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princo

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Unless I was going to wheel it, the Sequoia is a no brainer, especially at their price points.

I'm curious as to why the Sequoia depreciates much more compared to the 4Runner or the LandCruiser. The durability is pretty good, so that is not. Is it the size? People afraid of the V8 and fuel economy? Or is it because it doesn't have as big of an offroad following that lets the resale floor drop a bit more than their siblings? Other thoughts?
 
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jmeb

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I think it's just what you list: size, slightly less off-road chops, and fuel economy.

But there is a strong market for them in the mountain west (at least in CO.) Just not as strong as the silly market for LCs, 4Runners, and Tacos.
 

tball

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I'm curious as to why the Sequoia depreciates much more compared to the 4Runner or the LandCruiser.
I also think the Sequoia and Tundra have significant competition from the domestics with a loyal following. The competition is much weaker for the 4runner, LC, and Tacoma.

It also doesn't help that Toyota is so slow to refresh their trucks. The current Sequoia and Tundra are over a decade old with just a minor refresh, and it really shows in fuel economy:

Compare_Side-by-Side.jpg
 

Muleski

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The Sequoia is a big vehicle. More room inside that a Land Cruiser. It's a real value, used, but it's nowhere near the same in terms of materials or build quality. Sequoia was designed to be built in the USA, and to compete with the big GMC SUV's, the Ford Expedition, etc. It was not designed to retail at $70K plus, 10 years ago. And it was not built in Toyota’s best factory in Japan. The LC was. Easy to assume the Tundra, and Sequoia are close to the same as the LC. Not really.

They depreciate more because for some reason they have also escaped the others in this kind of strong used niche market. The others hopd up well in price. Also, the guys who I know who work on them, and some who "flip" them all say that they are a great, great value.....but in the same sentence "not a LC." Of course, the LC takes a huge hit in the first few years. They it starts to slow down. And they begin to hold value.....

We all know that a generation one V6 Tacoma, seemingly in silver, is one of the most popular vehicles in mountain towns. For good reason. They have almost a cult like following. They last, they run well, etc. Same thing with the first three generations of a 4Runner. Today, the price of a new Tacoma is very steep, and a new 4Runner seems to be a very poor value, as a new vehicle. Then again I saw a $68K Explorer the other day! I'm not convinced that the new ones will retain value anywhere near the older ones. 5-10 years ago a mint used Tacoma or 4 Runner was a very smart investment. We drove a Tacoma from 50K miles to 225K, and sold it for $3500 more than we paid for it. I’m in this market, strictly to buy used. If I were buying new or leasing, I would cast a bigger net. Maybe a domestic truck.

I don't think Landcruisers are overpriced on the used market....if you know how to buy, and buy wisely. Our last three came from Phoenix, Denver, and Texas. I drove each home to Boston. You can buy a very, very nice 1998-2007 LC for less than you might pay for a 4Runner, and for maybe $5K more than a similar aged Tacoma.

I think that one of our recent ones, which we have owned for over 5 years, and put 50K on, could be sold for more that we paid for it. Or close.

The Tacoma and 4 Runners are very expensive, IMO. Check out what Generation One trucks, with automatic transmissions {not my preference} have brought on Bring a Trailer lately. Wow. We have one in the family, with a lot of miles on it. Were it a 125K truck, I think it would be sold to take advantage of the market....and replaced with one that has more miles on it.

High mileage is not an issue on many of these, if they have been taken care of. Or, if you can determine exactly what they need....and negotiate. We had dinner with a friend who just traded in a 3 series BMW, with 58K “because I like to trade ‘em in around 60K. My dad always did that.” His dad would be 100 if alive. I want to buy that guy’s LC!

While we are on this Toyota conversation, one of the most durable "cars" out there were the first and second generation Highlanders. Nothing too exciting about them. Nice V6 as an option, and the "limited" trim {leather, etc.} was nice. I know more than a few that are looking and running almost like new at about 300K miles.

Generally speaking, if you buy one on of these you keep it. Like people once did with say the 2000-2004 Outbacks. I still think those were absolute appliances, but really good ones. Note the case as much with the next generation, in our family.

We have one that may be sold soon, as it is mint, a desired set of options {XT, with the turbo}, low miles and perfect service records. Down to using Motul fluids since new. My daughter likes it, and it’s been great. But she has been asked to sell, in a high end ski town, and the price is frankly TOO HIGH.

So, I think she’ll sell. The car is not that durable, pretty needy, and a few expensive things may pop up. She does not want one, but she should buy 2.5 Sequoias for what she’ll net. We’ll see. She’s good with cars.

She may buy a LC. Loves ours, when home. And had driven cross country at least three times in one. Great on the highway.

Enough........HaHa
 
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nay

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Where to put our skis on our next Toyota 4x4 is a huge quandry.

We've got a lopro box on our MDX that just barely allows it to fit in the garage. The box not going to fit in the garage with a Toyota 4x4.

@Muleski got me thinking about the Lexus LX with the Adjustable Height Control when he mentioned it in the other thread. I looked into it an sounds like that system regularly fails and the cost to fix or remove is outrageous.

Any other options for carrying skis on a Toyota 4x4 and fitting in the garage?

@nay how well do skis fit inside the Sequoia? That's sounding like a good option, but we also carry an enormous amount of other crap for our weekend trips.

One criteria for me for getting the ‘03-‘04 Sequoia was being past the transmission issues of 01-02 and not having the expensive adjustable height suspension stuff that started in ‘05.

I can lay my 188’s across the cargo area corner to corner and they barely fit - that’s with the 3rd row just folded down and not removed, but it shouldn’t make a difference. I always use a box since we still use the 3rd row for family days, but there’s a huge amount of room back there.

Any time you are piling skis and poles in a cargo area it’s going to be an awkward use of space, but it does have the room for it.

My wife doesn’t like driving around with a big cargo box so I will pull it and just store it in the garage. The risk is you forget and hit the garage, although I paid extra when I built my house using the method @SBrown posted and it’s about 9’ high so my rooftop box destruction risk is lower.
 

Muleski

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It’s funny how you look for, and pursue these vehicles if you have the addiction.

On of our more recent LC’s is a 2003. The first year of the five speed transmission. The last year that the transmission came with a dip stick. {You can adapt a 2004-2007, but it’s not cheap}.

It was also the last year that a few were made with no navigation system.

So, I wanted a 2003, no Nav, ideally one knowledgeable owner, completely rust free, from a rust free part of the country. And I’d prefer to have one short of 90K, which is a big service interval....and I’d baseline it all myself. So I could use that on price.

I also wanted to either have the original windshield or to be able to remove the windshield gasket, as if you cheap out on the install, certain rust will follow, years down the road. I found one with a well pitted original windshield. Perfect.

I would travel anywhere for the right truck in the right color, and a somewhat fair price. I bought it in September 2012, in AZ. Still looks brand new.

A young family that I know recently bought a 2010. AFTER they bought it, he asked me to look at it. They quickly sold it back to the place where they bought it, at a loss. The thing was going to be a rust nightmare. So they bought another, in Atlanta. Originally from Tennessee. Much better....And they know how to take care of the frame and body, now.

Sorry to be geeking out on these so much! BTW, I should mention that we are NOT in high elevation. We live right at sea level. Our kitchen may be 15 feet I elevation. Our ski house is at about 3200 feet. So, that has not been an issue for us. But, something to consider.....I think. Though, when I had one of our LC's in CO, and another in Jackson....they seemed to do pretty well.
 
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Mendieta

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I drive the honorable Pugmobile to ski. This is a 2010 Rav 4 Sport. V6, 4WD. I wish Toyota stuck to that design. Later years they made it smaller and more like the honda CRV. I guess I'm not hip enough? :huh:


At the time we also drove the Highlander. This one was more fun to drive and a little smaller. Happy with the tradeoff. Super good acceleration and power uphill. Tje only underpowered component are the breaks IMHO.

Here is how I like to see her:

20180318_202751.jpg


Night before, the car ready for the next morning. Skis, boots, jacket, everything loaded. I fold one seat, but it could be the two. I mostly go solo on day trips, or with my son. Family trips we take both SUV's.
 
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dirt heel pusher
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The big ding on the first gen Sequoia is displacement. 4.7L is small for towing and with full load you’ll get into second gear on steep high altitude passes. Now if you run 33’s or 34’s you can pull 60 mph at reasonable RPM in second, so there’s a bit to the small suspension upgrade lift and bigger tires.

Still, 290 lb/ft isn’t a lot for a V8 - modern V6 are close to that. The V6 won’t have the low end torque curve, but it’s an engine you’d want to add forced induction to for modern V8 power. The ‘05-07 picked up the VVTI engine and it’s added power as well as some interior upgrades, but you have to be careful with the suspension and then tend to price higher.

It sure as hell is no LC, but neither is a 4Runner or a Taco and it’s a tweener size where a Tahoe and the like is really too small to use the third row full time and a Suburban is a bear to drive around daily.

It’s really like having a super winter capable and refined minivan that is likely to go 400-500K and can handle trail access roads and the like. So if you buy one at 250K like I did that’s well maintained, then you are making a pretty damn good bet because you might get 10-15 years out of it without feeling like you are lacking in luxury.

Just buy one with a nice double din touchscreen upgraded stereo that has CarPlay or the Android version in Limited trim and you’re good to go.
 

jmeb

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If Toyota would make a minivan on their truck chassis, they would have my money immediately. Once I've gotten use to a van, it's hard to imagine going to anything else.
 

Muleski

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Have any of you spend much time in a Sienna? Not a heavy duty truck, but seems like a pretty good people and stuff mover, and a good ski vehicle, particularly for a young family.

On the other end of the van spectrum, I think that every ski academy and big ski program has a fleet of Sprinters for good reason. Not a family vehicle for us, but I have seem a few fitted out to camp {year round} and they are nice. I think they're built to last. But honestly, I know very little. I do hear a few friends running ski programs who'll say "Gotta buy two Spinters, and lease another couple...."
 

jmeb

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Sienna is a great vehicle. But it's clearance sucks. 6.6" with that long of a body just doesn't cut it for fire roads in the West. I want a Sienna body on the Tacoma chassis.

Sprinters-style "Eurovans" really are pretty rad if you're gonna camp. Better clearance than Sienna, better MPG than a Sequoia. That's why my next vehicle is probably a Euro-style van.
 

tball

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I can lay my 188’s across the cargo area corner to corner and they barely fit - that’s with the 3rd row just folded down and not removed, but it shouldn’t make a difference.
Thanks, great to know big skis fit in back of the Sequoia. Any reason you see l couldn't build a platform to keep skis underneath with other crap on top, after removing the third row?

I love the idea of a LC. Hate the idea of trying to find a good one. I've kinda given up on the idea, as I don't think my car shopping skills can compete in that leguel.
 
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jmeb

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Thanks, great to know big skis fit in back of the Sequoia. Any reason you see l couldn't build a platform to keep skis underneath with other crap on top, after removing the third row?

I love the idea of a LC. Hate the idea of trying to find a good one. I've kinda given up on the idea, as I don't think my car shopping skills can compete in that leguel.

Should totally work. And double as a sleeping platform!

Source: I did a lot of research on this before buying another van.
 

Plai

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Tje only underpowered component are the breaks IMHO.

FWIW... I always have had to replace the stock rotors w/ "performance rotors" like these on my 4Runners. 3-4 seasons per year from sea level to sierra crests did a job on the stock rotors, usually within the first year. Once the performance rotors were installed, it's been solid since. Yes, better brake pads too ;-)
 

DanoT

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My winter car for a time was a used 1988 Celica All-trac. It was full time 4WD, no high/low range, no engage buttons. I think it had a centre diff. The engine was a very rare for the era, 16valve 2litre turbo. The light weight and low centre of gravity meant that on the highway on compacted snow it could out handle any 4X4 SUV or pickup on the road. However it did not really have enough clearance to deal with fresh snow on my 600ft driveway which fed onto my neighbour's 800ft driveway and then onto a gravel road that was low priority for plowing as we are the only two living down that road in winter.

I replaced it with a used '97 4Runner, 5 speed manual with electronic rear locking diff that didn't work and wasn't needed. 1997 was the first year for the 3.4L 24valve V6, an excellent engine. I had to sell the 4Runner 3 years ago and sooner than I wanted when the Strata Council in my building (summer home) decided to enforce a rule allowing only motorized vehicles and bikes in the underground parking garage. I had been storing my canoe on a cart behind my 4Runner and 93 MR2 (owned since 2000). The solution was to store the canoe on the roof of the 4Runner, except that there was not enough clearance in the garage so the solution was to replace the 4Runner with a AWD wagon.

I chose a 2006 Volvo XC70 with 139k kms, 2.5L, 5cylinder aluminum 20valve turbo and 20cms (8in) ground clearance. It is front wheel drive and decides on its own when to engage the rear wheel AWD system using a fluid differential that I think is called Haldex. While it is not as winter capable as a 4Runner, the Swedes do know how to build very solid cars that work well in winter. This car came with a rare (due to high cost option??) 4C Suspension which monitors suspension travel 500 times per second and adjusts the shock dampening 200 times per second. The handling of this car is superb.
 
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dirt heel pusher
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Should totally work. And double as a sleeping platform!

Source: I did a lot of research on this before buying another van.

x2. A basic gear platform is perfect. Crapton of room back there once the seats are out.
 
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dirt heel pusher
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If Toyota would make a minivan on their truck chassis, they would have my money immediately. Once I've gotten use to a van, it's hard to imagine going to anything else.

They actually had one as a prototype at a recent car show. I forget what it was called.

Although a 4x4 Sprinter is unbeatable if you want to sleep in it. One of those is in my future.
 

DanoT

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They actually had one as a prototype at a recent car show. I forget what it was called.

Although a 4x4 Sprinter is unbeatable if you want to sleep in it. One of those is in my future.

I am not sure if Ram Promaster or Ford Transit will ever come from the factory as a 4X4 but it might be worth waiting for or getting an aftermarket 4X4 conversion.
I do not like Mercedes Sprinter vans.
Unlike Ram and Ford, Mercedes dealerships, which means parts and mechanics, are only found in large cities
Some Sprinter campers after being made into an RV have very little remaining weight caring capacity for people and their gear.
I have heard on Youtube but have not verified, that an oil change requires removing a lot of parts and can cost hundreds of dollars.
If you look around it is not hard to spot older Sprinter vans with rust issues.
 
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Doug Briggs

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I can load bikes on the bike racks and they'll fit in my garage with 8' doors. The rack got bent when the door broke and didn't open all the way. The bike survived. The rack still works, too.
20170616_094714_Queen Of The West Road.jpg

I'm going to have to rethink this when I build my custom topper, though.
 

Doug Briggs

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rummage sale 026.JPG
rummage sale 048.JPG

I drove a couple friends up on Baldy as far as I dared. They came back with a single headlamp between the two of them after one had technical difficulties skiing.
 

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