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fatbob

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Brands would be well served to forget about graphics altogether and focus on a coherent and concise range of skis. I was kinda sickened when I went to SIA and saw the vast ranges that the majors were punting - how on earth any store let alone consumer is supposed to pick the gems from all that chaff? I truly think it's fine to have variants in the same ski - carbon, with metal, without, softened flex(aka women model) but no need to have so many different models that effectively achieve the same thing. At the end of the day outside the extremes - enthusiasts who know exactly what they want and like from a WC flex race ski to a super soft pow plaything, most people are after the same 4 things: a piste basher, a mainly piste with a little bit of dabble off the side, a getting more into off piste or a mainly off piste but still fun on the groomers. So you could hit 80% of your market with 4 well thought out models.
 
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Brands would be well served to forget about graphics altogether and focus on a coherent and concise range of skis. I was kinda sickened when I went to SIA and saw the vast ranges that the majors were punting - how on earth any store let alone consumer is supposed to pick the gems from all that chaff? I truly think it's fine to have variants in the same ski - carbon, with metal, without, softened flex(aka women model) but no need to have so many different models that effectively achieve the same thing. At the end of the day outside the extremes - enthusiasts who know exactly what they want and like from a WC flex race ski to a super soft pow plaything, most people are after the same 4 things: a piste basher, a mainly piste with a little bit of dabble off the side, a getting more into off piste or a mainly off piste but still fun on the groomers. So you could hit 80% of your market with 4 well thought out models.
The vast over production and segments within segements within segements have gotten way out of hand for sure and a subject for it's own talk show for sure.
 

fatbob

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PS I 'm partly playing devil's advocate here to Phil's "no bad skis just skis that are bad for specific people" maxim which would point toward maximum choice being a good thing.
 

hbear

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Except when the OEMs have to produce a silly number of ski models (not to mention sizes within the models) and expect shops to inventory them. Guess who is left holding the bag when all those variations don't sell. Now I can't speak for ski shops, but in the golf world the retailer doesn't get cash back from having to carry and now drastically slash prices when the stock is "old news" but instead they get "net backs" on the purchase of future equipment which doesn't directly address the stale inventory they have on the shelves.

As a consumer, it's great to pick up "new old gear" at steep discounts, but don't think this has any significant benefit to the industry overall. Again looking at the golf equipment market as an example, pretty much zero hard good equipment manufactures break even....most all are underwater as far as profits go. They remain in business because ancillary businesses or other businesses in the company conglomerate have profits to offset. E.g. Ping is privately held so we don't know exact figures but also know the family's main line of business revolves around engineering for department of defense contracts, Titleist only has a hard goods presence which they lose money on in order to help them sell more golf balls which are better margin, Callaway just plain out loses money like a sieve, Taylormade [or I should say Adidas their parent company is trying to get rid of them] has been shopping for a buyer with little known interest because of horrible profit figures, Nike just killed their hard goods business because it was such a drag on overall profits....staying in clothing however, Mizuno loses money on golf but makes up for it with their other sporting good lines, and those are the big players....we haven't even address the countless smaller operations which are now out of business.

Then when we get to the retail side, effectively the business practice (short product cycles, lots of inventory choice for consumers) have driven pretty much all the mom and pop golf shops out of business and paved the way for the big box golf stores to take over (who else can afford to carry all the inventory, live with the net backs, etc.) but now we are seeing many of those giants struggle as well. Also no coincidence we are seeing much more apparel dominating the golf shops (and ski shops as well) because of margins. Golf like skiing isn't exactly a growing industry......and interesting to see as an observer how that industry went from 2 year product cycles to 6 month cycles at one point and the ultimate knock on effect to the equipment side of the industry. Lots of parallels to skiing so interesting to see how it plays out for skiing.
 

chemist

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There will still be one year cycles because sometimes graphics or colors will just get missed that decision has to be made well before sell through or how the customer likes it but more from how the initial buy's are from the retailer. Focus groups are being held now for 2018-19 gear, the 2017-18 gear for the msot part is done other than some fine tuning/tweaking. If a product misses...there is always the back up plan of turning it over after the first year.

What about the Southern Hemisphere's ski equipment market (Australia, NZ, Argentina and Chile)—does this lead or follow the north's in new-model-year introduction, or does it vary?
 
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What about the Southern Hemisphere's ski equipment market (Australia, NZ, Argentina and Chile)—does this lead or follow the north's in new-model-year introduction, or does it vary?
They are a few months head but quite frankly tiny. I am not sure if even all manufacturers distribute skis down under.
 

Uncle-A

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2-year-cycle-petersen-graphic-2-72dpi-jpg.14889

Al’s Discount Sports and Appliances.
Hey!!! I never sold Appliances. LOL
 

green26

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I'm probably not an outlier on the curve. But i love my beat-to-hell 2014 bonafides. they're pretty ugly. Weird. What sells me is that, like on a body, every scar reminds me of something or some time, good, bad... or incredible. Its rare that new stuff has soul. not impossible, just rare. same goes for all my ski stuff. Newest doesn't interest me. Good stuff that is capable of accruing a lot of experiences does though. We get to know and respect each other. same with socks, layers, of course boots... all friends.
 

mdf

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I have noticed that the same ski as my Head Mojo 80 (2008) kept showing up every year with a different name and graphic design every year after that. I think they finally dropped it last year. I'm glad I bought mine when I did. The graphics on all the ones that followed have been horrible.

We all like to think we are above caring about topsheet graphics. You don't seem them when you are skiing, after all. But hey, you see a lot of them on the lift. And I will admit it -- if I dislike the graphics it will eat at me.

When I bought my most recent pair of skis, I was glad to find a 2 year old pair instead of 1 year old because I liked the graphics better.
 

chemist

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Ron

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Heres my .02 A manufacturer that keeps its graphics like the venerable MX series is on par with other high-end products (AKA Arc teryx, & non-ski related) . Keep things simple and clean. It isn't sold by mere graphics, its sold and bought by performance and reputation. Although you need to change with technology and advancements in design and materials, there's no need to change your stripes every season. To me, a manufacturer that keeps their ski's graphics simple and relatively unchanged, is confident in their product.
 

Rod Swank

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Rumor has it that Lange is in their cycle to re-do the blue boot. I hear some technical and cosmetic changes will be introduced next season.
 
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Rumor has it that Lange is in their cycle to re-do the blue boot. I hear some technical and cosmetic changes will be introduced next season.
You are hearing correctly, a huge revamp with only one collection carrying over.
 

Michael Kane

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what would be the collection that is carrying over & are you hearing any changes to the RX line?
 
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Philpug

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what would be the collection that is carrying over & are you hearing any changes to the RX line?
The new XT Tour are carrying over. I do not know the particulars of what is happening with the RX/RS/TX/SX collections...yet. As successful as these collections of skis are, I don't expect much more than an evolutionary chance.
 

SBrown

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The new XT Tour are carrying over. I do not know the particulars of what is happening with the RX/RS/TX/SX collections...yet. As successful as these collections of skis are, I don't expect much more than an evolutionary chance.

Are they making smaller sizes in the women's version?
 
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Are they making smaller sizes in the women's version?
Not sure abotu that but manufacturers do run into an issue with replacable soles with pint sized boots.
 

Muleski

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The new XT Tour are carrying over. I do not know the particulars of what is happening with the RX/RS/TX/SX collections...yet. As successful as these collections of skis are, I don't expect much more than an evolutionary chance.

Will be interesting to see. I think "Why mess with success?", and it sure seems like like most of their lineup is doing well...The RS/RX and obviously the plug boots. XT has been a big seller, too, hasn't it?

I wonder what the tooling cost is for them to launch a whole new boot, in a full run of sizes? Has to be significant.

Guess we'll see how much is cosmetic, new buckles, new liners versus a real relaunch soon enough. Redoing the RS and "Z" blue boots would surprise me. Big following, huge in kid size soft flex RS.

Interesting....
 

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