We Don't Talk About Altitude Sickness Enough

[Rainbow Jenny]

I've basically had some form of altitude sickness every time I've flown in to Colorado and tried to do something athletic the following day. I've puked all over the Maroon Bells trail in Aspen and wound up in the ER there, so by comparison, the A-basin experience was much better. :/ I remember either @jimmy or @James saying that they knew I was doing better when I said I wanted to go shopping (which meant I was probably still not thinking clearly since I actually don't like to shop)!

For me, it takes my body too long to adjust to being at that high elevation that if all I have is a short weekend, I'm better off going to Utah.

You're the perfect candidate for skiing Hokkaido...

 

[Jim McDonald]

or Hakuba, or Nozawa...

 

[Don in Morrison]

I've lived in or around Denver all my life, and I've never had any issues with altitude while skiing, or walking around on top of Pike's Peak or Mount Evans after driving up there, but I've failed both attempts to hike up a couple of the easier fourteeners. I got real sick about 2-300 vertical feet below the top of Grays Peak (dehydration, probably) and got to about 12500 on Mount Bierstadt with a scout troop when one of the boys got sick and needed to turn around. I probably wouldn't have made it anyway, from the way I felt when I got back to the parking lot.

 

[SBrown]

I've lived in or around Denver all my life, and I've never had any issues with altitude while skiing, or walking around on top of Pike's Peak or Mount Evans after driving up there, but I've failed both attempts to hike up a couple of the easier fourteeners. I got real sick about 2-300 vertical feet below the top of Grays Peak (dehydration, probably) and got to about 12500 on Mount Bierstadt with a scout troop when one of the boys got sick and needed to turn around. I probably wouldn't have made it anyway, from the way I felt when I got back to the parking lot.

Yeah, I have family members born and raised here, extensive time living and recreating at and above 9K, and still can't get to 14K w/o getting sick.

 

[Eleeski]

Comes down to this: altitude sickness of any sort can strike anyone at altitude at any tme. Just because it hasn't happened to you yet, doesn't mean it won't...and it can be deadly. So, whether it is the kind that give you a bit aof a headache, nausea, vomiting & even diarrhea, or HAPE (high altitutde pumonary edema) or HACE (high altitude cerebral edema), you need to be prepared. Hydration AND good sleep can help to prevent, as can medications such as diamox & decadron. I have a friend that used to live at 9k feet, and anytime she did any type of backcountry skiing with her husband, she had to medicate with decadron & diamox. I have another friend who is an accomplished mountaineer, and for the last 3 years, he can't go above 13.5k without becoming confused and disoriented. With the onset of any symptoms, the first thing to do is get TO A LOWER ALTITUDE! I'll say it again, any type of altitude sicknes can be deadly. Don't take the chance.

Do you see lots of HACE or HAPE among ski resort visitors? Or is what we call altitude sickness something else?

There is no discussion of any altitude sickness in the pilot world associated with altitudes below 12,500 feet. Obviously higher altitudes have severe consequences. We are encouraged to get in an altitude chamber to know what happens with pressurization failures. Including loss of consciousness. Maybe the times of exposure are different but HACE and HAPE aren't common.

My mother sometimes gets tachycardia at altitude. Serious and related to elevation but not true altitude sickness. This is an age related effect, she used to be fine being active up high. She did fine last summer at Squaw's base. But we were pretty attentive.

Eric

 

[Monique]

I think @SBrown and I have both talked about having issues sleeping above 10k feet, despite living in the Denver area. When I rented a room in Breck at 10.7k and slept there on the weekends, I would wake up gasping once or twice the first night. I don't remember ever having that when sleeping in the main town, which is 9.6k, even though I do have insomnia sometimes at that level. Which is just to say, if you're having modest altitude sickness, it's surprising what a difference a few hundred feet can make.

I couldn't find the altitude supplement listed upthread - I did find another one with ginkgo (but probably not the other ingredient mentioned) - anyway, gonna try taking that before my weekend trips (yay, more pills!) and see if it helps me sleep.

 

[jimmy]

I've basically had some form of altitude sickness every time I've flown in to Colorado and tried to do something athletic the following day. I've puked all over the Maroon Bells trail in Aspen and wound up in the ER there, so by comparison, the A-basin experience was much better. :/ I remember either @jimmy or @James saying that they knew I was doing better when I said I wanted to go shopping (which meant I was probably still not thinking clearly since I actually don't like to shop)!

For me, it takes my body too long to adjust to being at that high elevation that if all I have is a short weekend, I'm better off going to Utah.

Oh I remember we went shopping for shoes, you were still in ski boots.

 

[pais alto]

Do you see lots of HACE or HAPE among ski resort visitors?

In my 12 years patrolling at one of the highest ski area in the US (over 12k ft at the top), no.

Or is what we call altitude sickness something else?

Well, HAPE and HACE are very severe altitude-caused sickness but most of the time we're talking about fatigue, shortness of breath, nausea, headache, dizziness, insomnia, tachycardia..
http://www.healthline.com/health/acute-mountain-sickness#overview1

 

[SkiNurse]

Do you see lots of HACE or HAPE among ski resort visitors? Or is what we call altitude sickness something else?

The answer to your question is yes & yes. The worst cases we see IS the HACE or HAPE, the "milder" versions (which can still be deadly) we see more often. We see the "mild" version even with people that are just visiting Denver. The HACE & HAPE, or the mild one, can happen at any of the Colorado altitudes....not just in the mountain towns.

 

[Ken_R]

The number of folks who end up in the ER on vacation with Dehydration and altitude sickness may surprise many! I have had conversations with ER staff about what they see. Too often folks come into town from low level locations and proceed to drink too much coffee, alcohol and not nearly enough water, The result is not only altitude sickness but quite often its dehydration. Thats a topic that never gets discussed. People not drinking enough water AND not using humidifiers in their hotel/condos is a recipe for a trip to the ER.

Alcohol is a huge culprit. I always tell people who come to Colorado to respect the altitude and avoid alcoholic drinks the first few days on the mountains and to keep well hydrated and take it easy on the first day or two. Most dont have issues.

I live here and have not have any issues but still respect it. It is something one has to be aware of and not ignore the symptoms.

I have cycled up to 12k feet and been fine. Other than loosing a bit of power production (15% or so) I have enjoyed it.

 

[dbostedo]

Things can definitely vary ... I live at about 400 feet, and I've stayed on trips at over 8,000 feet 4 times now, with varying effects :

• First time - Vail, Feb. 2015
  • Flew to Denver, and drove straight to Vail with a lunch stop and a single beer on the way up (did not drink after that)
  • Had pretty severe headache that evening with some nausea
  • Slept very fitfully with occasional mild headache in mornings for the 4 nights I was there
• Second - Aspen, Feb. 2016
  • Flew to Aspen, did not drink alcohol for the first couple of days
  • No major issues, some sleep trouble/easy fatigue
• Third - Mammoth, March 2016
  • Flew to LA and drove to Mammoth
  • No major issues, some sleep trouble
• Fourth - Copper, April 2017
  • Drove up after several days in Colorado Springs
  • No major issues, slept well

Things have generally been better with each trip based on the different circumstances around them. I think my Vail issues may have been more related to lack of sleep which tends to give me headaches anyway. That trip started mid-week after some long work days to get the time off.

So my thinking for myself is start drinking extra fluids a day or two before, and make sure I get enough sleep heading into the trip. (Or have acclimation time like my Copper trip.) Hopefully that will continue to work for me.

 

[jimmy]

I work at a ski area where the base is 10.3k ft and the top is over 12k ft and one thing I notice is that I start breathing deeply, like a runner, automatically just going up steps or walking up hill. Some people not familiar with altitude don't do that and they get a little freaked out when they find themselves gasping for air. I tell folks "breathe early, breathe often" and lots of times they are more comfortable when they realize that it's just that there isn't as much air and of course they're going to have to breathe more deeply.

And when folks come into the patrol aid room with headaches, dizziness, shortness of breath, and nausea, they get their vitals and history taken and a quick exam to rule out other issues, which is very important. If there is no other suspected cause, they get O2, usually via nasal cannula, and they have to read and sign a page with information about altitude sickness that essentially tells them that though they are likely to feel a lot better after getting O2 going to lower altitude is the cure.

IME as a patroller, fitness isn't really a factor for altitude issues, but people that don't have a basic level of fitness may find themselves exhausted and sick from altitude, which is an uncomfortable experience. Nutrition, rest, hydration, and time at altitude seem to have an effect.

I remember my first ski trip to CO, Kneale told us it is just important to EXHALE deeply.......................

 

[dbostedo]

I've heard some people suggest that doing something physical as soon as you get to high altitude can help (a short jog, workout, or even a good walk)... anyone have any experience with that? Does hitting the gym when you arrive help?

 

[PTskier]

there was something about sugar( glucose). It makes sense, with the metabolic changes happening at altitude.

Table sugar is sucrose. Glucose is available as the OTC tablets diabetics carry in case of sudden low blood sugar.

 

[jimmy]

That' interesting Dave. I spent cinco de mayo walking/drinking our way through lodo with my son, then on arrival in summit county took a nice long walk from the Best Western to REI to the dispensary and back. Maybe that does work, didn't hurt

 

[PTskier]

Getting a cold or flu on a ski trip is most likely due to the hours spent in the a̶l̶u̶m̶i̶n̶u̶m̶ ̶t̶u̶b̶e̶ ̶g̶e̶r̶m̶ ̶i̶n̶c̶u̶b̶a̶t̶o̶r̶ aircraft.

Caffeine and alcohol are both diuretics. Skip them to help your hydration.

 

[dbostedo]

Getting a cold or flu on a ski trip is most likely due to the hours spent in the a̶l̶u̶m̶i̶n̶u̶m̶ ̶t̶u̶b̶e̶ ̶g̶e̶r̶m̶ ̶i̶n̶c̶u̶b̶a̶t̶o̶r̶ aircraft.

Caffeine and alcohol are both diuretics. Skip them to help your hydration.

The only problem there is I'm basically addicted to caffeine and get headaches if I don't have it.

 

[pais alto]

The only problem there is I'm basically addicted to caffeine and get headaches if I don't have it.

If you believe things you read on the internet, caffeine does not seem to be a diuretic:
http://www.mayoclinic.org/healthy-l...xpert-answers/caffeinated-drinks/faq-20057965
http://answers.webmd.com/answers/1166858/is-caffeine-a-diuretic

Does this place need a coffee emoticon?

 

[Monique]

The only problem there is I'm basically addicted to caffeine and get headaches if I don't have it.

I've read that after not that much time, sure enough, caffeine no longer enhances your performance, just brings you back up to baseline. Just like you'd expect for any drug.

I used to get terrible headaches Saturday mornings because the extra couple of hours of sleep in the morning gave me caffeine headeaches. I'd quit, binge, quit, binge. I finally got sick enough of it to kick it for good. I've been off of caffeine now and have been for over 15 years. I will *very occasionally* drink caffeine, only ever for flavor, never to self-medicate/wake me up. If I'm feeling tired, I won't let myself drink caffeine.

Not telling anyone they have to quit, but it did help me.

 

[Pequenita]

Very ironically, though, diamox is a diuretic.