Pow Ski Ideas

[Tom K.]

Well, after two of the best resort pow days of the year at Mt. Hood Meadows, powder ski thoughts are raging again.......

Me: 6'2", 195 pounds, 56 years old, still skiing pretty fast. Level 10 in ability, probably a solid 8 when evaluated by a technically excellent instructor. No longer seeking air.

Day 1 was on my 193 Patrons. I like this ski a lot. No tip dive ever, super easy, quick, surprising fun on groomed segments, etc. But, the rockered tails seem to lack support in chop, and honestly, I just find turn completion on a ski with this much tail rocker kind of unsatisfying.

Day 2 was on a pair of ancient but lightly skied 185 Line Influence 115s. A bit of early rise. No tail rocker or rise, but they do have upturned tails. These tails get my undying LOVE, but the front of the ski is prone to dive. Overall, the ski is overly-damp, so blasts the dickens out of crud, but is oh so dull on groomed segments.

Who's got some ideas? Any ski has to be wide. I'm not small, and Mt. Hood Meadows is not steep. The ability to make low angle turns is essential. I'm strictly a resort guy, so performance in chop and crud is a requirement after 10 AM (nobody in Hood River goes to work on a midweek powder day).

Finally, with powder skis especially, I am a huge fan of Josh's embracing of "trailing edge technology" because price is king in this situation.

Thanks!

 

[SBrown]

I've been super impressed with my Volkl 100Eights, and it should be easy enough to find a demo. I've skied 2 full days on them, one was a mixed bag at Vail (leftovers, groomers, and a trip out the gate to find soft boot-deep snow and trees), and then yesterday. Winter Park reported 14", and that was probably more like 18 and up at Mary Jane. I was in up to my knees quite often. Snow was fairly heavy and had some wind-affected spots, both slabs and deposits. I had skied these in softer winterier crud, but not heavier springier crud, and they were awesome. I really don't remember the tips hanging in anything, they just slice through. Or float, depending on how you tip em.

That said, this is still CO, not PNW, and our heavy snow may be your blower pow ... not really sure. In any case, these do have a flat tail and I never got any tip dive at all.

 

[Ken_R]

The Helldorado is a burlier version of the Patron. I absolutely loved the Patron and found it really good in just about any resort condition. Loved the steeps.

I would also check out Moment Ski's offerings. They have a great lineup of powder oriented skis. I tried the Deathwish and loved it as a one ski quiver resort ski for out West.

 

[Tom K.]

@SBrown, I like everything I've read about the 100Eights, except for my size and our lack of steepness, I'd probably be looking for a 100Eighteen! Any thoughts on the Shiro? I've read that, despite the lack of camber (which I typically require in a ski), they have a very traditional feel to them.

@Ken_R, though I typically enter into an illicit love affair every time I ski a Nordica, I am not feeling the love for the tail of the Patron, so would be pretty reluctant to consider the Helldo. I think I'd LOVE a wider El Capo, with its flatter tail. And, boy howdy, I've sure thought a lot about the Moment Bibby Pro (OG version, now available as the Blister Pro).

Thanks, keep the ideas coming. I've pondered the Bodacious. I suspect my thoughts will quickly turn to cycling, but for now, I'm looking to steal a pair of pow skis at late season blowout pricing.

 

[Erik Timmerman]

Can you move the binding on your Patrons?

 

[SBrown]

@SBrown, I like everything I've read about the 100Eights, except for my size and our lack of steepness, I'd probably be looking for a 100Eighteen! Any thoughts on the Shiro? I've read that, despite the lack of camber (which I typically require in a ski), they have a very traditional feel to them.

I have not skied the Shiro. I do know it's being replaced by the Confession, about which I did hear positive things. It has titanal strips down the middle, I guess, and some tail rocker. Shiro is flat tail.

 

[ARL67]

What about V-Werks Katana 191 ?
I see/read of more guys riding the VWK now that they are heavily on-sale.
There is no difference from the original black "au-natural" carbon top-sheet, and the current white top-sheet.
Methinks the black ones look much better anyway.

I had VWK in 177 for a season. Sold them for no good reason, as is typical of my ski-buying-trying-selling habits.
However, a few weeks ago I did re-buy a new set of VWK 185 to be next year's wide-ski -> I just can't seem to say No to great sale prices. I have yet to read of anything anywhere, other than high-praise for the VWK, except for the original price tag.

FYI - my pal has his used 191 VWK available, mounted with Jester Pros for 319 BSL, shoot me a PM if of interest. He calls his VWK the quiver-killer. It covers so many bases that it prevents him from buying more skis in the 100-115 range.

If you like DPS, then consider the DPS RPC, also probably on sale now. The RPC is the "charger-oriented" version of the Wailer 112RP, and is rumoured to be discontinued next year. If those suit your fancy, grab one while you can before they are no-more.

Also, SkiEssentials has Volkl One & Two on for dirt dirt dirt dirt dirt cheap.
Though not sure they would give you your groomer performance.

~ Andy

 

[Erik Timmerman]

Where are you seeing cheap V-Werks Katanas?

 

[Tom K.]

Can you move the binding on your Patrons?

Marker Griffons, so not very easily. What did you have in mind?

@ARL67, even at sale prices, the VWK is not in my "spring stealing" price range (and my BSL is 335, dang it)! Finally, the Volkl Two looks interesting, but it's hard to find many reviews on it. It's definitely in the stealing price range.

 

[Erik Timmerman]

Marker Griffons, so not very easily. What did you have in mind?

Just curious. I have Schizos on mine and played around to find my spot. I just don't get the feeling you describe in the tail. In fact, I love that the rocker of the tail matches the tip.

 

[Tom K.]

Just curious. I have Schizos on mine and played around to find my spot. I just don't get the feeling you describe in the tail. In fact, I love that the rocker of the tail matches the tip.

I'm right on the line. Where did you end up?

The tails are fine with me in high quality pow, but once things get chopped up, I miss the higher speed stability of a classic flat, or nearly flat tail. Probably just chasing my tail here..........

 

[Vinnie]

Hi Tom,

I was up on Sunday and Monday, awesome days, but missed Tuesday. Anyway, this Sunday is demo day at MHM so I highly recommend you check out what ON3P has to offer. The Billy Goat seems like the ticket for both first tracks and 15 minutes later when it's all tracked out, but it has a pin tail. Check out the Wrenegade 108 (new for next year). There are really good deals to be had on this years Wrenegade 102/112.

The Fischer Ranger 108 seems to have a flattish tail, but I haven't tried those.

 

[Ken_R]

I'm right on the line. Where did you end up?

The tails are fine with me in high quality pow, but once things get chopped up, I miss the higher speed stability of a classic flat, or nearly flat tail. Probably just chasing my tail here..........

I saw no issues with the tail on the Patron and I got on the steepest terrain at Loveland with wind blow and wind buff snow. I do like to ski more centered and upright and these skis just worked. The Moment Deathwish were similar but I felt a tad more edge grip (grabby?) and a hair softer tips and a hair longer turn radius but just as versatile. I personally do not like flat tails in advanced/expert terrain at a resort unless its smooth which is a rare thing except when it is buffed. But I can see that some might prefer a more powerful tail maybe those who ski more with a traditional or race style.

 

[Gerry Rhoades]

What? You live in Oregon and ON3P is not on your radar? I spent most of two days skiing my 184 Billy Goats in pow at Grand Targhee and I'm even more impressed by them now than I was last year at Copper Mountain. They're surprisingly agile for a 114mm ski that's built like a tank. I was getting tossed around a bit on my Soul Riders but the BGs were just unfazed by anything and when I found a big area of untracked 16" of powder they were pretty effortless. I love these skis. I think it's pretty easy to arrange a demo too, just call the factory in Portland.

 

[Tom K.]

What? You live in Oregon and ON3P is not on your radar? I spent most of two days skiing my 184 Billy Goats in pow at Grand Targhee and I'm even more impressed by them now than I was last year at Copper Mountain. They're surprisingly agile for a 114mm ski that's built like a tank. I was getting tossed around a bit on my Soul Riders but the BGs were just unfazed by anything and when I found a big area of untracked 16" of powder they were pretty effortless. I love these skis. I think it's pretty easy to arrange a demo too, just call the factory in Portland.

Thanks for the input, Gerry. I hope your shoulder is fully mended now.

I've always been very interested in Indie skis, but more than bit worried about quality control. The Billy Goat sounds interesting, but a Blister reviewer that I respect (Paul Forward) had this to say: "Last year in NZ I also skied the 13/14 186cm ON3P Billy Goat. In every category I can think of—from edge hold, to dampness, to stability at speed, to ability to break into a slide or make quick balanced jump turns—I found the Bodacious to be far superior to the Billy Goat."

What say you? Do you have a newer Billy Goat? Has it changed?

 

[Gerry Rhoades]

Mine is the 16/17 version. Everything about this ski says quality, the edges are nearly twice as thick as any other ski we stock and the PTEX is thicker. I can't comment on how it compares to the Bodacious because I've never skied. Just give them a call, I know they have demo days at Hood fairly often. And my shoulder is fine, left knee is now a problem thanks to a beginner taking me down getting off a lift at Targhee yesterday.

 

[iggyskier]

Hi Tom,

I was up on Sunday and Monday, awesome days, but missed Tuesday. Anyway, this Sunday is demo day at MHM so I highly recommend you check out what ON3P has to offer. The Billy Goat seems like the ticket for both first tracks and 15 minutes later when it's all tracked out, but it has a pin tail. Check out the Wrenegade 108 (new for next year). There are really good deals to be had on this years Wrenegade 102/112.

Scott from ON3P here. Unfortunately, we just found out that we likely won't be allowed to demo at Meadows on Sunday. As we are not sold in their retail store, we are normally only allowed to demo at their big demo days (2x per year). This year, though, I guess they are sitting on a lot of inventory so only brands they carry are being allowed to demo. This isn't that abnormal - I would guess we get turned down for demo days maybe 1/3 of the time for this reason, but as it is our home mountain, obviously a bit bummed. We will be at Hoodoo on Saturday, though. We did send out a bit of a hail mary/bribe to see if maybe we can still attend, so if we are allowed to be there on Sunday, we will be.

I think it's pretty easy to arrange a demo too, just call the factory in Portland.

Yep! Do note that our fleet is often travelling on the weekends.

I've always been very interested in Indie skis, but more than bit worried about quality control. The Billy Goat sounds interesting, but a Blister reviewer that I respect (Paul Forward) had this to say: "Last year in NZ I also skied the 13/14 186cm ON3P Billy Goat. In every category I can think of—from edge hold, to dampness, to stability at speed, to ability to break into a slide or make quick balanced jump turns—I found the Bodacious to be far superior to the Billy Goat."

What say you? Do you have a newer Billy Goat? Has it changed?

Tom - quality control is definitely a big deal with indie brands, but do note that for brands that build their own skis, as we do, you are getting a completely unique product between different brands so you need to examine ski quality on a brand by brand basis, rather than indies as a whole. Our main focus is on quality and finish and we'd be happy to show you in person. We're in the midst of around a month long remodel right now before production really ramps up, but give us a call sometime if you want a tour and to try some skis.

As for the Bodacious - the BG is a pretty difference ski from the Bodacious, even though they are often compared. As with anything, best to try and take them up sometime. Thanks!

 

[markojp]

At the OP's size, I'd look for a close out on a pre 15-16 186 Blizzard Bodacious. Yes I confess. I love this ski. Had mine out this past Monday and Tuesday, and it was right back to a mad affair after a pretty much season long absence. I was going to replace them with this season's but just couldn't feel the need. Still haven't skied anything in the big category I like better, and if it's good for me, it must be good for everyone else.

 

[Josh Matta]

Out west my Patrons lacked a ton inf choppy snow at speed. the Helldorado will not make it any better its has to much rocker

If you want a El capo but wider it really does nt exist. but these are the closest IMO


Blizzard Spur
Blizzard Bodacious (probably the best currently sold for high speed deep chop skiing)
Moment Chipotole banana

If nordica made an El Capo that was 10-15mm wider I would recommend that.

 

[James]

The new Bodacious with carbon tips and no metal is not desirable?