Ruminations on skiing w/a group -- esp. men

[CalG]

Ego is a real problem when skiing in a group,
The need for some to be "top dog". ramps up the speed, the expectations, and the disappointments.
Finding compatibility must be done thoughtfully.
I prefer not to ski "with a leader". I enjoy skiing with companions who are after a rewarding and memorable experience. "Like Minded".....

Sometimes that means a very small group.

 

[Drahtguy Kevin]

However, this was skiing with people I know and trust to not egg me on if I'm not feeling it.

Dude, you ski with @Philpug and @Tricia. I hate to break this to ya, but they’re eggers. They egged me a couple of times — once with meatball pizza and another time with martinis, but that was partly @jimmy’s fault too.

 

[Andy Mink]

A

TCH, there's a very simple solution for dealing with aggro male Pugskiers, esp. the older dudes: if it's just for the day, join them after lunch when their butts are whipped and their bellies full of beer. Better yet, if it's a Gathering Week, join them on day three when every muscle they've got is sore and their legs are gimpy as heck.

I resemble that remark! Except the beer part. That comes after I'm done for the day.

 

[Andy Mink]

Dude, you ski with @Philpug and @Tricia. I hate to break this to ya, but they’re eggers. They egged me a couple of times — once with meatball pizza and another time with martinis, but that was partly @jimmy’s fault too.

Nah, I take total responsibility for letting them talk me into falling down the mountain!

 

[DanoT]

TCH, there's a very simple solution for dealing with aggro male Pugskiers, esp. the older dudes: if it's just for the day, join them after lunch when their butts are whipped and their bellies full of beer. Better yet, if it's a Gathering Week, join them on day three when every muscle they've got is sore and their legs are gimpy as heck.

At Gatherings I've been known to join the intermediate group after lunch. I do like to dial it back when traveling solo, with my dog, in my RV on ski trips and skiing mostly unfamiliar mountains. I carry insurance that covers the cost of driving my vehicle back home if I am injured and can't drive.

As far as group skiing goes, I prefer to ski alone and go at my on pace, sometimes slow, sometimes fast, and when the leg strength get going, sometimes top to bottom non stops.

One of the best things about being an old guy (besides the free skiing at Whitefish) is that other people's expectations diminish, meaning less pressure to be macho, and then people under estimate you.

 

[Guy in Shorts]

After the wife retired 4 years ago she has attracted a quiver of amazing female skiers that I get to spent time following down the mountain. Much easier pace following the ladies as compared to the guys. I am quite happy skiing like a girl.

 

[DanoT]

After the wife retired 4 years ago she has attracted a quiver of amazing female skiers that I get to spent time following down the mountain. Much easier pace following the ladies as compared to the guys. I am quite happy skiing like a girl.

^^^LOL. I too have some lady friends who are 5-15 years younger than me and strong skiers who I sometimes ski with, rather than skiing with their husbands/boyfriends.

 

[Ski&ride]

a quiver of amazing female skiers

 

[Monique]

I'm 100% sure that men get more pressure in groups (as a generalization) than women do. Even in a mixed-gender group, the men in the group might be pushing each other, or pushing themselves to compete, even if nothing is verbalized.

For me, groups come in all shapes and sizes (literally!). Best case scenario, I'm skiing with a group whose overall skill level is above mine, at a similar pace, maybe a smidge faster than I'd ski on my own - but they are all people I've skied with a lot. I know that they know my skiing, so my ego doesn't get too involved. People with a playful attitude to skiing, rather than an aggro attitude. (But I can get pretty aggro if there's a lot of standing around on a powder day.)

Not so great scenario: skiing with other people who I want to impress, for whatever reason. Which, when I introspect a little, happens way too often. The specifics vary, but it can lead to some dumb behavior, usually involving going too fast for my skill vs. the conditions. The important thing here is that the pressure I experience is entirely self-generated - I don't remember any situation in skiing where I felt that someone was pressuring me to do something unsafe. Again, I'm sure this very different from mens' experiences.

 

[Lorenzzo]

I competed in other sports and walks of life, I liked it, it was rewarding at times, but that's not what skiing's about for me. What makes skiing joyful for me are the sensations, environment and vibe. When I was younger I surfed, a lot of surfers understand that and in a lot of places it was the prevailing attitude. Ski buds of mine are for the most part like this too, even with powder day lines. I'll ski with anyone for a bit but I've made my exits. Nothing personal, it's fine to be in it for different things.

 

[bbinder]

The main thing that I enjoy about skiing in a group is riding the lift with a bunch of friends or people that I know. I am old enough and comfortable enough with my skills that I generally know how to avoid getting in over my head. My main weapon for avoiding issues with a large group is to know the mountain - the better that I know the mountain, the easier it is for me to take my own path down and just plan to meet at the bottom of a particular lift.

I have a regular boys trip at Alta. We know each other well enough so that good natured insults fly around all day long, but if one of us decides to take an easier way down it is no big deal. Sometimes we get a bunch people joining our group when we are on the hill, and each of us has our own concept of critical mass at which we will peel away from the mass of humanity for an hour or two.

I do have to say that when I am venturing into the woods (especially on an unfamiliar mountain) it is nice to have one or three people with me to help figure out the way down.

 

[BLspruce2]

Interesting.. ..I find that mixed small groups of better skiers are ideal. Socially its fun and plus you can learn alot. I am not worried about the competitiveness. I think you can get better just watching better skiers and following their line, moves etc. I enjoy watching women ski because they have better flow, timing and smoother movements overall. I learned to slowly finish my turns and then transition following a women skier who critiqued my skiing and gave me some pointers. Alot of guys can ski fast and well but just do not look as smooth and effortless as women. I am always impressed with a good women or man who skis with style and grace and am frustrated with how clunky and stiff I ski in comparison. If you always ski alone you do not get any comparison. You can only get that type of feedback in a group.

 

[KingGrump]

TCH, there's a very simple solution for dealing with aggro male Pugskiers, esp. the older dudes: if it's just for the day, join them after lunch when their butts are whipped and their bellies full of beer. Better yet, if it's a Gathering Week, join them on day three when every muscle they've got is sore and their legs are gimpy as heck.

That is why I am usually in the old and slow group during the gatherings. The group provides skiers a refuge from the hard charging groups.

 

[SSSdave]

I'm admittedly not an easy person for many to ski with so tend to be solo though very much like skiing with compatible others, especially easy going others like miss j. I'll often take a run or three with others but am quick to stop and separate. Not one to be dragged around by a rat pack of others per this thread and in any case enjoys meeting lots of strangers on lifts and if riding up solo its tune time.

I usually start slow each day on groomers and then am on mogul slopes with a few breaks on groomers. Of course in this era not a lot of skiers able to handle bumps except on Comet at HV and that is why I'd been skiing there so much. Unlike most, am not much a fan of all mountain slopes (need to add midfats to quiver) unless there is untracked, and am skiing for enjoyment not challenge. Moguls are strenuous so often stop to rest and do so longer than other mogul skiers as am in no hurry. Also take longer relaxing breaks in woods enjoying nature and that familiarity pays off during fresh snow days.

 

[David]

I have friends that are way beyond me and some are struggling intermediate. With people I don't know I always assume that everyone is better than me removing all the bro competition. When we ski as a group we will often meet at the lift and ski the run you want that takes you there. Everyone is encouraged to step beyond their comfort level but only when they feel ready for the challenge in a space that's safe. Do it or don't most of the judgement is in your own head. Regardless lesser skier will improve with better skiers around. When I am the occasional better skier it's still more fun than skiing alone!

 

[dbostedo]

When we ski as a group we will often meet at the lift and ski the run you want that takes you there.

It's nice when there's some terrain variety off the same lift for mixed sklll groups. I've been on both sides of that at times... being the weakest skier, or one of the stronger, depending on the group. I don't mind the "just meet back at the lift" kind of group skiing.

 

[NZRob]

I'm long past the time where I felt any kind of obligation/peer pressure to do anything on skis other than what I am a) comfortable with and b) feel like doing at the time. I ski in family groups and friend groups (but more than 50% by myself) and we have a very relaxed approach to who is doing what. It's usually a 'see you back at the lift' culture. I can't stand that bro culture and the bragging etc etc...yawn. The best skiers tend to be the ones who are the quietest about their accomplishments back at the lodge.

When I was a younger man though and the testosterone was peaking, it was a very different kettle of fish. Who did the biggest air, the fastest run, the hairiest line...yeh for sure there was a lot of peer pressure, but at that time in that place that was great fun and we all pushed ourselves beyond what we thought we were capable of. Most of the 'bro culture' is in that demographic and it's completely normal.

 

[Pequenita]

There's been some research into group dynamics in backcountry skiing and what combinations of gender and experience result in the groups most likely to have fatal or otherwise bad outcomes. Resort skiing for the most part does not require decisionmaking that could result in death.

Slightly OT, I'm curious, if you guys are willing to share, whether upon reflection you have noticed yourself behaving differently in mixed-gender groups vs. all-male groups. Do you ski differently/make different decisions if it's 1 woman skiing with a bunch of guys or if you're the sole guy in a group? What if it's a group where abilities are all over the place vs. where everyone is the same pace and ability? If you're skiing platonically with a mostly female group where abilities are all over the place, do you find yourself helping the one that is struggling the most? Or are you hanging with the woman who is most matched to your ability? Has this changed as you've gotten older or more experienced with skiing?

 

[Jean-Benoit]

There's been some research into group dynamics in backcountry skiing and what combinations of gender and experience result in the groups most likely to have fatal or otherwise bad outcomes. Resort skiing for the most part does not require decisionmaking that could result in death.

Slightly OT, I'm curious whether you guys are willing to share whether, upon reflection, you have noticed yourself behaving differently in mixed-gender groups vs. all-male groups. Do you ski differently/make different decisions if it's 1 woman skiing with a bunch of guys or if you're the sole guy in a group? What if it's a group where abilities are all over the place vs. where everyone is the same pace and ability? If you're skiing platonically with a mostly female group where abilities are all over the place, do you find yourself helping the one that is struggling the most? Or are you hanging with the woman who is most matched to your ability? Has this changed as you've gotten older or more experienced with skiing?

Great questions... Unfortunately I can't speak to most of them as I mostly ski by myself or with a woman friend. But I would point out that a key word in your questions is "platonically"; throw in any attempt at seduction (which often translates in male minds as trying to impress, esp. when they're young), and the whole game changes. The most life threatening scenario I can imagine along those lines is : 20-something male out on a first date skiing... with a much better female skier who has a thing for double black diamonds.

 

[Scruffy]

There's been some research into group dynamics in backcountry skiing and what combinations of gender and experience result in the groups most likely to have fatal or otherwise bad outcomes. Resort skiing for the most part does not require decisionmaking that could result in death.

Slightly OT, I'm curious whether you guys are willing to share whether, upon reflection, you have noticed yourself behaving differently in mixed-gender groups vs. all-male groups. Do you ski differently/make different decisions if it's 1 woman skiing with a bunch of guys or if you're the sole guy in a group? What if it's a group where abilities are all over the place vs. where everyone is the same pace and ability? If you're skiing platonically with a mostly female group where abilities are all over the place, do you find yourself helping the one that is struggling the most? Or are you hanging with the woman who is most matched to your ability? Has this changed as you've gotten older or more experienced with skiing?

For me and the groups that I ski with most of the time, we always wait/accommodate for the slowest skier regardless of gender; notice I said slowest, not weakest, because the slowest may very well be a good skier but one who takes their time. If some of us want to ski tough terrain, and we know not everyone in the group can handle it, we make sure we tell the others what we are doing and those that want to tag along, okay, if not, we'll meet at the lift. Gender is not really in the decision, it's more respect for the individuals we're skiing with.