Cheizz

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If you're in Europe, have a look at skibuy.at.... well-serviced, used models from an Austrian shop. I buy from them if I can (I'm in The Netherlands)
 

farang

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Yes, I'm from europe. Will check, thanks for the hint :).
 

Cheizz

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Question: is the 2018 Stöckli Laser SL different from the 2016 or 2017 versions (other than print)? If so, any significant changes in feel, power, etc.?
 

John Baumer

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I would be surprised if there was much of a difference between years on the Stöckli. I have skied most of the "cheater SLs" on the market and IMO the Stöckli Laser SL is in a class by its self. The place I bought mine from calls it their "Secret Ski". They weren't kidding, the Laser SL has a different personality that the others. BTW, mine are 170s with Marker Piston Plates and 16 DINs. This might be overkill for some, for a recreational SL. I'm 6'4' and 270.
 

KevinF

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I would be surprised if there was much of a difference between years on the Stöckli. I have skied most of the "cheater SLs" on the market and IMO the Stöckli Laser SL is in a class by its self. The place I bought mine from calls it their "Secret Ski". They weren't kidding, the Laser SL has a different personality that the others. BTW, mine are 170s with Marker Piston Plates and 16 DINs. This might be overkill for some, for a recreational SL. I'm 6'4' and 270.
What do you find different about the SL from the others? Can you elaborate on the "different personality" aspect?
 

John Baumer

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What do you find different about the SL from the others? Can you elaborate on the "different personality" aspect?
You ask.....I will give it a shot. For starters, keep in mind that these impressions are coming from a person on the far end of the size spectrum. I am 6'4" and north of 260. I ski in Michigan were a short radius ski is a must have IMO. One day during a grooming break I was killing time in the ski shop talking skis with the man, and he says " Ever try a SL?" I respond "NO"...The guy sets up a pair of Fischer 165 cheater SLs and I was changed forever. I never imagined a ski could be such ripping fun. I slept on it, and returned the next day to buy. I have owned or skied extensively the following over the past 7 years. Fischer SC 165 [cheater SL] This was very capable and outstanding fun! Surprisingly versatile as well. If I would have been able to find one in a 170 size, I might still have it.
Head SS Magnum 163, just an easy going short radius ski.
Head iSL 170 [cheater SL],Surprisingly versatile like the Fischer SCs. Fantastic ski to work on very high edge angles. Smooth but nice hard snap out of a turn. IMO one of the best choices.
Dynastar WC 165 [FIS], this was another "Here,try this" situation from the Dynastar rep in a on hill demo. These were softer flexing than my Head iSLs even though they are FIS skis. Like skiing on X Acto blades, suspended on soft springs. Outrageous fun on good firm cord. Not a versatile ski.
Atomic Redster 171 [cheater SL], not my favorite. Came with a factory tune that so bad, it took serious work to make them "fair". Most fun I had with these was in spring slush...go figure. Just a short radius ski.
Head iSL RD 165 [FIS], This is a great ski for running gates IMO. It may have something to do with my size, but I really like a 170 SL ski .I just didn't make friends with these for my intended use.
Stöckli Laser SL 170 [Cheater SL], this is not my first pair of Stocklis. They are different from the others in many ways. For starters they are a 14.5R ski, much broader than the traditional 13ish R that others offer. I think Fischer sizes that way in their cheater SLs as well. The Laser SLs are an odd blend of SMOOTH, yet nasty. I reserve skiing these for when I want a ski with attitude. When going edge to edge with these, they keep daring you to "tickle the dragon" more and more. The edge grip is truly outrageous as it takes a little time to build trust. When you do, that's when these turn in to a "special ski". One of the biggest differences would be the price. The Laser SL with a Marker Piston Plate and Race Bindings runs a bit over $1400.00 if my memory is correct. Perhaps some of this has to do with the fact that only one dealer in the US had the 170 size. Hope this helps.
 

Viking9

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Well my new 2018 Rossi hero elite st’s with the R21 plate , in 172 are on there way from Suburban ski and bike out of Connecticut and hats off to them for a great experience, very helpful and on top of the ski and everything that goes with this type of ski.
I ski mammoth and we really don’t ever get icy conditions so I went with the 172 , I’m 6’1 175 and don’t race or spend too much time on groomers.
One thing I did do on there advice was to get the SPX race binding instead of the Rockerflex, the SPX race does not have the piece that links the toe and heel, Todd the gentleman who helped me suggested the SPX because a lot of coaches and PSIA guys found this style of binding made the ski more versatile and the overall flex was better, I won’t be racing and I will be using this as my frontside ripper and bump ski, really looking forward to having a little more athlete under me than my pursuits.
Because I still ski old style, independent leg action and some unweighting, I can do a two ski carve and roll my ankles but that turn is really only for racing and deserted green groomers, I went with .75 and three and a little gummy for the tip and tails, I don’t really finish my turns ,,,,, can’t wait to get out there.
Again another shout out to Suburban ski and bike for a great experience, knowledge and great price on the ski and binding.
 

Viking9

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Just received my new front side rippers!!
As someone said they really do have the bindings toward the rear, a lot lighter than my 2007 CS70’S no surprise there.
This will be my most aggressive ski and tune, actually went with the 5 and 3 tune and race prep.
I’m sure I will have to adjust and find what they like, but hey I adjusted to the slippery as all hell feeling of my no camber full banana rocketed Scimitar twin tips so as the great Huck Finn once said * I’VE BEEN THERE BEFORE *
 

JTurner

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Has anybody had any luck dialing out the hooky feeling in this type of ski when getting really forward? I’m using the head in gates some this year, and I wonder if either; A) more base bevel in the first 2-3 inches of snow contact, or B) just a hint of detuning in the first 1-2 inches might make them work a little better. I’m running 0.5/3.0 now.

The issue I’m having is if I ski them far enough forward for the steeper tighter parts of a course, they get really turny and slow, but if I stay more over the middle I just can’t get the turn started enough above the fall line. New (FIS) slaloms aren't in the cards until next season, so trying to make the best of what I have for now.

Any feedback is appreciated
 

JTurner

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Head I.sl, on the line

Do you think moving one hole forward and skiing centered might be better?
 
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Seldomski

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Nice reviews and discussion. Glad this popped up, as I am going to Italy (Cortina) soon to ski and I think I will try my first slalom ski. When in Rome...
 
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ScotsSkier

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Head I.sl, on the line

Do you think moving one hole forward and skiing centered might be better?
It depends! Different brands respond differently to moving the binding, that is whey i asked which ski you are on.

wrt skiing centered, again it would help to understand how you are defining that. Skiing centered but driving in the cuff of the boot to load up the front of the ski are not mutually exclusive IMHO
 

JTurner

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By centered I mean flexing my ankle and driving pressure to the front of the ski through the tongue. Just not pulling feet back so much that my balance feels forward on my toes.
 
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ScotsSkier

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By centered I mean flexing my ankle and driving pressure to the front of the ski through the tongue. Just not pulling feet back so much that my balance feels forward on my toes.
yes, that is where you should be ideally. Particularly on a slalom ski, you need to be able to recover form sudden fore/aft changes (why I prefer the 165 to a 157) .

Of course make sure that when flexing you are also driving hard into the cuff of the boot (and it is not just folding up rather than transmitting power to the ski!) and also keeping your hips forward and body down the hill rather than following the skis (that would be one of my first thoughts when you say driving the front of the ski makes you slower). Watch how Hirscher keeps his body square in the fall line

Whoops, missed your earlier post about the Head iSL. On the Head RD Sl I preferred it a half inch forward so it would be worth experimenting with moving the binding one hole forward on the plate. IIRC the predrilled holes on that plate are 10mm increments. I wouldn't go beyond that though. For example on teh Atomic FIS slaloms they are very sensitive to moving too far forward. On the 7 position X series binding I have found that (with 4 as the center) you can move it forward to 3 but going to 2 causes a rapid drop off in performance. on teh pre 2018 Rossis, a lot of racers like the binding one hole forward (although I have been happy with it centered) - the 2018 has actually moved the plate forward
 
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JTurner

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Thanks for the insights. I’ll give it a try this week and report back on my observations after 2-3 days on snow.
 

JTurner

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Well, funny thing happened. In a poignant demonstration of the wisdom offered in the original (non FIS) slalom ski review... when I was going to move my bindings I noticed one of my shovels had started delaminating. So, no test of the mounting position change, but I’ll be moving to the RD this week and I’m really looking forward to how they perform.
 
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ScotsSkier

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Well, funny thing happened. In a poignant demonstration of the wisdom offered in the original (non FIS) slalom ski review... when I was going to move my bindings I noticed one of my shovels had started delaminating. So, no test of the mounting position change, but I’ll be moving to the RD this week and I’m really looking forward to how they perform.
Oh Bummer!!! yes, the non-FIS are really not designed to spend much time in gates or this is the result. To be fair you can experience the same with a FIS slalom ski as well but it tends to take longer. How bad is it? Can you glue and clamp it?

OTOH, will be interesting to see how you like the RD! great ski!
 

JTurner

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Love the RD!

Seriously, trained last night, and on a couple warm up runs I could tell it was a little stiffer than the non FIS, and that it didn't pull you into the top of the turn as much. But overall, I was a little surprised it didn't seem all that much different. In the course though, with fairly hard snow last night, night and day better. I could really pressure it and it would hold, even after the course had gotten good and scraped out. The more I put into it, the better it performed, it would return energy and I could carve above the fall line. The tails are't very stiff, can't spend time back there, but you can ski the middle of the ski.

Love the RD...
 

markojp

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Head I.sl, on the line

Do you think moving one hole forward and skiing centered might be better?
Skiing the iSL RD as well at .75/3 on line. Phenomenal ride! FWIW I've never had a run on a non FIS SL that felt right... Just too soft in front and squirrelly.
 

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