Rates for Independent Ski Instruction?

[murphysf]

Hello

Does anyone know what the going hourly rate is to hire a ski instructor that is not part of the resorts ski school?

For the Lake Tahoe area there seems to be alot of qualified college students that worked as ski instructors at resorts in the past and are now breaking out on there own and posting lessons on various local websites, Nextdoor, Facebook, etc.

Most are asking $100 an hour for private lessons but then I found a website that lists what lake tahoe area instructors get paid:
Base Pay Rates

• HTA Level 1 - $17 per hour
• PSIA-AASI Level 1 - $18 per hour
• PSIA-AASI Level 2 - $23 per hour
• PSIA-AASI Level 3 - $26 per hour

Incentives Program

• Lessons with kids under 6:+$5 hourly bonus
• Lessons in the rain:+$5 hourly bonus
• Private Requests:+$10 hourly bonus
• Plus instructors always keep 100% of tips!

Not sure how accurate this is but seems like Instructors working at resorts top out at no way near $100?

I am asking as I am exploring options for my kids and just learned about Instructors that are not associated with the resort as an option.

Any other feedback pro or con about this route would be appreciated. I understand like most other things in life you would want to be able to know the instructors qualifications and check references.

 

[Near Nyquist]

I hate to say this but resorts frown on this type of stuff
To the point of pulling your pass permanently
Especially in the Tahoe Basin

So you can take the risk it’s your choice but ...
Know the consequences

 

[KingGrump]

So you are perfectly comfortable with letting you kids go off with couple of undocumented strangers straight off the street?

 

[Near Nyquist]

So you are perfectly comfortable with letting you kids go off with couple of undocumented strangers straight off the street?

I ski with you and look what happened

 

[Jeffc7]

As others have stated, this is a big no no at the resorts, but to answer your questions the instructors do not get paid anything near $100/hr, though the resorts charge $100+ for private lessons. However, the resort is insured, has amenities, have kid specialists and can cut line. It is a big risk hiring some random facebook person. As an adult it may be worth the gamble, but I'd never leave my kids with a random person.

 

[Tricia]

The only time I see any kind of sanctioned lessons that don't go through the resort is when its a clinic, and even then, the person who is teaching or organizing the teaching, has to go through some big hurdles to make it happen.
I know @bud heishman has had permission to do his synergy camp at Mt Rose in the past, and Chris Fellows from NASTC had some camps at various Tahoe resorts with their permission.
I can't imagine any resort sanctioning a private lesson without going through their ski school.

 

[markojp]

In the pnw, some areas allow consession schools to operate by formal agreement. I'm pretty confident that if 'off the books privates' taught by college kids and sold via social media becomes a thing, areas will quickly shut them down via sting operations, etc. I've been asked to teach off the books, but I will not. Aside from potential huge personal liability issues, I have no desire to be banned from local ski hills and be on permanent 'no hire' lists.

 

[jimtransition]

If you research the person you are skiing with and they seem experienced and qualified, you'd probably get a better deal (and more likely a better instructor) than going through the resort. No cutlines obviously is a negative, and it's not generally condoned by the resorts so the instructor will probably be trying to fly under the radar. They should charge less than regular ski school, but much less wouldn't be worth it for them.

 

[Mike Thomas]

Most are asking $100 an hour for private lessons but then I found a website that lists what lake tahoe area instructors get paid:
Base Pay Rates

• HTA Level 1 - $17 per hour
• PSIA-AASI Level 1 - $18 per hour
• PSIA-AASI Level 2 - $23 per hour
• PSIA-AASI Level 3 - $26 per hour

Incentives Program

• Lessons with kids under 6:+$5 hourly bonus
• Lessons in the rain:+$5 hourly bonus
• Private Requests:+$10 hourly bonus
• Plus instructors always keep 100% of tips!

Are you looking to purchase a lesson or hire employees for a ski school??? The rate for a lesson and the pay scale for employees are different things. It's kind of how business/commerce works, you pay your employee less than you charge for their service.

 

[martyg]

1. In the vast majority of cases it is illegal. It is considered defrauding an innkeeper in most states.

2. How are you going to know if they are qualified? Unless they have a PSIA or USSA credential chances are they are a bro-dude who knows a little bit more than you. In my experience in teaching for 30 years, that college kid with no credentials, or with a PSIA L1 from last year is not going to be a value to you If anything you will get a lot of bad information.

 

[jmeb]

Keep in mind all these answers are US-Centric.

It is my understanding that in Europe for instance, ski schools are independent. And because competition exists, tend to be much more reasonably priced.

 

[Ken_R]

Are you looking to purchase a lesson or hire employees for a ski school??? The rate for a lesson and the pay scale for employees are different things. It's kind of how business/commerce works, you pay your employee less than you charge for their service.

Of course. But ski school is somewhat of a racket with both customers and instructors getting the short end of the stick MOST of the time. I have not taken a class in years, not that I dont need it but because they are very expensive. Around here Loveland is the most affordable followed by Arapahoe Basin. They are pretty reasonable compared to the cost of lessons at any of the Vail Resorts. I have no clue on the quality of the instruction but they seem like good options.

Humm maybe I should take a class or two.

 

[markojp]

If you research the person you are skiing with and they seem experienced and qualified, you'd probably get a better deal (and more likely a better instructor) than going through the resort. No cutlines obviously is a negative, and it's not generally condoned by the resorts so the instructor will probably be trying to fly under the radar. They should charge less than regular ski school, but much less wouldn't be worth it for them.

A better instuctor.. in the pnw, no. I know pretty much every high quality instructor in this region. Not one is a college kid with a year if teaching under their belt. There are NONE flying under the radar, and as others have said, it will get you permanently banned from the hill. Now if you want a hill side nanny or baby sitter for the kids, maybe that's a different possibility.

 

[Coach13]

Lesson costs and instructor pay is what it is based on supply and demand. I too wish instructor pay was higher, but as long as resorts can meet lesson demands and have no issue hiring instructors it won’t change much. I try to justify the high cost of instruction by at least making sure I find a good instructor and then I try to tip generously to help the instructors supplement their pay.

 

[jmeb]

Humm maybe I should take a class or two.

You're skiing ability and ability to ski midweek makes this a no-brainer. The Advanced Skills Workshops at Loveland are half-day and $90 ($120 if you need a lift ticket.) You're likely to have a private lesson if you take it on any day except Fri-Sunday.

 

[martyg]

You're skiing ability and ability to ski midweek makes this a no-brainer. The Advanced Skills Workshops at Loveland are half-day and $90 ($120 if you need a lift ticket.) You're likely to have a private lesson if you take it on any day except Fri-Sunday.

Totally agree. No brainer. Also ask for someone who can do video analysis. Some of us ski with tablets loaded with a video analysis app.

Other paths:

1. Dedicated clinics: I start my ski season with a 6 day clinic at Loveland every year. I am skiing with PSIA D-Team and former USST coaches and athletes. Cost? About $1,900 for 6 days of coaching, lodging and tickets. Since I am taking a year off from instruction I'll likely do the Mahre Clinic at DV. It is more than my early season clinic, but we'll treat it as a vaca.

2. Join PSIA RM. If you want to get serious about improving nothing will move you along like the PSIA track. With RM, you don't have to be an active instructor to join, or take advantage of the huge array of clinics available. Do join & come to the Edwin Terrell Memorial Clinic. It will open your mind.

Enjoy.

 

[Josh Matta]

As someone who chooses to work with in the system the system it self is flawed.

IMO resort have way to much of a monopoly on this service, and their should be a legal way of competing against them. The thing is if your the resort competition is bad for the resort or operating company, even if its good for the instructors and guest. The issue really isnt pay, even though I would love to see a higher percentage of what my request pay, for me its polices with no thought on to location.

If I was legally allowed to work out side of the resorts labor structure, and had to carry insurance just for myself and not as a collective my guess is 100 dollars and hours would be about what I would need to charge to make it worth while especially after self employed taxes were imposed on me. If I was below the table with no insurance 45-50 dollars an hour would be more than 95 percent of of top ski instructor make per hour. I get dozens of request for free lancing a lessons every year and have turned every single on down, and its a lot easier when the monetary offer is less than what the resort would pay for the same lesson. Even if it was more, a one time hit of a couple hundred dollars is nothing compared to a year ski teaching.

but I would personally welcome a concession ski school model to compete against the resort run ski schools. Right now the resorts have an effective regulated monopoly, and the only thing worse than a free market monopoly, is one that government upholds though laws. There is no real market competition on the labor end with all resorts choosing fairly universally to have roughly the same pay.

 

[karlo]

exploring options

I suggest having objectives first. If the only reason is cost, the many posts above should pretty much, I think, dissuade you.

 

[Bad Bob]

Just don't do it. It is wrong on so many different levels. If for no other reason, consider what it teaches your kids.

The system may be badly flawed, but it is the system that has evolved in this country over the past 80 years.

 

[Wilhelmson]

It's right up there with going over the speed limit with your kids in your car.

If you understand the risks, can get you kids some good lessons, save money, and help someone make some side cash maybe you'll be able to live with yourself.