California/Nevada Squaw Valley to discuss removing slur against Native Americans from California resort’s name.

[Carl Kuck]

I guess I'll have to ditch the various t-shirts I've collected over the years...

 

[François Pugh]

It is truly a sad commentary on the state of affairs and human nature in general that somehow the word for woman in an original native language has apparently become a derogatory slur.

 

[Unpiste]

Years ago my Grandmother had two Native Americans working for her. They lived at the Reno-Sparks Indian Colony. I asked one if she preferred Native American or Indian. She said she didn't care; the sign at the colony said Indian and she was fine with that.

Discussion on the subject is good and the name may change. On the other hand it may not be as offensive as some people think it is or should be.

These things are always complex. I've heard (though don't claim to be an authority myself) that "Indian" is actually preferable to a significant portion of the native population in the US. My understanding is that they see "Native American" as somewhat taking away from their identity, as it applies just as much to the native cultures and peoples in the US as it does to the rest of the Americas. From my understanding, this is why we still have the Bureau of Indian Affairs, for instance.

 

[raisingarizona]

Heck, I known a lot of Navaho folks that wear shirts that say Savage on them.

I really don’t care what they call any ski mountain. It’s not worth my time but I do think that we are losing some of the “wild” in the western states with the moves to be more politically correct. I think it’s unfortunate to no longer have a route 666 or a Mary’s Nipple at the Ghee.

 

[Philpug]

Mod Note: We have already removed some political comments. As with other threads, please keep your political thoughts to yourself, otherwise they will be removed. Again, thinking "This might be political but..." or "The mods might deleted this but..." don't post it. Thank you.

 

[Wasatchman]

Heck, I known a lot of Navaho folks that wear shirts that say Savage on them.

I really don’t care what they call any ski mountain. It’s not worth my time but I do think that we are losing some of the “wild” in the western states with the moves to be more politically correct. I think it’s unfortunate to no longer have a route 666 or a Mary’s Nipple at the Ghee.

While I think some (okay a lot) of the political correctness is getting out of hand myself, turns out squaw is considered a slur (something I didn't know until now as I thought it was neutral). So if the Native American community finds the name offensive and use of the word has a historical context of being used as a slur, I think it's hard to defend keeping the name.

I agree with you on Route 666 and Mary's Nipple.

 

[Philpug]

I agree with you on Route 666 and Mary's Nipple.

Hopefully Breckenridge will not rename The Devil's Crotch.

 

[chilehed]

Interesting. I had no idea it was an ethnic or sexist slur.

It's not, it's the anglicized form of a Native American word that means "woman". This idea that it's a slur is a bunch of muddle-headed nonsense.

 

[raytseng]

Heck, I known a lot of Navaho folks that wear shirts that say Savage on them.

On that topic though, is there a single piece of squaw valley merch that appropriates or references anything Native American? Is there a mascot? At the Spring party days do we see anyone at all dressing up in redface or Native American theme*? Or is it all 80s gear and mcconkey costumes mixing in with the hipster plaid and flat truckers caps.

From those examples, I don't think there is anybody both as a guest or from the company who has enthusiasm to link to Native American culture or believes that has any branding value.

*edit: there is that one guy who is outfitted like a mountain man, but he wears that everyday, I don't think he's theming the resort name and has an angel costume for skiing heavenly and a space costume for northstar and is going to protest a namechange. Every resort just has their kooks. The guy wearing the borat mankini cancels him out.

 

[dbostedo]

It's not, it's the anglicized form of a Native American word that means "woman". This idea that it's a slur is a bunch of muddle-headed nonsense.

Just because it has a typical meaning doesn't mean it can't have been converted to a slur through usage and circumstance. Some Googling gets mixed results and theories and histories of usage, with quite a few sites taking it as a slur due to the way Native American women were referred to using that word.

 

[scott43]

Wow..

 

[Pequenita]

It is not uncommon for members of a minority group not to realize that a term used to describe them is pejorative because the system is constructed in a way where people — including minorities — are taught that the pejorative term is okay because it’s the common usage. There are obvious words that everyone knows is pejorative or a slur, but the nuances between something like Oriental vs Asian, and why one term is okay to refer to people and the other not, are often lost to people who don’t sit around thinking about ethnic and race studies. The “namer” is often the group that is in power, and the power dynamic has been reflected in names. Can a term go from offensive to innocuous? I really don’t know, but just because someone states they currently don’t have a problem with a term doesn’t mean the origin wasn’t used in some way to reflect otherness or oppression.

 

[Tricia]

It's not, it's the anglicized form of a Native American word that means "woman". This idea that it's a slur is a bunch of muddle-headed nonsense.

When I was growing up in Northern Michigan, the Obijwa Indian Tribe took Squaw as a slur. The explanation I got was that many women were captured and men were killed in battles against the indian tribes. When the women were captured they were turned into sex slaves to the white man and turned the name Squaw from being a term for woman or wife in Indian language to mean whore to white man.

Again, this was told to me by an indian in an area where I lived when I was young. Its possible that its not universal.

 

[noncrazycanuck]

for another context one son in law says he is offended by the "Fighting Irish"
the other resents the British colonial domination of Quebec
while my wife is still hoping for a land claim on Vancouver Island
and personally I have always though my Viking ancestors have been far too frequently portrayed negatively.

not to make light of it but we are all evolving

 

[raisingarizona]

While I think some (okay a lot) of the political correctness is getting out of hand myself, turns out squaw is considered a slur (something I didn't know until now as I thought it was neutral). So if the Native American community finds the name offensive and use of the word has a historical context of being used as a slur, I think it's hard to defend keeping the name.

I agree with you on Route 666 and Mary's Nipple.

I agree also, if they really find it offensive then sure, why not? Olympic Valley has a nice ring to it imho anyways. Like I mentioned, I don’t care much what we call things and besides, the name isn’t going to affect their legendary terrain.

 

[karlo]

IF they choose to go down this path, I would be interested here what the options could be. Any thoughts?

Valley of the Dolls?

 

[karlo]

At some point, a word can take on another meaning. I didn’t know that squaw was derogatory. But, today, I think it just means an American Indian woman. Does anyone know of its use in a derogatory or demeaning way these days?

 

[markojp]

It is truly a sad commentary on the state of affairs and human nature in general that somehow the word for woman in an original native language has apparently become a derogatory slur.

So you'd think they'd use a more local word than the Algonquin original, non my herr ?

Sadly, I'm sure the IOC won't let Olympic Valley fly, but that seems a great solution that highlights the true original heritage of the area.

 

[raisingarizona]

It is not uncommon for members of a minority group not to realize that a term used to describe them is pejorative because the system is constructed in a way where people — including minorities — are taught that the pejorative term is okay because it’s the common usage. There are obvious words that everyone knows is pejorative or a slur, but the nuances between something like Oriental vs Asian, and why one term is okay to refer to people and the other not, are often lost to people who don’t sit around thinking about ethnic and race studies. The “namer” is often the group that is in power, and the power dynamic has been reflected in names. Can a term go from offensive to innocuous? I really don’t know, but just because someone states they currently don’t have a problem with a term doesn’t mean the origin wasn’t used in some way to reflect otherness or oppression.

Really great points here and a lot to ponder. I love discussions like this especially when they are respectful and considerate of different opinions.

Interestingly I’d say that the word savage was used by whites as an incredibly offensive term since they occupied this space but in today’s culture is more revered as complimentary in regards to athletic feats and such. The natives using that term could be taking it back much like black culture has taken back the N word? I’m not sure about that but there probably can be made a comparison.

 

[raisingarizona]

When I was growing up in Northern Michigan, the Obijwa Indian Tribe took Squaw as a slur. The explanation I got was that many women were captured and men were killed in battles against the indian tribes. When the women were captured they were turned into sex slaves to the white man and turned the name Squaw from being a term for woman or wife in Indian language to mean whore to white man.

Again, this was told to me by an indian in an area where I lived when I was young. Its possible that its not universal.

That does sound legit.