Skiing Hit-n-Run at Breck

Discussion in 'General Skiing' started by Noodler, Jan 9, 2019.

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  1. Gary Stolt

    Gary Stolt Mr. Style Team Gathermeister

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    I'm going to jump in here. While we can discuss who has the right of way, it doesn't help much if you have the right of way and a broken leg. Your leg is still broken. Slow skiers can improve their chances of safe skiing by following some simple rules. If the slow skier "stays in their lane" and is predictable, faster skiers will find it easier to ski past them. Too often I see the novice making tight turns and big turns, wandering from side to side without ever looking over their shoulder. It can be difficult to predict where they will be and pass them allowing ample room. When I take the grand kids, I tell them - if you start on the right side of the run, stay on the right side. You can go across the run but look over your shoulder first.
    I'm just saying that having the right of way doesn't make the broken leg heal any faster.
     
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  2. Wasatchman

    Wasatchman over the hill Skier

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    It's a good point that we should all be taught and learn some ways to minimize risk of a collision even though downhill skier has right of way relative to uphill skier.

    I actually had a learning moment myself a few years ago. I was skiing relatively fast in a tight line in the middle of a run when I started feeling sore. So I suddenly decided to quickly move to the side for a breather. Somebody behind me who was also going fast didn't expect that from the way I was skiing that I would suddenly traverse across to the hill to the side for a breather. The skier avoided me but it gave me a fright and I said to myself I just can't do that. Maybe he still has the responsibility to avoid me, but I can't be skiing fast in a tight line and suddenly decide to traverse to the side for a breather without really being diligent about looking over my shoulder and a bit more gradually. I could see how the uphill skier would have a problem with what I just did. I was usually more careful than that but there was hardly anybody on the run at that time.

    Nothing came of the incident but it sure made me more aware of what I can do to minimize risks, and not to let my guard down for other potential skiers even when there are few people (especially on groomers).
     
  3. Andy Mink

    Andy Mink I am a half fast skier. Moderator

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    It's like people in the crosswalk if they get hit. The were right, dead right.

    I really dislike narrow traverses that take all abilities from one area to another. We have one such at Mt. Rose. It dumps all the people off the main lift that serves black, blue, and green. On one side is a fairly steep wall, on the other a drop into trees. Add on top of that if it's a windy day, it's really windy through there. You have the people trying to keep up some speed to make the traverse, some people turning in random fashion, and jibbers going up the wall and dropping back down. It's difficult to figure what someone's "lane" is. You really have to have your head on a 360° swivel. If one person falls it can get really interesting.
     
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  4. pchewn

    pchewn Out on the slopes Skier

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    Can you cite the law? From what I've read, it is not a felony.

    79A.45.050
    Leaving scene of skiing accident—Penalty—Notice.

    (1) Any person who is involved in a skiing accident and who departs from the scene of the accident without leaving personal identification or otherwise clearly identifying himself or herself before notifying the proper authorities or obtaining assistance, knowing that any other person involved in the accident is in need of medical or other assistance, shall be guilty of a misdemeanor.
    (2) An operator shall place a prominent notice containing the substance of this section in such places as are necessary to notify the public.
     
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  5. tball

    tball Zipped up Skier

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    It wouldn't even take Elon Musk to focus on the problem of identifying reckless skiers in slow zones. It's a relatively easy problem to solve with today's technology. There is just very little incentive for ski areas to do anything about reckless skiers.

    In the Colorado Skier Saftey Act ski areas expressly don't have any duty to protect us from another skier's carelessness or recklessness:

    (5) The ski area operator, upon finding a person skiing in a careless and reckless manner, may revoke that person's skiing privileges. This subsection (5) shall not be construed to create an affirmative duty on the part of the ski area operator to protect skiers from their own or from another skier's carelessness or recklessness.
    How about the Colorado Legislature start by changing "may revoke that person's skiing privileges" to "shall revoke that person's skiing privileges"?

    I don't believe the ski areas will do anything about this problem without a change to the law.
     
    Last edited: Jan 17, 2019
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  6. Wolfski

    Wolfski Getting on the lift Skier

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    I'm sorry, the comment above of "if a slow skier stays in their lane" they're easier to predict and pass for the faster skier? Wait, What?
    So if I'm slow I need to stay predictable but if I'm fast I don't? I do not recall anything like that mentioned anywhere before.

    Its not rocket science, if you can't avoid the skier below you, you're going too fast or are out of control (again your responsibility) so just pay some attention

    Isn't this Skiing where we're one with nature, gravity and freedom to move and enjoy within some very easy to understand and follow guidelines for our total enjoyment?
    We're all out there for fun and accidents do happen, when they do, everyone just needs to own it.
     
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  7. pchewn

    pchewn Out on the slopes Skier

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    A major contributor to collisions is crowded slopes. We used to have crowded lift lines, then the ski areas installed more higher-capacity lifts. The crowds moved to the slopes -- contributing to more collisions.

    At the ski areas on Mt Hood, the limiting factor for crowds appears to be the parking areas. Parking areas can be overflowing and the ski areas are turning people away, yet the lifts and the slopes are not crowded. I fear the day when the ski areas solve this problem and the slopes and lifts are crowded. I'd much rather have some other upstream limit to the # of people on the hill. Skiing crowded runs is not fun, not safe, and if it gets to that point I'll probably take up backcountry...
     
  8. Andy Mink

    Andy Mink I am a half fast skier. Moderator

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    Deer Valley caps ticket/pass sales at 7500 per day. If you have an IKON pass you are encouraged to call ahead and let them know you're planning on being there so they save a slot for you. On the other hand, if you say you'll be there and aren't they can count that as one day towards your 5, or whatever it is. I'm guessing other areas may do the same but probably most don't. As many people as are willing to pay will be allowed on the hill at any one time.
     
  9. slowrider

    slowrider Out on the slopes Skier

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    When the traffic increases on the runs it's time to bail or find some place else on the mt. I usually do a few check/brush turns (heads up) if I'm slowing down or changing my fall line.
     
  10. Seldomski

    Seldomski Paralysis by analysis Skier

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    Well this is where you get into trouble. You can do whatever you want if you are alone on mountain. But total disregard for others uphill is reckless way to ski otherwise, especially as it becomes more crowded. I can arc big GS turns on a green, but I very rarely do this because people don't expect you to ski 30 mph across or even up the slope.

    To use a car analogy, how do you view the slope?
    1) highway
    2) residential street
    3) school zone
    4) parking lot

    Which view depends on size, trail marking, snow conditions, and traffic. You *should* ski differently for each of these cases. With more traffic, you need to 'stay in your lane'. That or stop, wait for it to clear enough for you to ski how you want to...
     
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  11. Big J

    Big J Putting on skis Skier

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    Parking is also the issue at Stevens Pass Resort in Washington State. On most week ends the lots fill up and they send people home. This limits the amount of people on the mountain to some degree although it is still very crowded on the mountain. Lack of parking also ticks people off who drove all of the way up and cannot park.
     
  12. Big J

    Big J Putting on skis Skier

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    I agree with all of this. Be courteous. Even though you have the right of way as the down hill skier you and perhaps they are still messed up if you get hit by another skier.
     
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  13. markojp

    markojp mtn rep for the gear on my feet Industry Insider Instructor

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    So if I'm downhill and can't see the person behind me, what is 'courteous' on my part? FWIW, when I'm making big lane changes and there's any traffic on the hill, I head check. FWIW, if I'm at work on the hill and I hit someone (not they hit me), I lose my job. Pretty simple incentive.
     
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  14. Philpug

    Philpug Enjoying being back on two skis. Admin Pugski Ski Tester

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    Now we are off on an other tangent, "does the downhill skier always have the right of way." At this point, we will not know anything more until the kid and his family comes forward or are found. I am thinking that this thread needs to be closed until that happens.
     
  15. Tricia

    Tricia The Velvet Hammer Admin Pugski Ski Tester

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    Bumping this thread with this comment for a reason.
    I was skiing Copper Mountain the day before OR in Denver with @Philpug and @DCagle when we bumped into @Justin Koski and @Sethmasia.
    I went off to ski with Seth and Justin while Phil and Dwayne skied more bumps. (trying to save my legs for the week)
    Seth is a good instructor and was giving me some tips on skiing a short radius turn line, which I was doing when a 4 year old kid in a power wedge was coming across the fall line directly at me. I sped up to avoid this child, while Seth was behind me and made another move to avoid the child.

    We stopped below the section of the run where Justin was standing and viewing the incident.
    The parents (with the child) approached me to scream at me that I almost hit their child, and I was skiing too fast."you almost hit a 4 year old because you were skiing too fast!!"
    This is a clear case where the parents wanted to ski "bigger stuff" and over terrained their child, and I did what I needed to do to avoid the child by speeding up and avoiding the child in a clear line that was short radius along the far right edge.
    Seth made another big move to avoid the child and yet the parents thought WE were in the wrong.
    Justin, who saw the incident from below said that the kid was on terrain he wasn't prepared to ski.

    I know intermediates need to grow and will make wrong moves on occasion, and we need to do what we can to help them and avoid them, but the intermediates, or their stewards need to realize this and not berate the advanced skiers who do their best to avoid them the stuff like this happens.
     
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