.

Doesn't feel the same without them.

BTW, does anyone know where I can buy a pair or two of these?

 

[Erik Timmerman]

I ski with one spoiler. Left boot only. My right calf is way bigger than my left. I don’t know why it took me so long to put one in.

 

[Noodler]

I ski with one spoiler. Left boot only. My right calf is way bigger than my left. I don’t know why it took me so long to put one in.

Interesting. I don't know why I hadn't considered this option myself. I also have a much smaller calf on my right side due to my leg injury. I think I'll experiment with using a spoiler on that side my next time out. Thanks for the idea.

 

[Tricia]

Same same.

Doesn't feel the same without them.

BTW, does anyone know where I can buy a pair or two of these?

You could reach out to someone on Pugski who doesn't use their spoilers and offer to pay shipping.

If I have a customer who doesn't want their spoilers I'll let you know.

 

[Tony Storaro]

You could reach out to someone on Pugski who doesn't use their spoilers and offer to pay shipping.

If I have a customer who doesn't want their spoilers I'll let you know.

Thanks! That'd be real kind
I will pay for shipping and whatever (reasonable) price they ask for as now I have 3 pairs of liners and only 1 pair of spoilers and I really really like them.

 

[Rod9301]

Great explanation so excuse this stupid question. If the spoiler is used to take up volume but inadvertently increase forward angle, is it sometimes necessary to make other adjustments to decrease forward angle?

Best way to take volume in the upper boot is by adding padding to the tongue. This way the forward lean does not change. Also padding in the back pushes the foot forward so your toes may touch.

 

[Henry]

Ah, Jet Stix. The budget version was to cut something similar from the sides of an empty pickle pail from the hamburger stand one worked at.

One use for spoilers is for a skier with skinny calves to take up the space a generous calf would occupy. This puts both skiers' lower legs at the same angle. In any case, each skier should find the angles and positions where they feel balanced and their skis work the best for them.

 

[Noodler]

^^^^^^ Right, the idea for me is more about filling in the gap in the cuff due to the much smaller circumference of my injured leg. I'd like to think that I never use the back of the cuff, but we all know that's not the case for any skier. We all get back in our balance and thus we need the front of the cuff and the back of the cuff to be equally "accessible" for both legs. Currently I have to crank the top buckle and powerstrap on the right side and I think that's been working OK, but this thread definitely has me thinking about changing my approach. The idea of filling the gap rather then cranking the buckles seems like it could possibly achieve a better balanced position and better boot reaction to balancing movements.

 

[cantunamunch]

^ and possibly a different mounting point

 

[Noodler]

^ and possibly a different mounting point

You mean a different binding delta (or boot gas pedal). You really need to keep up... binding mount points are so yesterday.

 

[cantunamunch]

You mean a different binding delta (or boot gas pedal). You really need to keep up... binding mount points are so yesterday.

Actually, no.

The quantities you name define the position of the limit. What I am talking about defines the sensation at the limit.

The cuff reaction force that comes through the spoiler is completely governed by the tail flex and geometry.

The spoiler takes out travel to the limit. Therefore it increases the importance of what that limit feels like.

 

[jeff foreman]

Just wondering who discards these things as soon as they get the boots home from the shop, and who skis with them stuck to their liners.
Which boot, what's its forward lean, and why do you need it?
Is there some history to the use of these inserts?
Comments?

Atomic Hawx Ultra 130's. Rossignol Allspeed Elite 130's. Always use them. There is no forward lean advantage of course. I think they provide better integration and fit for lower leg and subtle earlier warning for back-seat drivers.

 

[Big J]

If the boots I am skiing at the time have them I use them. I prefer a more forward stance with a knee that is bent more.

 

[martyg]

^^^^^^ Right, the idea for me is more about filling in the gap in the cuff due to the much smaller circumference of my injured leg. I'd like to think that I never use the back of the cuff, but we all know that's not the case for any skier. We all get back in our balance and thus we need the front of the cuff and the back of the cuff to be equally "accessible" for both legs. Currently I have to crank the top buckle and powerstrap on the right side and I think that's been working OK, but this thread definitely has me thinking about changing my approach. The idea of filling the gap rather then cranking the buckles seems like it could possibly achieve a better balanced position and better boot reaction to balancing movements.

Maybe ski a season with your top buckles unbuckled? Rely on internal, and not external balance?

 

[Noodler]

Maybe ski a season with your top buckles unbuckled? Rely on internal, and not external balance?

I already ski with the top buckle loose (as compared to the rest of the buckles). I tighten the powerstrap/Booster, but the top buckle is never tight.

 

[brian avery]

With my chicken legs? I need the volume taken up.

I have the same issue. Any idea where I can buy a pair of aftermarket spoilers?

 

[givethepigeye]

^ Any bootfitting place will have some. Just ask. At least that’s been my experience.

 

[Tricia]

I have the same issue. Any idea where I can buy a pair of aftermarket spoilers?

Most bootfitters can make a tongue shim, or spoiler if you need one.
Also check with a boot shop and see if they have spoilers laying around that they pulled from a boot that a customer didn't need.