School Me On How to Review Skis

[Living Proof]

I participate in 2 demo days a year at my home mountain in SE Pa, did the first day last week. I do it for the experience and it is a fun day. But, I fully realize that I am a noob at reviewing skis. I don't have a process, or, specific ski aspects that, perhaps, I should have to make it a more meaningful experience. I tend to either like a ski or not like like it, not always sure how to recognize and express the differences. Another limiting factor is that my demo eastern mountains have limited terrain where "all mountain" skis are not of interest to me, as we do not have powder, trees and moguls are very icy. My needs are for front side carvers and getting on wider skis (above 80) does require some technique adjustments. Two or three runs on a ski is not of time to figure out performance.

So, any words of wisdom from those who demo on a regular basis?

 

[Jilly]

I did a demo lingo a few years ago for the Ski Diva's. It's still on the site, under gear reviews. That might help a bit. You can access that.

 

[Philpug]

The question I will ask...why are you demoing? For yourself or to review for others? First you need to know what you like and don't like and if your case, lets assume that is frontside skis. Now think about a reference ski and let's use your Hart Pulse, a 77mm wide beautiful frontside ski. Start with that as a basis. OK, when demoing/reviewing, we have said many times you are demoing three things, first the snow, then the tune and thirdly the ski. So, first run (or two) should be on your skis to give a base line of the conditions and ideally on a trail that has some groomed sections and some bumps, a mix of flats and terrain changes. Now you can start trying some skis. I personally do not start with the ski I want to ski the most, I want to get some more ski legs underneath me for the day. I will do all my skiing of the same type of ski on the same trail. I start off feeling how the ski feels hanging from my legs on the lift, I will twist the skis from side to side to feel the swing weight. Once I get off the lift, I will quickly get a feel now the tune is, catchy or good. Next step is some skidded turns on some flats into a a carve. I will want to see how the ski holds through the turn and how it enters the turn and how it can be released. Play in the bumps and go through the same steps again. Back on the groomers and relax on the ski then charge. Since you know your baseline ski, how it compared to that. Is it more powerful? More finesse? Does it light up when pushed hard or does it like to be relaxed on? Does the ski adjust to the way you like to ski or did you have to adjust to the ski? Do all these little drills match your style? If not, who's would they match?

What does happen from time to time is a bad tune. If the ski just does not feel right and you think, no way should this ski like this, it could be a bad tune. We do get 2-3 at every demo. Bring the ski back, tell the rep and ask for a different pair. It does happen.

 

[SkiEssentials]

Bring a small notebook and take notes on the Chairlift. I do that religiously when testing skis. It's nice having something to go back to a few days after the demo when things aren't quite as fresh in your mind.

 

[SBrown]

Bring a small notebook and take notes on the Chairlift. I do that religiously when testing skis. It's nice having something to go back to a few days after the demo when things aren't quite as fresh in your mind.

And if you (or your liftmates) don't mind, voice recorder apps on cold days are nicer than bare fingers.

 

[SkiEssentials]

I like to carry a pen and paper so I don't have to rely on my phone in the cold, but that's just personal preference. I don't mind writing while wearing gloves. I've had phones die on me in the middle of a review day, which prompted the switch to pen and paper for me.

 

[Living Proof]

I did a demo lingo a few years ago for the Ski Diva's. It's still on the site, under gear reviews. That might help a bit. You can access that.

Found it, thanks,
http://www.theskidiva.com/forums/index.php?threads/demo-lingo.18875/

Question: Are damping and lively simple opposites of each other? Can you puts some words around knowing what is the middle of the two?

 

[SBrown]

I like to carry a pen and paper so I don't have to rely on my phone in the cold, but that's just personal preference. I don't mind writing while wearing gloves. I've had phones die on me in the middle of a review day, which prompted the switch to pen and paper for me.

Yeah, that's a good point. I didn't have that problem with my previous phone, but this one dies all. the. time.

 

[Philpug]

Yeah, that's a good point. I didn't have that problem with my previous phone, but this one dies all. the. time.

Note to self (on the phone too) get some toe warmers for the team for Copper testing.

 

[SBrown]

Note to self (on the phone too) get some toe warmers for the team for Copper testing.

Those do work. They look ... odd, but they work.

 

[SkiEssentials]

Those do work. They look ... odd, but they work.

They should rebrand "toe warmers" as "toe and phone warmers"

 

[oldschoolskier]

New market.

 

[cantunamunch]

Question: Are damping and lively simple opposites of each other? Can you puts some words around knowing what is the middle of the two?

They should be but they're not. A lot of readers expect 'lively' to have something to do with how eagerly a ski will start a turn, which has nothing to do with damping at all. The extreme opposite of 'damp' would be something like 'buzzy' meaning it feels like just about every nuisance vibration passes up into the boot. Now not a lot of alpine skis live at that opposite (a lot of XC skis and some randonnee skis do).

 

[Monique]

They should be but they're not. A lot of readers expect 'lively' to have something to do with how eagerly a ski will start a turn, which has nothing to do with damping at all. The extreme opposite of 'damp' would be something like 'buzzy' meaning it feels like just about every nuisance vibration passes up into the boot. Now not a lot of alpine skis live at that opposite (a lot of XC skis and some randonnee skis do).

Okay, but people still describe some skis, but not all skis, as damp, so there is a spectrum at play. I've been thinking about this since someone on theSkiDiva suggested an association between metal and dampness, but I'm not sure - I don't ski skis with metal, but all my Icelantics have been damp. And I'm not sure that a racing ski, which presumably has lots of metal, would be described as damp? But I'm not sure because again, I don't ski them.

Damp is typically associated with heavy. Are all heavy skis damp? Would a ski have to be pretty crappy to be heavy and not damp?

I think maybe the opposite of damp is chattery? I demo'd a pair of backcountry oriented Black Diamonds a few years ago, and they felt very chattery. Super light, sure, but not reassuring at all. Or, a different angle, the opposite of damp could be "easily deflected"? Damp skis blow through crud.

Is dampness by definition associated with stiffness?

 

[cantunamunch]

Damp is typically associated with heavy.

Adding mass is one way - but not the only way - to make a ski transmit less vibration from the snow to the skier.

Think of a car suspension - a heavy car doesn't feel as jarring as a light one.

? Would a ski have to be pretty crappy to be heavy and not damp?

No. It would, in all likelihood, be quite stiff tho.

I think maybe the opposite of damp is chattery?

I can't speak to other reviewers, but I reserve 'chattery' for losing and recovering edge contact with the snow. If we constrain 'damping' to be about not passing vibration to the skier then the two are different properties entirely.

In the car suspension analogy, chattery would be a car suspension that lets the wheel bounce off the ground. That's bad, but the driver might be having a cush, dampened ride throughout. Kinda like one of my ex-roomies' Cadillac Biarritz, actually.

Or, a different angle, the opposite of damp could be "easily deflected"? Damp skis blow through crud.

As a counter-example I cite my old (backcountry) Atomic Kongurs that were both damp and easily deflected. EDIT: I could also cite any number of park skis here, which have those characteristics for very good reason.

Is dampness by definition associated with stiffness?

No. Think of a car suspension again. Damping is the shock's job. It is not the spring's job. Making the spring stiffer can actually make you lose the anti-jarring benefits of a heavy car.

 

[AmyPJ]

Demoed 2016 Volkl Kenjas this morning. Buying them. Loved them. Will attempt to write a review with some of the guidance above after I ski them in a wider variety of conditions. Needless to say, I LOVED them.

 

[cantunamunch]

It's sometimes fun to have a 'first impression' view.

 

[SBrown]

I thought this was great.

 

[Living Proof]

Demoed 2016 Volkl Kenjas this morning. Buying them. Loved them. Will attempt to write a review with some of the guidance above after I ski them in a wider variety of conditions. Needless to say, I LOVED them.

All that needs said is "I put my money where my mouth is!

I bought a pair of Kastle 88's after 2 demo runs, I know the feeling.

 

[AmyPJ]

All that needs said is "I put my money where my mouth is!

I bought a pair of Kastle 88's after 2 demo runs, I know the feeling.

I have decided I will never buy another pair of skis without demoing first. These skis put a smile on my face and gave me confidence I haven't had since I bought my Black Pearls in 2012. I've had others I've liked and enjoyed, but skiing skis that make you giggle is way more fun! It's a great feeling, isn't it?!

With that being said, I absolutely relied on reviews to help me decide to demo the Kenjas. They have a new design for 2016.