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What is “Edging”?

Average Joe

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I’ve read multiple comments here that refer to “edging,” and I don’t understand exactly what it is.

In race coaching, “edging” isn’t something we work on, and I’ve never taken a PSIA clinic.

So in a ski school, do instructors teach “edging?” And how do they describe or demonstrate it?
 

Unpiste

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Speaking as a student, one thing I’ve noticed more and more as I progress is the ability to feel and respond to what’s going on with each portion of the ski edge without looking or really even thinking about it (unless I’m trying to focus on something in particular). That’s basically what I’d take the term to mean as a general skill.
 

Bad Bob

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Would say it could be a noun or a verb. The act of tipping your skis off of the bases being the verb.
A whole range of skills from feathering to high angle railroad tracks and the range skills involved to make those changes being the noun.

Perhaps brought to the most basic description, skiing is sliding and edging.
 

David Chaus

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Or in PSIA-speak, control edge engagement through a combination of inclination and angulation. So we’re actually working on what our bodies are doing, with clean edge engagement being the outcome we’re looking for.
 

LiquidFeet

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What are we talking about? The term "edging" is a big umbrella term covering a ton of stuff, isn't it? This discussion can go in any number of directions.

Are we talking about how high or low we choose to get our skis up on edge?
Are we talking about how we get skis tipped onto new edges at turn initiation?
Are we talking about how we get off those edges?
Are we talking about how we get grip for carving pencil-thin lines in the snow?
Are we talking about how we manipulate carved turn radius?
Are we talking about how ski-snow edge angle impacts non-carved turns?
Are we talking about when and how we increase and decrease the ski-snow edge angle?
Are we talking about whether or how we teach "edging" to beginners and intermediates?

or...
Are we talking about whether we think about edge angles as we ski, or whether we think about other things and edge angles develop as a by-product of those other things?
 
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Thread Starter
TS
Average Joe

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Do you talk about "tipping"? Same thing.
With the 14, 15, 16 year old racers I don’t use the word tipping. I prefer to describe it as “rolling them up on edge”. More of a dynamic description. In addition, “tipping” sounds too much like tipping over, and we’re always working to keep from falling inside.
Curious as to how the Canadian ski school model differs from PSIA as the thread progresses.
 

markojp

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With the 14, 15, 16 year old racers I don’t use the word tipping. I prefer to describe it as “rolling them up on edge”. More of a dynamic description. In addition, “tipping” sounds too much like tipping over, and we’re always working to keep from falling inside.
Curious as to how the Canadian ski school model differs from PSIA as the thread progresses.

I think we're into semantic land already and it's only the first page. Well played!
 

markojp

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I think we're into semantic land already and it's only the first page. Well played!

This wasn't directed at the OP as a troll, just a quickening of the inevitable course that instructional threads take. We know exactly what we think we're talking about... until we talk to someone else.
:beercheer:
 

razie

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In race coaching, “edging” isn’t something we work on

Isn't that a/the problem though? :rolleyes: I mean, to answer my own question: based on my own experience, it is a huge problem.

But, to get to the point: in traditional race coaching and instructing, edging involves any manner and ability of putting your skis on edge, based on the premise that, no matter what else you do, to get deflection across the hill, the skis better be on edge.

Some even describe this as "a combination of inclination and angulation" as if we put the skis on edge with the hips and compensate with the shoulders (which most skiers and racers do, to be honest).

Those "in the know" would talk about "foot tipping" to drive the focus back on the feet and "rolling the ankles", where it belongs.

So - what is edging? Any combination of foot tipping, inclination of COM and angulation that allows you to create edge angles. :geek: The order of focus on those dictates how well the edging is done... the best start tipping the feet and counterbalance the body on top of the feet, as needed - i.e. a lot of visible lower body activity (tipping) and invisible upper body activity (counterbalance).


The way the inclination of COM is created is another big discriminator between great and bad: did you send the skis up and away or you just dropped the hips?

In terms of the approach up north... on the instructing side, it's mostly about managing outcomes as opposed to inputs (so manage "grip" as opposed to "tipping"). On the race coaching side though, edging and lower body involvement is very much a focus, with roller blade drills and "rolling your ankles" etc. The fact that a good biomechanics description is lacking obviously generates a huge misunderstanding and allows way too much personal interpretation, way more than even Darwin would probably require for someone to be able to say "my racers are better trained than your racers"... so nobody can really claim that.
 
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oldschoolskier

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It is easy to understand why you are confused as “edging” depends on how it is used.

So when you tip the ski you put the ski on edge. However this does not mean you engage the edge as this depends on how you apply the pressure to the edge. Parallel to the snow surface you slide even though you are on edge, pushing the ski into the snow surface engages the edge (this is a very gross description to get the point across).

Ideally edging is a balance of the two to maximize the effect causing your ski to grip and/or carve.

Hopefully this helps in understanding its meaning. The fine details I’ll leave to the instructors of the group.
 

LiquidFeet

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Do I teach "edging" to my students? More often indirectly. As in, do this and see what happens (a turn happens). How do you think that happened? We eventually get to the skis turning the skier because they were on edge.

When I teach it directly, I might say bend that inside leg more, try to get its thigh horizontal this time and see what happens. Keep the outside leg long. (I prefer saying bend rather than flex.) Were you successful? If yes, how was the turn different? What do you think made that happen? We eventually get to talking about the skis, both of them, ending up on higher edges, thus turning the skier in a shorter radius turn. Well, I guess I would call this indirect too, since I wouldn't be using the word "edge" as a verb.

I rarely get a chance to teach these things. My clients take one hour privates, and we more often have some very deeply embedded habits that need to be replaced by appropriate fundamental movement patterns that they somehow missed learning in the past. Manipulating edge angles is far too subtle a thing for these clients to deal with in a one hour lesson.

Teaching the manipulation of edge angles to a wedge skier requires them to do many unfamiliar movements. I usually don't do much with edge angle control in those novice lessons, even though they sometimes last 1.5 hours (I love that luxurious extra half hour).

I work on edging in my own skiing as a means of controlling turn radius.
 

martyg

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From the Urban Dictionary:

Edging
Getting seconds away from climax and stopping, waiting for a few more seconds then start again, do this a few more times then you are meant to have a amazing long climax and you feel great.

Kind of the same on skis...
 
Thread Starter
TS
Average Joe

Average Joe

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From the Urban Dictionary:

Edging
Getting seconds away from climax and stopping, waiting for a few more seconds then start again, do this a few more times then you are meant to have a amazing long climax and you feel great.

Kind of the same on skis...

I think we have a winner.....:)
Not what was expected when starting he thread, but in these tough times we can often use a good laugh !
 

martyg

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I think we have a winner.....:)
Not what was expected when starting he thread, but in these tough times we can often use a good laugh !

Well, I did win a Helly Hansen kit for this letter.

@Philpug what say you? I am sure that Brady will see the humor! :)

1001 uses for a plastic bag....jpeg
 

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