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New2

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http://www.saminfo.com/headline-news/9054-mountain-capital-partners-to-run-nordic-valley

If anyone can make Nordic Valley a success, I think Coleman's the guy. The comments in the Arizona/New Mexico thread have been overwhelmingly positive, and it seems like he worked real wonders at Sipapu and AZ Snowbowl. Nordic Valley's a fun mountain, but they've been hit hard by the weather in recent years. Maybe now they can get their expansion done (and hopefully done right). Good luck to them!
 

Itinerant skier

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Massive is right! What are skier visit numbers like at Pow Mow? At build out, the areas would be about 10 minutes apart, making Ogden perhaps the new Park City. Can the area really use that much capacity.
 
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New2

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It's more than 10 minutes from Nordic Valley to PowMow, but you're right that it's close enough to be drawing from the same customer population. PowMow's pretty empty, particularly looking at skiers/acre, though I've waited a few minutes in lift lines. I think an expanded Nordic Valley and PowMow could both coexist easily enough...
  • Ogden metro, Davis County, and Ogden Valley are all forecasted to continue growing rapidly. So local demand will keep rising.
  • Much of the proposed terrain at Nordic Valley is significantly steeper than what PowMow offers. This should help NV lure Ogden and Davis County skiers who want steeps but are sick of Snowbasin's crowds, and help differentiate the market.
  • The proposed North Ogden gondola base is 20 minutes from Ogden-Hinckley Airport, a no-hassle, no-crowd airport that currently has affordable nonstop service to Phoenix-Mesa Gateway (home of probably tens of thousands of PowerPass holders, though they're likely skewed a little toward the opposite ends of the valley from Gateway). And a clustering of three major resorts might be enough to spur further traffic from this airport.
  • The proposed North Ogden gondola base is also under an hour from SLC, so roughly comparable convenience from the larger airport to the Cottonwood Canyons and Park City.
  • The Utah ski business is all about mid-December through Presidents Day--locals and tourists both drop off sharply after that, and the locals who really value spring skiing are mostly in the Cottonwood Canyons anyway. So the weaker shoulder season due to Nordic Valley's lower elevation shouldn't be too big a deal. And they can benefit from plenty of expertise from Sipapu and Snowbowl on how to make snow stretch.
 

raisingarizona

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The elevation, recent warm winters with mid winter rain at Alta and Snowbird as well as climate predictions does make one gotta go hmm a little.

Coleman might just be a little crazy taking on such risks but I’ll enjoy the benefits for now.
 

tromano

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This expansion seems like a trial baloon, not a real plan.
 

Itinerant skier

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Yeah...I'm not seeing that happening. Maybe they float this and get it shot down and come back with something reasonable like a few more acres or another couple of chairs.
 

Ripper55

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Nordic is severely affected by global warming. The base area is at about 5,200'. Last year Nordic closed around March 15 because the snow had melted away. Basically it is often is too warm for snow-making at the base level. The expansion plan seems mostly pie-in-the-sky.
 
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New2

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Nordic is severely affected by global warming. The base area is at about 5,200'. Last year Nordic closed around March 15 because the snow had melted away. Basically it is often is too warm for snow-making at the base level. The expansion plan seems mostly pie-in-the-sky.

Well, the base area is completely inadequate to serve a much bigger ski area anyway, and not a lot of room to expand it. So basically it'd become the tubing parking lot, and shortcut access point for folks staying east of the Wasatch crest. And for those uses, you really only need it open during peak times, so closing mid-March is fine. Closing before President's Day, like Nordic Valley did a few years back, is more problematic, but still not make-or-break. Coleman's team brings a good amount of experience maximizing snowmaking to extend the seasons at spots like Sipapu and Arizona Snowbowl, and they're comfortable running limited springtime operations.

Not saying that it's not pie-in-the-sky either. But I think water rights and environmentalist opposition are the big barriers, not the elevation of the existing base.
 

raisingarizona

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I think New2PDX might be right on that. So lower ops close early but with a top to bottom gondola, upper mountain lifts that terminate at the top gondola station and a serious snow making system you could still have plenty of skiing into April. The convenience factor for people that live in down town Ogden is something worth mentioning too I think. It would be a lot easier to get in a couple of after work ski hours in with an access lift right out of the edge of town.

Too warm? HA! Dude, we ski in Arizona. It's totally possible to make it work as long as the snowmaking ops crew gets on it early in the season.
 
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New2

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Interestingly, the Nordic Valley website seems to be the only one of the bunch not pushing the PowerPass products. I'm guessing they're trying to avoid poking PowMow, but a comparison of pass benefits is interesting:

Unlimited Nordic $329
  • Unlimited Nordic Valley, Sipapu, Pajarito, and Hesperus
  • 3 free days at each Soldier Mountain & Cherry Peak
  • 6 transferrable 30%-off days at Coleman's resorts
Local Power Pass $359
  • Unlimited Nordic Valley, Sipapu, Pajarito, and Hesperus
  • 3 free days at each Soldier Mountain, Powder Mountain, Arizona Snowbowl, Brundage, Grand Targhee, Monarch, Snow King, Snowy Range, Sunlight, Diamond Peak, Eaglecrest, Powderhorn, Ski Cooper, and 11 areas in the Midwest and East. (Grand Targhee, Diamond Peak, and Snow King have blackouts or restrictions)
  • 6 transferrable 30%-off days at Coleman's resorts
So the only difference seems to be the 3 free days partners. For someone who wants to ski at Nordic as well as somewhere else, the extra $30 pretty much looks like a no-brainer unless you really want to ski free at Cherry Peak. I get why they wouldn't want to rub the alternative in PowMow's face, but I think they risk alienating passholders who choose to go with the Unlimited Nordic without realizing that the Local Power Pass would've given them so much more for about the same price.
 

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