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Philpug

Notorious P.U.G.
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Reno, eNVy
@EllenPost is a member here and will have an article this coming week. Let me ping here to let he know she is being talked about.
 

LiquidFeet

instructor
Instructor
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Nov 12, 2015
Posts
6,697
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New England
I want someone sponsored by PSIA to write a book for the general public (and for the PSIA membership) about how to ski. If PSIA published it, and sold it in bookstores and on Amazon, PSIA could get some money from its sale. I'm sure the organization would love a new source of $$.

It would be great if the book had line drawings that are like the ones in Gamma's book. That format rocks for clarity. Below is a page from my copy of Gamma's Handbook of Skiing.

It would also be great if the certification skiing exams referenced pages in the book in their study guides. As things change over time, the book could be revised and republished to reflect changing trends in ski technique and changes in gear.

@EllenPost could write it! Her technical writing is exceptionally clear. I hope she reads this thread and comments on the possibility of such a book.

Here's a sample showing how well line drawings communicate. They are far superior to photographs. With clear descriptions and simple line drawings done from videos, the book would be a winner.

1579045823717.png
 
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EllenPost

Booting up
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Dec 2, 2019
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1
Location
Colorado
@EllenPost is a member here and will have an article this coming week. Let me ping here to let he know she is being talked about.
Phil, thank you for letting me know there's conversation about Skiing and the Art of Carving, first published in 1996. In the past 5 years, I've co-authored instructional manuals for PSIA-AASI that are also available for the general public (Alpine Technical Manual and Teaching Snowsports Manual). Writing a how-to-ski book is a massive project that requires a tremendous amount of time. Now, my time is filled with leading clinics, mentoring trainers, and developing curriculum for the Beaver Creek Ski & Snowboard School. I'm also involved with projects for PSIA-AASI. Thank you for the kind words about my book. Although it was written over 20 years ago, there's plenty of information that is timeless!
 

LiquidFeet

instructor
Instructor
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Nov 12, 2015
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6,697
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New England
@EllenPost, is it possible to build interest in PSIA writing and publishing such a book? Would there be anyone at the national level interested in looking into doing this?
 

SpauldingSmails

Uh oh, somebody's wrong on the internet again!
Skier
Joined
Jan 27, 2018
Posts
67
Location
Utah
I have 4 copies of that book. If someone is interested, give me a shout.
The co-Author is Mike Porter.
I will be seeing Ellen and Mike in Colorado in a few weeks.
I just bought a copy online. Thanks for the recommendation!
 

jt10000

步步高升
Skier
Joined
Apr 21, 2019
Posts
1,128
Location
New York City
Lot of helpful info here - thanks all. But this really annoys me:
Don't let uncomfortable or shady lodging options (including 1-star motels or even camping in a tent)
Maybe for you. For some of us, shady lodging means scary. I have to feel safe where I'm staying. And insofar as I'm trying to get family to get into skiing too, decent lodging is important. Plus, sleeping uncomfortably the night before an athletic endeavor seems unwise to me. YMMV.
And if they do hold you back, then reconsider whether skiing is really the best use of your time, instead of flying to Hawaii to eat BBQ and sip cocktails or something.)
Whatever.
 

Tony Storaro

Glorified Tobogganer
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Mar 2, 2020
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7,806
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Europe
Don't let uncomfortable or shady lodging options (including 1-star motels or even camping in a tent) or suboptimal gear or shitty snow conditions hold you back. (And if they do hold you back, then reconsider whether skiing is really the best use of your time, instead of flying to Hawaii to eat BBQ and sip cocktails or something.)

That depends mate.
10-15 years ago I'd wholeheartedly agree with you, as when younger and without too much responsibilities the only thing that matters is to satisfy the burning desire to practice what you love-be it skiing, fishing (especially fishing), cycling or whatever. I'd sleep in a tent, in a sleeping bag without a tent, in a car, or not sleep at all, just to be close to the water.

But that changes with time, your perception changes. My love for fishing and skiing and cycling is just as strong as it was in the past, but now I prefer to do it in more....grown up way-nice lodging does not hurt. :):)
 

mikes781

Out on the slopes
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Mar 30, 2018
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836
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NJ
The cost of skiing can certainly be a barrier especially when it includes a family. I like @Tony Storaro spent a lot of time in my 20s and early 30s fishing up and down the east coast of the US sleeping in my truck, tent or the cheapest hotels i could find. If I was skiing I probably would have done the same. It was a matter of getting out whenever I could with limited funds. Honestly if I’m skiing solo now I still wouldn’t be particular about where I’d sleep as long as it is clean (ish). :) Now with my girls on trips it’s a different story. If my wife who doesn’t ski tags along there is the need for more amenities to keep her entertained. Starts to add up before you even get to the slopes. For those with kids see if you local areas have any discount programs or keep an eye out for discounted tickets early in the season.

@jt10000 not sure how old your kids are or if you ski PA but SkiPA offers a 4th and 5th grade ski pass for about $35. That gets them 3 lift tickets to each resort in PA along with a lesson and rentals. My home mountain Blue also has discounted 3 packs that normally go on sale in the Fall. Comes out to about 1/2 the window price.
 

Popeye Cahn

Out on the slopes
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Aug 14, 2019
Posts
417
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Under the Top Gun skies
So now I'm hooked and spend inordinate amounts of time kibitzing about gear choices and future trips :roflmao:

An excellent primer and it done showed me that I ain't the dumbest rock in the box of hammers :ogbiggrin:

Seriously though, I hope the 20/21 season is a reality. I plan on maximizing my efforts from this past season (and just say no to dodgy lodging but if your stuck with it make the best of it ;-) )
 

jt10000

步步高升
Skier
Joined
Apr 21, 2019
Posts
1,128
Location
New York City
@jt10000 not sure how old your kids are or if you ski PA but SkiPA offers a 4th and 5th grade ski pass for about $35. That gets them 3 lift tickets to each resort in PA along with a lesson and rentals. My home mountain Blue also has discounted 3 packs that normally go on sale in the Fall. Comes out to about 1/2 the window price.
Thanks - that'll be good for my boy in a few years. We ski at Shawnee a bit.
 

locknload

Out on the slopes
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Feb 3, 2016
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Carlsbad
A lot of great info. Skim it..come back to it when you need it, however, go get some good boots and just get out there and rip it and have fun. You can spend hours consuming info but getting time on the snow and in the snow is where its at. You'll figure out all the details as you keep having more and getting better.
 

Wilhelmson

Making fresh tracks
Skier
Joined
May 2, 2017
Posts
4,328
What about now? Shop around for good deals on a jacket, pants, gloves, helmet. Maybe find a cash refundable ski and stay package. Cross country skiing is a good way to get fit and balanced for downhill.
 

Slim

Making fresh tracks
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Oct 2, 2017
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Duluth, MN
Figure out what aspects of skiing are most fun for you, and how you can maximize those.
The places and actions that are most talked about, might not be the best fit for your interests and situation.

Things to think about are:
  • travel time/costs
  • How busy can you handle?
  • Do you care about long runs, or steep ones?
  • Like smooth grooomers or moguls?
  • How big a deal is fresh powder for you?
  • Do you like cruising around a vast area, or rather lap the same mountain?
  • terrain Parks something for you?
  • Does altitude affect you very badly?
Also think of when to ski.
New skiers and fanatics tend to try and get on snow ASAP, in November.
Most people stop skiing by March. Consider whether January-May might be better for you, at least in the high mountains of western North America or the Alps.
If you can only do one far away trip, think about when might be best for you.
 

Lesarhelena

In the parking lot (formerly "At the base lodge")
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Pass Pulled
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Jan 1, 2022
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3
Location
Slovenia
Adding on
Ski Sizing for advanced ski purchase
How to pick the size of your first pair of skis

  • The general sizing still will be chin height to head height, however different ski categories will have different effective lengths and will be sized differently.
  • Skinnier front side or race skis will have shorter lengths, while big mtn or powder skis will have longer lengths, as will twintips or park skis.
  • If you have never tried the same category of ski before, you should demo the ski to find out if sizing is appropriate and if it is the type of ski you were looking for at all.
  • An alternate method of sizing is to use S M L sizing. Look at the manufacturer's page and see what sizes are offered. If you're a smaller than the average adult of your gender, then pick the shorter length offered, vice versa if you are larger, then pick the larger lengths.

  • There are other rubrics of weight, or height+weight, or height+weight+ability+ski style, but don't fall into a rabbit hole over this. Demo is the only way to answer those questions rather then worrying over +5cm for height or +10cm for skill.
  • Feel free to post in hardgoods if you're still stuck and can't pull the trigger.

Ski Tuning Services explanation and Pricing
Below is a breakdown of the common ski tuning services. These are general generic writeup that I made up myself circa 2019. Prices, names, procedures and what each service entails; all will vary.
  • Bindings Adjustmentand bindings testing.
    • If this was not done, you should get your bindings checked.
    • Adjustment of the system bindings a good shop will do it for Free or no charge esp if they are not busy. It should only take them maybe 5min to do the adjustments or look it over. If they are busy or you want them to actually test, then this is typically $25-$30.
    • If you pay for a bindings test, this should be a formal test procedure. It should be done on a machine or actual procedure with a pass/fail checklist. You should either get a printout/receipt showing pass for all the tests; or they show you or confirm it was all PASSES on the screen (often the shops printer is broken; or forgotten to get paper for printouts; they are not IT guys).
    • If it needs to be remounted or needs a new mount, this is typically $50-$60 but again you should involve original shop if this is the case.
  • Wax.
    • Quick wax: quick machine wax that just goes over maybe $5-$15 and last for a 1-3 days, or may get thrown in for free with (A) or any other service.
      • Typically done while you wait, and under 5-10min, sometimes you will see slopeside tent.
      • This maybe just a friction wax (cheapest), and maybe last 1day
      • Quick Hot wax, machine run over hotwax and then over a buffer (better lasts up to 3days).
    • Iron Wax(hand wax) and edge sharpening (known as Edge+Wax)
      • Is better job than the quick wax. Typically costs $20-$35, depending on the edgework This wax last you 5days of skiing, depending how long you ski and how fast and abrasive the snow is.
      • Edge work varies between just deburring off the burrs, or actual full resharpening.
      • May take 20-30minutes for them to do, typically not while you wait unless rush job; but overnight.
    • Learn to wax: You can also learn how to do waxing and basic edgework yourself, check out posts and videos here, youtube resources, posts on ski supply webshops(e.g. racewax). Often ski shops or outdoors stores like REI will have in-person sessions to learn as well. You can have a friend show you, but you may need to evaluate if that friend's competency and if they know what they are doing.

    • Wax choice:
      • This is beyond what a new to skier needs to obsess over, and often you don't get a choice at a shop unless doing it yourself. Visit the tuning forums instead,
      • Typically any of the modern good brand all-temp wax is sufficient, if you are in a very cold area though (under 7F./-14C) you will need colder temp wax.
      • If you are in a moderate area, but being frugal, you can always elect for colder or harder wax which will last longer in exchange for trading off some warmer temp performance and more difficulty in the waxing procedure.
    • Other Wax
      • New ski treatments such as DPS Phantom exist which are a permanent treatment; This is still a new technology in the process of optimizing the techniques and formulas, but it is but is catching on with positive feedback. There is a thread on this if interested.
      • Very exotic (expensive) full flouro waxes, advanced techniques such as hotboxing, multiple wax layers are beyond what is needed for a new recreational skier. These techniques are high in cost (time or money) for just incremental return. This is for racers needing to shave off fractions of seconds. Save your money to get more time on the slopes instead. Visit Tuning forum if interested though.
  • Tunes
    • Tunes are when the structure on your skis have been worn away, you have base damage, or your edges need to be reset.
    • Typically a $45 tuneup means they will do base grind work, reset base/side edges, and include wax
    • A $60 full tuneup will do the above, but also fix any repair small base damage (gouges or small sections, you may have.
    • Extra work, they will add on $5 or $10 for other damage or a la carte qutoes.
    • See below on when you need a tune.
Ski Tuning: strategy
If money and resources were unlimited, you could just throw away your skis every day and use new ones, just as we do with plastic cups and so on, (but that's another story).

How do you effectively keep your skis performing at a high level for relatively cheap? How do you go about not wasting a lot of money, so you can spend it for time on the slopes instead.
A lot of this also depends on your personal preference. Do you also wash and wax your car or do you not care? Do you keep up on the maintenance on the dot or do you let it slide sometimes? Can you even tell the difference when the tune is done?
All ski tuning costs either $$ or time, and ultimately you have to consider whether you are getting good value out of what you are paying for the tuning.
  • New ski prep: Unless you are racing or need top performance, you do not necessarily need to get a tune for brand new skis, you can just go out and ski it for a day. After you ski it for a day, if anything feels weird, then you can bring it to the shop to see if a tune or to ask why it's skiing funny.

  • Waxing: After the first day or 2, then you can get a iron wax every 5days, or quickwax every 1 to 3days depending on if you feel if it makes a difference to get you a good glide that doesn't stick. Waxing is the most frequent procedure.

  • Tunes: You can do a full edge/wax tune after perhaps 10-20 days or when your edges feel dull; and/or a full tune say once a season (20-30days) depending on if you encounter any damage. The tuneup job whould also typically include a wax job for your skis.

  • Value: You can also see if paying the money for tuning makes the skis any better for you. Some people do not have the skills developed to tell or appreciate any of the difference between a ski that hasn't been tuned for many days. Others may just not care and the skis are fine.
Ski Tuning: Shops
Lookup any ski shop near your home mountain they will have a webpage for tune services with their price lists, or pop in and ask them.

When do you need a tuneup? A good shop will always examine your skis and advise you on what you need if you are unsure. They should agree if a full tune is necessarily or not, based on what the ski needs or your feedback, not based on what their mortgage on their house needs. If a shop just takes your skis for a full tune (and your money) without at least looking them over or talking to you about the skis performance; walk away that is not a good shop.

There typically are specials or deals especially in early season to get you in the shop, or prepayment specials like pay $75 and get 3 tunes for the season. https://elly.com/
If costs start to build up, take a look over in tuning forums or other tutorials to learn how to do this yourself.
Start by just learning how to hot wax yourself and minor side edge deburring, which will cover majority of your tuning jobs. You can leave the full-tune to the pros once a season or so.
Thank you so much. This looks great and I can't wait to dive in! I have use Elly pos for transactions. I had it transparent and visible for accounting. Would like to start skiing. I have been skiing for a year and now Would like to upgread my gear.Whare shoud I start?
 

Rdputnam515

Getting off the lift
Skier
Joined
Feb 2, 2021
Posts
704
Location
Front Range, Colorado
Maximize the time you spend skiing while getting feedback, and minimize the money you spend on everything else.

Just get out there and ski. Don't let uncomfortable or shady lodging options (including 1-star motels or even camping in a tent) or suboptimal gear or shitty snow conditions hold you back. (And if they do hold you back, then reconsider whether skiing is really the best use of your time, instead of flying to Hawaii to eat BBQ and sip cocktails or something.) At the same time, once you're on the slopes, get qualified people to watch you, and get as many runs filmed for your own review as you possibly can. If you've skimped on everything else, then you should have saved enough money for at least a few instructional days for every 10 days of skiing.

The one thing you should't skimp on, though, is boots. If you splurge on one thing only, splurge on boots. Spend as much money as it takes to get them dialed in. Everything else in skiing follows the fit and the alignment of your boots. Your boots make a bigger difference to your experience than anything else.

Also, while you're still an intermediate, rent a pair of skis for the season instead of buying skis. (Rent skis only -- buy your own boots and poles.) My first 3 years skiing, that's what I did. I spent less than $5/day on ski rentals that way. And each season, I rented longer skis than the previous season, to match my increased ability.

Very minor point: I'm finding it helpful to use adjustable telescoping poles. That way, I can experiment with every different length to see what works best.
You can ski and BBQ, at my local spot you have Access to propane grills all over the mountain, for free. It’s fantastic. great addition to grill your own lunch near a wood stove heated cabin slope side.

also always drink responsibly
 

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