Random thought on skiing powder

[Josh Matta]

the thing is that video is legit 30-40 inches of new snow, but you only ride on the top couple inches when its that dense. Not sure how more of it would change anything.....

Chris V next powder cycled you should fly me out;P I am sure i can easily diagnosis any issue your having, and then prescribe some 4frnt renegades

 

[David Chaus]

Speaking as a PNW skier, when we get deep snow it’s usually the Cascade Concrete variety. This week is a bit different as it is colder than typical, and the snow that has fallen in the past 24-48 hours is not “setting up” late in the day (where it gets firm and consolidated without even being skied out too much). Yesterday (Saturday) started out dust-on-crust and as more snow accumulated was getting pretty good by the time I left.

But I digress.....the heavy, dense Cascade Concrete can be challenging with 6” or more of snow. I find that I usually need to keep my feet a little closer together, and more evenly weighted. Basic parallel with some skidding/drifting, rather than carved turns. Just as importantly is to turn gradually, slowly, and be more patient. As Josh mentioned, hooky skis are not your friend, so it requires even more patience, whereas as a ski with more tip and tail taper and a larger radius sidecut will allow that easing in and out of the turns.

I think one also has to have a feel for the snow, that is, a sense of weighting/unweighting or pressure management. For me this is the most critical element. I can’t ski these conditions as if it were a groomer, rather I need to feel for when I can float and when I need to settle into the arc of the turn, when to ease up and when to let them run.

Kind of like the skills needed for skiing crud, only it hasn’t become cut up crud yet.

 

[CalG]

So what is different when the snow is banging hard on your shins up to the knees?

Well, Point 'em straight down the fall line until they come up and out, then make shallow turns to maintain speed.
Sometimes straight lining is the best you can do when the snow is resisting your forward motion.
Fat skis float at lower speeds, that's the only difference.

Examples of boot top and less isn't really the OP's topic.
Just because you can push a pole in deeper, if the snow isn't battering your shins, flowing up and over your waist and shoulders, It's not deep.

I return to the two skis moving as one technique. 'Never fails me.

 

[Josh Matta]

yeah the thing is I have never seen snow that I have sunk into that deep and was heavy at the same time. IMO it doesnt exist, someone prove me wrong. there has got to be video out there somewhere if it exist.

Also deepness is now measured by how deep you get into it, not how much snow fell.

 

[slowrider]

"Attempted" to ski waist deep, 4 ft (standing up) Cascade new snow on 165cm Elan SL skis. On the groom with 4 ft of new where a base could support the skis good times. Off piste with no bottom, no bueno. Snowboards didn't fair well either.

 

[CalG]

 

[Josh Matta]

doesnt look like sierra cement.

WIll sierra cement actually plume like that?

 

[Josh Matta]

also I mean not sure how that differs from this.


still dont have any video of you skiing eh?

 

[CalG]

doesnt look like sierra cement.

WIll sierra cement actually plume like that?

Re-read the original post for the snow type in consideration.
For sure the video is not showing Bridger "Cold Smoke".

 

[CalG]

also I mean not sure how that differs from this.

still dont have any video of you skiing eh?

I don't see a difference either.

How I ski is not material to this thread.
Proclaiming ones self , "The best skier on the mountain" gets knar points, but little else.

 

[SSSdave]

...I'm talking here primarily about the denser stuff, deep, that pushes back on you. Not wet, not sticky, not crusted--just dense. So, how does our interaction with that kind of snow differ from our usual interaction? I've been thinking about the fact that not only does such snow push on the bottoms of our skis, it also pushes pretty hard against our legs...No transitions, pretty uniform all over the mountain.

Obviously members are having a difficult time making sense of your terse question. I just went back and reread each of your posts. It isn't that members are reading too much into your question but rather the description isn't understood. So is about a general snow quality. With fresh powder what you related about "pushes pretty hard against our legs" may be misinterpreted if you meant the forward resistance going through snow in front of legs. In other words not that the snow below is so solid that when one pushes down with legs it does not give much. If referring to that forward resistance, everyone that has posted would immediately know what you are referring to and people talk about such here frequently. Like it was so deep, I could only ski steeper slopes.

The drier colder lighter snow, the more we can move deeper within snow. And the deeper we are, the more resistance there is against our legs/boots/skis moving forward as the snow parts to the side. Often due to the nature of storms, the coldest lightest snow falls last with increasingly denser snow with depth. If one skis straight down a deep fresh powder slope without adequate gradient for skier weight, ski width/type, without dynamic turning as seems to be popular with many today, one may bog down to stop or be moving at such a slow speed, that it becomes increasingly difficult to turn at all. By making dynamic bouncing powder turns using a bendable softer powder ski, one will be able to ski lower slope gradients in such snow because bouncing up out and down in and up out again etc using a skis flexing rebound brings one out of where forward resistance has more effect down below. If one does not ski like that, then one either needs to ski steeper slopes or with a stiffer powder ski with minimal ski flexing use greater speed glancing off a snow surface from turn to turn.

 

[Chris V.]

Obviously members are having a difficult time making sense of your terse question. ...It isn't that members are reading too much into your question but rather the description isn't understood. So is about a general snow quality. With fresh powder what you related about "pushes pretty hard against our legs" may be misinterpreted if you meant the forward resistance going through snow in front of legs. In other words not that the snow below is so solid that when one pushes down with legs it does not give much. If referring to that forward resistance, everyone that has posted would immediately know what you are referring to and people talk about such here frequently. Like it was so deep, I could only ski steeper slopes.

It was so deep, I could only ski steeper slopes. It was so deep, that everyone on the mountain was in that same boat. It wasn't just the depth. It was the combination of depth and density. We get that sometimes in the Sierra Nevada.

To recap, it was snow that pushes back on you. Not wet, not sticky, not crusted--just dense. More precisely, the snow had come down light and fluffy for quite a while, but then a pretty thick denser but still cold and dry layer fell on top forming a cap. So one's knees were pushing on that cap layer, and a track would show a well-defined break in the surface. Meanwhile the skis sank pretty far. No solid bottom.

My observation was simply that not only does such snow push on the bottoms of our skis, it also pushes pretty hard against our legs. The question for the group was, how does our interaction with that kind of snow differ from our usual interaction? Nothing more to it than that. An attempt to spark an interesting discussion. I wasn't having issues with which I was requesting help.

Over and out on this thread!

 

[Josh Matta]

Get longer/fatter skis so your legs push against it less, how big are you and what skis are you on?