PTskier

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While the damping doesn't change the flex stiffness, the damping does change how rapidly it will flex, which will feel like a stiffness change. A friend on Z-90s skis fast, and he said that hitting a lump of snow at high speed was like hitting a brick. Instead of flexing and partly absorbing the lump, the skis were thrown by the lump. I agree about the smooth high speed run--like on bullet train rails.
 

Philpug

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While the damping doesn't change the flex stiffness, the damping does change how rapidly it will flex, which will feel like a stiffness change. A friend on Z-90s skis fast, and he said that hitting a lump of snow at high speed was like hitting a brick. Instead of flexing and partly absorbing the lump, the skis were thrown by the lump. I agree about the smooth high speed run--like on bullet train rails.
I am sorry, I have skied the Z90 in almost every condition and I have skied it a a multitude of speeds...I never felt anything close to the feel of a brick.
 

Uncle Louie

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I am sorry, I have skied the Z90 in almost every condition and I have skied it a a multitude of speeds...I never felt anything close to the feel of a brick.
And for what it's worth I had a very pretty set of lines you left to follow on my last run of the season.
 

Tricia

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I've been skiing on the Z-90 for more than a year. I've felt the ease of making slow turns in a lesson and the power that I was looking for in steeps and chutes.
I'm not sure where the "brick" feeling comes from because I have not experienced it.
 

DanoT

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What do people think about the potential longevity of Renoun skis? Will they still ski the same after 100 days? or 200 or 300?
 

Philpug

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What do people think about the potential longevity of Renoun skis? Will they still ski the same after 100 days? or 200 or 300?
Probably the same as any other ski skis after that many days...tired.
 

Brian Finch

PT, CSCS, Cert- DN, FRCms, M|WOD Coach
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Hi folks,

I'm still having trouble reconciling the contrasting views of these skis. Some people love them, think they're the greatest one ski quiver ever, and so on, while others can hardly get them to bend. And these impressions, on both sides, come from experienced skiers.

The differences in perception/experience seem to go beyond the usual. Of course, everybody has somewhat different impressions about skis, but these seem like radical differences.

1) Could people be on different versions of these skis? Have in-line changes been made, so that there are multiple versions out there in the world?

2) Worse, could it be a quality control issue? Could the special damping material, or any other internal parts of the ski, vary greatly between one-ski and another?

3) Could this damping material be particularly temperature sensitive, or sensitive to some other environmental factor?

4) Are these skis especially sensitive to sizing/length options--some people seem to report big differences between skis of only slightly different lengths (184 vs. 178)

5) If not any of the above, are these skis particularly sensitive to different style or techniques?

6) Are these differences just related to speed? The theory of, and the marketing speak for, the damping material suggest that the flex characteristics should vary with speed. Are people's varying impressions just because they ski at different speeds?

I remain curious though skeptical.

Bruno
I owe @Cyrus Schenck some feedback, but I’ll hop in here with my ‘cliff’ notes.....

1) they’re are some diff versions - I’ve skied the proto (LOVED EM!) & there are semi capped & full sidewalled.

2) QC is top shelf - next

3) there is some bias toward soft snow

4) it’s the mounting point vs foot size

5) it’s also the boots....... Grillimid, GripWalk & a replaceable heel protector ...... no bueno

6) noodling around these have a HUGE sweetspot & it narrows at speed. That said, I’ve taken em up to the lower 60’s ripping turns with my wife on her SuperG skis.
 

ScottB

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I am not sure if this is exactly transferable to Renoun skis, but I have experience with my car suspension changing spring stiffness and changing damping settings. I changed all four springs to stiffer ones (about 40% stiffer) and put in adjustable struts with 5 levels of damping.

What I learned from the changes is damping is almost everything. What you think of in terms of how stiff or soft something rides is almost entirely dependent on damping. When driving around I could barely feel the spring stiffness change, but changing the dampers from 1 to 5 felt like riding on a marshmellow versus riding on a brick. Whatever drives the damping changes in the HDT material, will be felt as the ski getting stiffer or softer. I did read the "amount" of HDT varies in the different models, so one model may not change much, while another with a greater percentage of HDT will change significantly more.

I have never skied the Renouns, but I plan to give them a try before the season ends. My son goes to UVM and I may have to visit the factory on my next trip to Burlington, VT.
 

SlideWright

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I just got back from Big Sky, skiing on the Endurance 98 for the first 4 days, and Z90's for the last 2. I had only skied the Endurance for 1 day earlier in the season, on some harder snow, so I was anxious to try them further. They were awesome in some fluffy powder, and in harder wind buff, and chopped up stuff too. I loved them in the bumps. They are soft and compliant and have a nice shape. On the groomers , in firmer snow, they were also great. You can tip and rip as fast as you want to go. When the snow was getting used up , I switched to the Z90's. Not as easy in the bumps. I think the big tail on those makes it too hard to release. Not bad , but different enough that I had to think about it . They are definitely more fun on groomers.
Is the HDT all it is marketed to be? I'm not 100% sure, but I sure had fun on them.
I'm reading contrasting views regarding the Endurance 98s in bumps: 2x4s to fun. After skiing Telluride in variable conditions on my 180cm Z90s, the bumps were not as fun on other skis and the 2x4 comments makes me wonder with as I understand it, the same amount of HDT, if the rockered tips provide more forgiveness. Or is the 2x4 feel or not relative to the pilot?

Comparing the XZ90s to the Endurance 98s, where do they overlap? Where are they clearly differ in soft snow and crud?

At in between the OP's and Phil's size, it sounds like the 178s may be 'my size', eh?

Regarding the changing dampness, I have never experienced this before, but with the Z90s if I hold the turn long enough, the radius seems to tighten and locks in more. It's a pretty fun sensation. How about the 98's in this regard?
 
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chilehed

chilehed

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I am not sure if this is exactly transferable to Renoun skis, but I have experience with my car suspension changing spring stiffness and changing damping settings...
I suspect that you've got your car's damping ratio set up a lot closer to 1.0 than my skis are. When you bounce one of the corners it doesn't oscillate too many times, right? Or not at all? That level of damping's gonna feel a lot different. And remember, the wheel jounce that you're so highly damping on a car is what a ski uses to steer, so a better simile would be a steering damper on a drag bike. It's all about which frequencies you want to filter out.
 

graham418

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I'm reading contrasting views regarding the Endurance 98s in bumps: 2x4s to fun. After skiing Telluride in variable conditions on my 180cm Z90s, the bumps were not as fun on other skis and the 2x4 comments makes me wonder with as I understand it, the same amount of HDT, if the rockered tips provide more forgiveness. Or is the 2x4 feel or not relative to the pilot?

Comparing the XZ90s to the Endurance 98s, where do they overlap? Where are they clearly differ in soft snow and crud?

At in between the OP's and Phil's size, it sounds like the 178s may be 'my size', eh?

Regarding the changing dampness, I have never experienced this before, but with the Z90s if I hold the turn long enough, the radius seems to tighten and locks in more. It's a pretty fun sensation. How about the 98's in this regard?
I would say that these 98's are definitely not 2x4's, nor do they turn into bricks. they are soft and easy in the bumps and trees , but somehow robust enough to go through the chopped up crud in the bowls without collapsing. Not magic, but quite nice.

I am 5'-8", 200lbs and have the 178. I thought about the 184, but Cyrus assured me this was the size. Their website has a barchart showing the overlap in usage between the Z90 and the 98. I think it is reasonably accurate

as for Z90's locking in to a turn, I thnk that is more ski shape, ie large tails that don't let go ,rather than damping.
 

Guy in Shorts

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What do people think about the potential longevity of Renoun skis? Will they still ski the same after 100 days? or 200 or 300?
I have 131 days and 1.6 million vertical on my 98's so far. My 2 year warranty is up in December and it looks like the Renouns will make it if they can survive the pounding of another spring season on Superstar.
 

ScottB

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I suspect that you've got your car's damping ratio set up a lot closer to 1.0 than my skis are. When you bounce one of the corners it doesn't oscillate too many times, right? Or not at all? That level of damping's gonna feel a lot different. And remember, the wheel jounce that you're so highly damping on a car is what a ski uses to steer, so a better simile would be a steering damper on a drag bike. It's all about which frequencies you want to filter out.
What I was trying to do with my car suspension is make it ride smoother. At 1 (min damping) bouncing on the corner made it oscillate about 3-4 times. This was underdamped a bit (<1.0) and rode very smooth and I hardly felt any bumps through the seat. However, when I made a quick lane change, the car would sway so badly from side to side it was hard to control. At 5 shock setting (max damping) you couldn't even get any where near one oscillation from a bounce. The car cornered amazingly, but I felt every pebble on the road through my seat and potholes required chiropractic attention.

The lesson learned was there was an middle damping setting that kept the body sway down and made the impacts reasonable. The more impact I was will to accept, the less the car swayed and the better the handling.

For skis, some feel damp, others feel more springy (poppy) and that is kind of a personal choice which you prefer. At higher speeds, most everyone likes the more damped feel, because the more springy ones can get out of control. So a more ideal ski behavior for most people is less damp at low speeds and more damping at high speeds. I think that is what Renoun is trying to do with their HDT tech. From the mixed reviews, it sounds like the real world usage can get the ski out of some people's comfort zone. This tells me it will be very important to get on the right length ski for your weight and skill set, even more important than a non-HDT ski. They sound very interesting and I want to try a pair for myself.
 

Cyrus Schenck

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I have 131 days and 1.6 million vertical on my 98's so far. My 2 year warranty is up in December and it looks like the Renouns will make it if they can survive the pounding of another spring season on Superstar.
absolutely tell us if they dont!
 
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