Mid-Atlantic The Neverending Timberline, WV: Info, Weather, and Stoke

[fishnski]

Dont be Fooled by our warmth in the East...it has been brutally cold from AK down thru canada and Winter is coming to a ski area near you soon..stay tuned!

 

[wvrocks]

 

[Jim Kenney]

Thanks for sharing WVRocks!
Summarizing a few comments from Jonathan Davis, Assistant General Manager of Perfect Slopes North, new owners of Timberline, WV:
They are going to keep the name Timberline.
They are going to replace at least one top-to-bottom chairlift.
They plan to invest in snowmaking.
They are "100% in" on this project!
They plan to reopen Timberline by Thanksgiving 2020.
They do 250k skier visits per winter at Perfect Slopes North.
They own the Timberline ski area proper and are not involved in any additional real estate near the resort at Timberline and have no interest in getting into real estate there. They will be focused on ski area operations.

 

[Cameron]

I'm not going to lie, I'm jealous that T-Line is getting a new lift and we are still stuck with the decrepit triple to the top of the hill at PNS that drips grease like no other but if my season pass is good at both places I'll be OK with it for a while longer.

 

[Kemperski]

Fun video as an example for what Perfect may (hopefully!) do:

Really liked the video.

I'm curious about others experience with the conveyor lifts, aside from one I rode somewhere high on Alta, where there were no beginners, I have not found they actually make for much quicker ride times -- the new one at Beech Mountain for example was certainly a disappointment.

Also, I'm very stoked about everything that is happening with T-line now and want it to be a very successful venture for Perfect North, they seem like the best fit anyone could have hoped for. If they succeed with all that is needed for a top to bottom opening next November it will be a remarkable accomplishment. With the return of even a slightly above average winter there will be some spectacular days because unfortunately PN will not get the crowds back immediately so it could make for some great skiing from a selfish point of view.

I also hope new owners will be committed to the glade skiing that sets T-line apart, don't really care about more thinning but maybe removing some of the dead fall and the tops that the previous @#$% owners allowed timber operations to just leave laying on the ground

 

[dbostedo]

I have not found they actually make for much quicker ride times...

They don't do anything for ride times. They are just supposed to prevent loading delays - make it easier for everyone to move forward together. That's why initially they were focused on beginner lifts... but it seems to be expanding to many lifts.

 

[Cameron]

PNS has one and myself and many I ski with it feels like they actually run the lift slower than prior to the conveyor.

 

[crgildart]

They don't do anything for ride times. They are just supposed to prevent loading delays - make it easier for everyone to move forward together. That's why initially they were focused on beginner lifts... but it seems to be expanding to many lifts.

The ride up is definitely is slower when the lift has to stop to clean up loading ramp yard sales.

 

[sparty]

They don't do anything for ride times. They are just supposed to prevent loading delays - make it easier for everyone to move forward together. That's why initially they were focused on beginner lifts... but it seems to be expanding to many lifts.

I'm not sure about the U.S., but apparently Europe allows rope speeds to be 12-15% higher with a conveyor load than without (on a fixed-grip chair).

c.f. https://mountainscholar.org/bitstream/handle/11124/70522/n5-Russell_Maynard-Final.pdf?sequence=1

I can't find anything public-source as to whether or not the US (ANSI B77) spec allows for a higher rope speed with a conveyor or not.

 

[mmcshane]

Isn’t the next bankruptcy hearing scheduled for this week?

Bankruptcy hearing was this week- looks like what happened was that

1)investment banker who marketed the property (Griffin Financial & )the sale manager got approved for payment.

2) There is still no decision as to how the rest of the proceeds will be distributed to the creditors and its seems like they are up to no good, even still. Doc filed a motion to immediately receive $750,000 of the proceeds, saying that is how much the 220 acres that he added to the sale of the resort (that were in his name only) are worth-the US trustee filed an objection to that motion + that is set for hearing on 2/5. In the meantime, the creditors committee filed notices of depositions of Doc, Fred + Tracy + Thomas Whalen (anyone know who he is?) as well as subpoenas for documents from various banks. Those depositions are scheduled for 1/28 at the lawyers' office in PA. I've attached motion + objection if anyone interested.

 

[Kemperski]

Jesus Christ they are scumbags -- not sure what this means exactly, it doesn't affect Perfect North proceeding I assume?

Does this mean that local people or contractors are being screwed being at the end of the feeding chain? I hope not.

Thanks for keeping up with this

 

[mmcshane]

Jesus Christ they are scumbags -- not sure what this means exactly, it doesn't affect Perfect North proceeding I assume?

Does this mean that local people or contractors are being screwed being at the end of the feeding chain? I hope not.

Thanks for keeping up with this

Does not affect Perfect North sale at all. That has happened, the money is in escrow, its now just figuring out who gets owed what. There is a long line of secured creditors and unsecured creditors. Probably one of the biggest and local ones is the Canaan Valley Public Service District (which is also now the receiver who runs what used to be Timberline Utilities). The only people who have any claim to the proceeds had to have already filed a claim with the court saying they are a creditor, not sure how many there are. But it sure seems like everyone else should get paid before Doc (who is majority owner of all the companies who filed bankruptcy and who filed personal bankruptcy) walks away with $750,000.

 

[JohnL]

Really liked the video.

I also hope new owners will be committed to the glade skiing that sets T-line apart, don't really care about more thinning but maybe removing some of the dead fall and the tops that the previous @#$% owners allowed timber operations to just leave laying on the ground

Most of what is down is stupid fall, not logging or deadfall. As in don’t give a chainsaw and loppers to people who don’t ski trees and don’t what they are doing. And if you have stupid fall, cart it out or chip it.

‘And make sure you leave a Bush buffer between glades and trails to safely control access to and exit from glades.

The Thunder from Heaven blue glade was way over thinned by stupid fall. Used to be really, really sweet if you entered up high. And lower CB and Spinal Tap had some brush areas that created nice slots to ski through. Last tree skiing years, meh. I suppose some of it is growing back though.

To better maintain a glade, it is essential to maintain a tree canopy to stunt brush growth. Unfortunately, large sections of the canopy are gone, so you need to let brush and young trees grow in spots.

Some storm damage fall in selected spots up high. Be good to remove some of that.

 

[Johnfmh]

Thanks for sharing WVRocks!
Summarizing a few comments from Jonathan Davis, Assistant General Manager of Perfect Slopes North, new owners of Timberline, WV:
They are going to keep the name Timberline.
They are going to replace at least one top-to-bottom chairlift.
They plan to invest in snowmaking.
They are "100% in" on this project!
They plan to reopen Timberline by Thanksgiving 2020.
They do 250k skier visits per winter at Perfect Slopes North.
They own the Timberline ski area proper and are not involved in any additional real estate near the resort at Timberline and have no interest in getting into real estate there. They will be focused on ski area operations.

I agree with everything Perfect North is doing except the decision to keep the name. I never liked the Timberline name because people confuse it with Timberline Lodge in Oregon and also because the true timberline in Tucker county is well above 4,200 feet. I also feel the brand has been irreparably damaged by the former owners. Rebranding is what is needed to convince skeptics that the resort has turned the page and will be significantly different from the Timberline of last season. It is a great marketing opportunity that will be missed.

 

[teebrews]

I agree with everything Perfect North is doing except the decision to keep the name. I never liked the Timberline name because people confuse it with Timberline Lodge in Oregon and also because the true timberline in Tucker county is well above 4,200 feet. I also feel the brand has been irreparably damaged by the former owners. Rebranding is what is needed to convince skeptics that the resort has turned the page and will be significantly different from the Timberline of last season. It is a great marketing opportunity that will be missed.

"Timberline WV, a Perfect Resort" is a great name. The name was never the problem. There's plenty of marketing to be done, no opportunity lost. Jerry Sandusky of the Baltimore Ravens (announcer) didn't change his name and rightfully so. Conservative values best represent human nature. It's Lee-Jackson memorial highway. It's Jerry Sandusky. It's Timberline. Build it and people will come. No need to rewrite history like Orson Wells 1984.

Edit: deleted odhominem attack

 

[fishnski]

Timberline...a Perfect Resort...I can see the Negative Smurfs complaint list now...I go to a seaside bar n grill that advertises warm Beer and Lousy food..SQUASHED...no complaints!

 

[James]

'm curious about others experience with the conveyor lifts, aside from one I rode somewhere high on Alta, where there were no beginners, I have not found they actually make for much quicker ride times -- the new one at Beech Mountain for example was certainly a disappointment.

Okemo put in conveyors at the top and bottom of a fixed quad. There's two quads right next to each other. When it's busy both run.

The theory is it speeds up actual skiers/hr because of less stoppages due to people falling. That was the theory. In running them, there were lots of problems. Beginners don't have the issue, it's returning skiers who've never seen it. They freak out, try to stop in a wedge on the plastic and fall; don't come out at the right time, etc.
That lift also had a conveyor at the top too. That was a lityle freaky at first. Don't look down, seems like your doing like 30mph.

The damn thing was always breaking. Either the top or bottom. So it's down for that. Then people are falling. After 3-4 yrs we got rid of the top conveyor.
That was good.

People seem to be more used to it. Lots of kids love it. It's easier to load if you just stand there and don't panic. People still have problems with one of those.
All in all, meh. I don't think it's done much at all. For never evers, it's probably a plus.

Timberline WV, a Perfect Resort"

Yeah, no. Drop the second part.

 

[scottyb]

Old Tline

Nu Tline

Done

 

[teebrews]

Timberline...a Perfect Resort...I can see the Negative Smurfs complaint list now...I go to a seaside bar n grill that advertises warm Beer and Lousy food..SQUASHED...no complaints!

Yessir! Complains will continue to be heard the second Tuesday of next week. Speaking of names that actually do need to be changed (and this is an obvious one) - simply remove "Herz Mountain" from the trail map. It's Cabin Mountain or no reference.

Traditional heartland values from the mid-west. Fix the real problems, ignore everything else. The Perfect rep said it best in the interview video. Operate a ski area professionally and the rest will take care of itself. There's good memories in the name and adults in the room.

 

[teebrews]

Okemo put in conveyors at the top and bottom of a fixed quad. There's two quads right next to each other. When it's busy both run.

The theory is it speeds up actual skiers/hr because of less stoppages due to people falling. That was the theory. In running them, there were lots of problems. Beginners don't have the issue, it's returning skiers who've never seen it. They freak out, try to stop in a wedge on the plastic and fall; don't come out at the right time, etc.
That lift also had a conveyor at the top too. That was a lityle freaky at first. Don't look down, seems like your doing like 30mph.

The damn thing was always breaking. Either the top or bottom. So it's down for that. Then people are falling. After 3-4 yrs we got rid of the top conveyor.
That was good.

People seem to be more used to it. Lots of kids love it. It's easier to load if you just stand there and don't panic. People still have problems with one of those.
All in all, meh. I don't think it's done much at all. For never evers, it's probably a plus.

Yeah, no. Drop the second part.

Second part Dropped!