Ski dampening, the new extreme. '19 Rossi DLC

[James]

Anton Gliders meet a race ski...
A hang glider and a mt bike crashed in the factory parking lot, then they picked up the pieces and made a ski...

Setting the stage for electromechanical manipulation of ski flex or response in the future?

Check out Rossignol's DLC technology on their masters race skis. Dynamic Line Control. Don't know if it will be on their fis skis.

 

[Seldomski]

What happens when somebody skis over your tips? IMHO they should have a guard there to make it less likely stuff can get jammed under that rod.

 

[James]

What happens when somebody skis over your tips? IMHO they should have a guard there to make it less likely stuff can get jammed under that rod.

Lol. That's a problem. This season I know someone who somehow had a kid get their ski under his boot. The tip of the ski! Then it was locked together.

 

[SkiSpeed]

Check out Rossignol's DLC technology on their masters race skis. Dynamic Line Control. Don't know if it will be on their fis skis.

Look closely at Tessa Worley's skis from the past two seasons; she has been using a version of it.

 

[ScotsSkier]

Its not on any of the 2019 FIS skis that I have seen. They do all have the new R22 plate though which bears a remarkable resemblance to the Marker plate, just no piston. What I have heard about the Masters DLC ski is that it is going to be a premium priced product.......

 

[James]

Its not on any of the 2019 FIS skis that I have seen. They do all have the new R22 plate though which bears a remarkable resemblance to the Marker plate, just no piston. What I have heard about the Masters DLC ski is that it is going to be a premium priced product.......

Apparently they are offering with and without next year:

"No reverse camber" ?? Hmmm...

Tessa with DLC.

Screen shots from the 2018/9 Race Catalog:
https://issuu.com/tesma/docs/rossi_race_katalog_2018/1?ff=true

Put online by tesmasport.com
https://issuu.com/tesma

 

[cantunamunch]

Anton Gliders meet a race ski...
A hang glider and a mt bike crashed in the factory parking lot, then they picked up the pieces and made a ski...

This totally feels like someone's patent expired and engineering was given the go ahead to put something on the market fast.

Marker & Volkl had a piston with a tie point to the shovel of the ski what, 10+? years ago with the Motion iPT. So yeah, take a Motion iPT except use a geometry closer to what Alpine Radius Control are doing, ditch ARadCo's slide bearing and you have this.


Motion iPT for those who don't remember it:

ARadCo torque tube torsional stiffness enhancer, the old style Marker plate on the top ski is highly suggestive:

 

[Ken_R]

What ever happened to this:

 

[ScotsSkier]

Apparently they are offering with and without next year:

Thanks James, none of the 2019 FIS demos my rep had used the DLC. Interesting to note as well that, from the catalog, the DLC adds 0.8kg to the pair, from 5.2 kg to 6 kg

I noticed at the olympics that while most of the top rank Rossi athletes were on the 19 top sheet, there were only a very few using the DLC ski. In fact at one point on the womens GS podium, there was one DLC and one non DLC 189 ski being held up - till the Rossi guy noticed it and quickly made sure they were the same!!!

 

[cantunamunch]

What ever happened to this:

View attachment 44261

Nothing, Anton is still doing skis AFAWCT.

 

[James]

This totally feels like someone's patent expired and engineering was given the go ahead to put something on the market fast.

Marker & Volkl had a piston with a tie point to the shovel of the ski what, 10+? years ago with the Motion iPT. So yeah, take a Motion iPT except use a geometry closer to what Alpine Radius Control are doing, ditch ARadCo's slide bearing and you have this.


Motion iPT for those who don't remember it:

ARadCo torque tube torsional stiffness enhancer, the old style Marker plate on the top ski is highly suggestive:

View attachment 44259

You have any links to the tube stabilizer? What is it?

What I have heard about the Masters DLC ski is that it is going to be a premium priced product.......

Indeed! $2800 msrp w/binding

SIDECUT 103/65/85
RADIUS 27m SIZES 185
DLC, "Dynamic Line Control" Piston Arm
R22 RACE PLATE
LOOK PX18 RACE BINDINGS ROCKER FLEX TECHNOLOGY ROSSIGNOL's OFFICIAL PRODUCT DESCRIPTION:
MSRP $2800 USD

"Raced and refined over the past three-seasons, LOOK DLC technology neutralizes and disperses kinetic energy to eliminate counter-flexing of the ski for optimized trajectory and total line control. A truly unique racing sensation, proven in competition and now available to the public.

An evolution of World Cup racing innovation, Rossignol’s patented new LCT construction harnesses pure power and energy, delivering fluid stability in all conditions. Featuring a central “power rail” integrated from tipto-tail, LCT eliminates counterflexing of the ski to ensure consistently smooth stability and dynamic control of your line.

This is a highly specialized ski. Be sure to contact your local Rossignol Ski Shop, ski dealer and make sure this is a ski you can handle. If you get a pair, you'll be in an elite class of skiers as not many will have the skill to ride this beast!"
- from the youtube description

 

[ScotsSkier]

Wowsa!,,, I had heard around $2k and thought it would be a hard sell but $2800!!!!! Don't see too many masters racers jumping on it at that....and if that is the potential premium for the FIS DLC, don't expect to see many kids with it either....

 

[pchewn]

Can I go to NAPA and get some struts and bolt to my skis? For less than $2800 ???

 

[James]

Yeah I saw a discounted Zai ski for $2,600. Eeny, meeny, miny, moe...

The disconnect between those who write about ski product and well, reality, continues. "eliminates counter flexing",
"No reversed camber!"
Yet... "Flex control during the turns"

Don't they know the ski has to bend? Like, it's a good thing. We don't want to eliminate bending. How can it eliminate counter flexing yet control flex?

 

[ScotsSkier]

Yeah I saw a discounted Zai ski for $2,600. Eeny, meeny, miny, moe...

The disconnect between those who write about ski product and well, reality, continues. "eliminates counter flexing",
"No reversed camber!"
Yet... "Flex control during the turns"

Don't they know the ski has to bend? Like, it's a good thing. We don't want to eliminate bending. How can it eliminate counter flexing yet control flex?

It may be that they have some sophisticated damping in that piston with separate compression / rebound valuing so there is limited resistance in compression but stronger damping in return to neutral. That would help explain the price premium!

 

[cantunamunch]

Yeah I saw a discounted Zai ski for $2,600. Eeny, meeny, miny, moe...

Okemo sports? Not a fan of the slate? topsheet.

How can it eliminate counter flexing yet control flex?

It may be that they have some sophisticated damping in that piston with separate compression / rebound valuing so there is limited resistance in compression but stronger damping in return to neutral. That would help explain the price premium!

and much stronger damping than even that in excursions past neutral - like when flat running across a rut.

Why is this so surprising? MTB suspensions have been able to have separate compression and rebound rates for almost 20 years now - that's really all this system is.

 

[Magi]

Why is this so surprising? MTB suspensions have been able to have separate compression and rebound rates for almost 20 years now - that's really all this system is.

Knowing all the nonsense that our Sit Skiers have to go through for shock tuning based on where they're skiing and the conditions du jour, I'm curious how this deals with altitude and temperature.

And rocks.

 

[oldschoolskier]

While in concept it seems like a great idea and some ideas are around for the second or third version maybe even forth before they become main stream as all the kinks have been worked out (think shaped skis).

This is Sales and Marketing leading engineering again. The “We gotta have something new and different” and someone says off handedly we could do this and everyone exhausted (after a 5 day brainstorming session agrees just to make it end) idea.

Voila, something new and different. Now we get to see on how good this idea really was or how drunk the team really was.

 

[Johnny V.]

Wowsa!,,, I had heard around $2k and thought it would be a hard sell but $2800!!!!! Don't see too many masters racers jumping on it at that....and if that is the potential premium for the FIS DLC, don't expect to see many kids with it either....

Yep! Pretty steep price for bragging rights at the post race party............

 

[James]

Okemo sports? Not a fan of the slate? topsheet.


and much stronger damping than even that in excursions past neutral - like when flat running across a rut.

Why is this so surprising? MTB suspensions have been able to have separate compression and rebound rates for almost 20 years now - that's really all this system is.

No, the green felt is so last season!

Nothing is surprising about the shock valving. What's surprising is claiming the ski doesn't bend. That would be like saying a car suspension never goes up, just lengthens in the drops. I get what they mean, but it is sloppy beyond reason to imply that the ski won't bend.
If that were the goal, making a rigid ski wouldn't be all that hard.
But, this is the ski industry where everyone is claiming they have titanium in their skis when it's aluminum.