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Recommended tune for all mountain mid-fat ski, for the West

Mendieta

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Hi all

I recently bought carving skis and the recommended tune was 1/2. That was for my intended use (see OP). Anyways, my day driever this year will be the same Dynastar Powertrack 89, 179 cm i used last season. These are in need of a tune, too. Should I also have the edges tuned at 1/2 ? These are more of an all mountain ski, but I would like to do more/better carving on those, too. I still want them to be forgiving and able to pivot and release easily. Most of the use at Tahoe and some Utah.

I could just assume that the recommendation made for the carvers I bought (Head Rally 170) would carry to these, but I realize they are a different beast, so I'll rather ask. Thanks in advance!
 

ski otter 2

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For the Rally, a real in-between carver, maybe go with 1/3 or .7/3; though 1/2 or .7/2 will work well too.
The difference is noticeable, but neither sucks.

(1/2 to me feels slightly smoother on the slopes, 1/3 feels slightly more defined or precise in carving.
.7 feels slightly more immediate, responsive.)

(Kastle puts a 1/2 on their skis, as I understand it, and their skis are pretty much carvers first, for the most part.)


For the Powertrack 89, a great optional pivoter or carver, your choice, as I gather: 1/2 would be my choice. But again, both would work well.

(Note: I've done my own tuning for years, using different bevels on different skis.)
 

François Pugh

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1 base 2 side is great for what you describe for the power track 89.

I agree that side angle should be at least 3 for the carver, and while 1 is more forgiving and better for non-carving duties (like bumps), 0.5 base really tightens things up and makes for a more precise carver.

For soft snow, it doesn't make that much of a difference. I wouldn't change anything until you need a base grind.
 

Read Blinn

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Of course, it also depends on where you live. If you ski soft snow, mostly, a 1/2 will be fine — real sharpness isn't much necessary when your edges are always in the snow as opposed to on the snow.

Where edging isn't easy, for instance in New England after one of our pleasant thaw/freeze cycles, sharp edges are what permit you to (more or less) penetrate the "snow." All of my skis are tuned to .5 - 1/3. My SLs have radial bases .7-.5-.7; my all mountain skis are all 1º. I reset my Kästles, which came from the factory at 1/2, to 1/3.

A 1º base hooks up more gradually, a .5º base hooks up quicker.
 

KingGrump

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If your Rally is at 1/2 then I would hold the Dynastar at 1/2 also.

You'll know when you want/need to graduate to a 1/3.
 

SkiFree

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If your Rally is at 1/2 then I would hold the Dynastar at 1/2 also.

You'll know when you want/need to graduate to a 1/3.
@KingGrump For the uninitiated, how do you know when different tunes will "feel" right without having tried them? As a relative novice to tuning, I am only recently getting into the world of edge and base angles. It seems like adjusting the angle will be a fairly permanent decision, so how do you know when to take the plunge?
 

Read Blinn

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Edge grip tells you. If you often ski on snow that's hard to edge (and you're technically proficient), consider sharper edges.

Sharp bases, whatever the angle, have a big effect on edge grip. Unless you're a professional (or highly experienced) tuner, though, you'd be safer leaving bases to a good race shop — a very light touch with a fine diamond stone is the most I'll do. Reducing base angles (1º to .5º for instance), requires a base grind.

In the East, a 3º side is common among people who care. We're often on bullet-resistant surfaces.
 

silverback

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@KingGrump For the uninitiated, how do you know when different tunes will "feel" right without having tried them? As a relative novice to tuning, I am only recently getting into the world of edge and base angles. It seems like adjusting the angle will be a fairly permanent decision, so how do you know when to take the plunge?

If you think you want a 0.7° base bevel you can have your shop set them that way and add more (go back to 1°) if you don't like it. You cant go the other way without a grind. It is pretty easy to change the side bevel if you want to try a 3° and decide to go back to 2°
 

KingGrump

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@KingGrump For the uninitiated, how do you know when different tunes will "feel" right without having tried them? As a relative novice to tuning, I am only recently getting into the world of edge and base angles. It seems like adjusting the angle will be a fairly permanent decision, so how do you know when to take the plunge?

I believe both @Read Blinn and @silverback have good answers to your question.

The base angle generally determine the hook up rate. For true race skis - 0.5˚/0.7˚ on hard snow is a good match. For all mountain skis in softer snow, I would go with a 1˚ base angle. (Most snow west of the Rockies are soft snow.) :D Not so twitchy.

The side edge angle usually determines how much edge grip you'll get from the ski. a 3˚ edge will be have more edge grip than a 2˚ edge. Edge grip is a two edged sword. It all depends on your ability level and situation.
A sharper edge at the tip will be more precise at turn entry. It'll pull the ski into the turn in a stronger manner.
A sharper tail will allow a stronger finish at the bottom of the turn when your COM is shifted slight AFT (NOT sitting back). The caveat here is if you are in the back seat, the ski will not release. (Houston, we have a lift off :eek: ), Not a good thing.

Base edge wise, I would suggest you leave that to the shop when you get a base grind. Just check it with a true bar. A lot of shop will tell you they beveled tour base edges while in reality - they can't be bothered. They figured you can't tell anyway. That is why a finding a good shop is a must. Always check their work.

Side edge wise, I would start with a 2˚ first. If that holds for you. You are all set. For some of the really firm groomers below the steeps and bumps at the top of Mammoth, a 3˚ edge is not out of the question. You can go easily from a 2˚ to a 3˚ side edge without sacrifice in life of the side edge. Going from a 3˚ down to a 2˚ edge, you'll loose some edge life. Not really a big deal unless you do it often.

Most shops do the majority of their tuning via machines. Generally the quality of work on the tips and tails are not as well blended as one can hope for. You can help that by feathering the tune from tip to tail. This will help greatly in terms of smooth turn entry and exit.

Good luck and have fun in your tuning sessions.
 

PTskier

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If you really want to see a blank expression, ask the shop guy how often the calibrate the angle settings on their edge grinder. :huh: You'll get a similar look of incomprehension when you ask if they have an edge bevel angle gauge.
MTK-3157-ski-side-base-edge-bevel-gauge-measure-angle__11567.1314951963.190.250.JPG


The less acute angle, 1&2, will result in a smaller divot knocked out of the edge when you hit that rock hidden under the surface. The more acute angle, 1&3 or 0.7&3, will show a bigger bit knocked out but better grip on hard pack. I like 0.7º base & 3° sides on my Rallys. I like 1º & 2º on my powder skis.
 

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