• For more information on how to avoid pop-up ads and still support SkiTalk click HERE.

Noobie MA

AchtungSki

Putting on skis
Skier
Joined
Feb 27, 2019
Posts
48
Location
Midwest
Mother nature blessed south eastern Michigan with so much snow that our ski hills managed to open this weekend! The mid-November turns were a welcome surprise after last season. I had my friend take a video of me just to see where I'm at after the off-season and I was curious to see what everyone here thinks. I don't have any singular concern really, was just seeking any criticism/advice/etc anyone would be willing to provide.

About me as a skier: In my 20s, somewhat athletic, last season was my first and I had about 12 days under my belt coming into this season. I've taken 2 full day professional lessons, one in Whistler and one back at home. My first 3 days as a never-ever were at Whistler (which was simultaneously awesome and terrifying) and the rest have been here in SE MI. Despite potentially spoiling myself forever with my initial experience, I love skiing even if its 150 ft at a time. I'm a pretty improvement oriented person hence this post. I have very little skiing ego so feel free to tear my form/technique apart, I'd just ask that you give me some cues and DO's so I can get better!

Disclaimer: This might not be the greatest MA video capture ever, my friend is probably about the same experience level with me so the angles/zoom/etc. might not be the clearest from a more experienced skier's or instructor's point of view, I'm not sure. If it's too hard to tell anything useful please feel free to disregard this post.

It was filmed on a "Black Diamond" which I feel pretty comfortable on but obviously am shaking off a little bit of rust/maybe not my greatest turns of the day.


My initial thoughts are:
  1. Separation isn't very good, especially as I approach the camera
  2. A little aft/need to close ankles more
  3. I drop the hands back a bit in a few turns
  4. Perhaps rushing the transition a bit?
Thanks in advance for any feedback!
 

Chris V.

Making fresh tracks
Skier
Joined
Mar 25, 2016
Posts
1,385
Location
Truckee
Living in northern California, I never thought I'd be jealous of Michigan skiers! But here we are, dry and warm.

To begin developing the movement patterns of advanced skiers--which should certainly be your goal, right out of the gate--you need to learn a totally different way of initiating your turns. This will incorporate adopting a narrower stance, keeping lower legs parallel, starting the transition from turning one direction to the other with a RELEASE of the support of the old outside ski, then immediately starting to tip both feet down the hill to bring your skis onto the new edges. This will result in the TRANSFER of your balance onto the new outside ski, and the ENGAGEMENT of the new edges. The objective is to have the skis create the turn, as they are designed to do, as opposed to using muscular effort to wrestle the skis into a turn. RTE = Release, Transfer, Engage.

Right now you are accomplishing your turns by pushing off the hill with the old inside ski, and leading the turning action with upper body rotation.

Your thought of closing the ankles more is a good one. When you get too lazy and loose in the ankles, and let the lower legs go vertical, you lose all ability to control your movements.

There are many resources you can study to help you learn these new movement patterns, but I might get in trouble if I start talking specifics.

Enjoy your season! You're starting at the right time, and have many months ahead of you to practice, improve, and have fun.
 
Last edited:

Josh Matta

Skiing the powder
Pass Pulled
Joined
Dec 21, 2015
Posts
4,123
1. There is basically no separation. Work on this, nothing else is really possible with out it.

2.I doubt you can close your ankles more, IMO there is a for and aft equipment alignment problem, and with out tasking you and being there is honestly hard to tell.

3. your poles are useless right now, no reason to have them. For most people even holding something in their hands make them not being able to focus and leads to using their upper body.

4.who cares, you are, but its meaningless right now. There are some much bigger problems to address.

other thoughts:

get off that relativity steep hill. You say your comfortable, and sure your not falling down or being dangerous but you are at your limit and the hills gravity is helping you make some poor movements. If your were my student I would take you back to most pancake flat hill and have you practice turning your outside ski to the inside while not pushing on your outside ski. Yes we balance on our outside ski but we should not be pushing(you are pushing). I would practice the internal rotation of outside leg at home to dial in the movement prior to hitting the slopes.

also the way your ski is the way you ski, unless your a high level skier capable of switching things out of your comfort zone. IE whether you feel good or bad about your turns this is how you look all the time. You just feel better doing these movements some of the time.

as for the video, yeah it sucks. Hold the Fing phone sideways FROM The startI have blanket ban on MAing vertical videos but every first timer gets a pass. I wish the site would adopt my ban. You can always turn your phone sideways to watch, but it make the video tiny on a computer screen. Also holding the phone vertical make it much more difficult to follow skiers but your friend did an ok job.

 

Scruffy

Making fresh tracks
Skier
SkiTalk Supporter
Joined
Nov 16, 2015
Posts
2,443
Location
Upstate NY
Good advice from those two ski instructors ^^ above, but, for only 12 days under you belt, you're doing great, but of course there's much more to be done, so find a good instructor at your closest ski mountain and work with that instructor for a while as a mentor. If you can't afford private lessons ( and who can ), see if you can get into repeated group lessons with that same instructor. Some mountains have repeated group sessions with the same group, like every weekend for a number of weeks. Look into clinics or workshops, they can very often be a great deal. As Josh stated, you need to take your skiing back to greens, and then blues, but you have to know what how to work on, and how to do it correctly. Practicing bad habits over and over will reinforce bad movements. Keep going you're doing great, and with some lessons you'll be rocking it soon enough.
 

LiquidFeet

instructor
Instructor
Joined
Nov 12, 2015
Posts
6,717
Location
New England
....
About me as a skier:
In my 20s, somewhat athletic,
last season was my first...about 12 days
2 full day professional lessons,
first 3 days as a never-ever were at Whistler (which was simultaneously awesome and terrifying)
improvement oriented person
I have very little skiing ego so feel free to tear my form/technique apart....

@AchtungSki we are all passionate about skiing here, so welcome to the club! You're going to get a ton of advice in this thread. You'll encounter differences of opinion. Wading through the advice will be a chore, so get ready. Glad to hear your ego is strong. That will get you where you want to go.

I've done some screen captures to show you what you are currently doing and have accompanied that with suggestions for change. How one starts a turn is the biggest issue, but there are a couple of other things as well. Here's your current initiation.

3.  slipping downhill on pause.png

1. The end of the old turn. (a) You are leaning your whole body uphill, in order to press outward on that downhill/outside ski. Notice your shoulders are tilted "into the turn" with uphill/inside shoulder lower than the outside shoulder. Try instead to keep shoulders "level," or better yet raise that inside/uphill shoulder up high. Lift the hip below it too. Doing these two gives you "angulation." This will help your outside ski grip the snow and stop sliding downhill, which it is doing right now. It will also stop you from pressing outwards on that outside ski, and it will take some weight off the inside ski. (b) You are also facing your body in the direction your skis are pointing. It would be far far better if your hips and shoulders were facing somewhat downhill as your skis point across the hill. This is the "separation" mentioned above. Work on this. It is very important; keep your hips/shoulders/head facing downhill-ish as your skis/legs rotate across the hill. A lesson will help. Get an instructor who will work with you on upper-body/lower-body "separation."


4. shoulders lift and begin to turn downhill.png

2. The start of the new turn. (a) You are beginning to turn your shoulders to face downhill. This is the "upper body rotation" mentioned upthread. Turning the upper body ahead of the skis works; it pulls the skis around. But but but ... there's a much better way to get turns started. Instead, keep your upper body facing more downhill and your skis and legs turn across the hill. (b) You are also beginning to lengthen the uphill/new inside leg to "stand up" on your skis between turns. Even though leg extension works, this initiation strategy has some important drawbacks. It tends to morph into pushing outward on the outside ski, which indeed you are doing. Instead, you will need to learn to shorten the new inside leg and flatten that ski to release its hold on the snow. The turn will start with this movement alone. You'll probably need an instructor working with you to learn to do this. Perhaps your day one wedge turn lesson taught you to do this to start a turn; many learn to ski this way, allowing the upper body to point the same way the skis are pointing and extending the uphill leg to get the turn started. Kick those habits now and you'll be on your way to higher level skiing in no time. Repeat: these two are major movements that you need to eliminate: upper body rotation coupled with extending the uphill leg to start a turn. More below on what to do instead.


5. uphill leg lengthens, pushing shoulders upward, both of which causing a stem entry  .png

3. The top half of the new turn. You have now turned your shoulders more downhill and "stood tall" by fully lengthening that new outside (uphill) leg. Your new outside ski is tipping onto its new edge as a result and for that reason beginning to turn. Notice that your skis have formed a wedge; that's because the new outside ski's tail is moving outward. This is an inadvertent stem turn entry. It's a holdover from initial wedge turns motored by new outside leg extension. A goal you'll want to work towards is a parallel ski turn entry. How to do that? Instead of lengthening that new outside (uphill) leg, shorten the new inside (downhill) leg. This will keep you short instead of standing you up between turns. Take a lesson from an instructor willing to teach you to start your turns with a release of the new inside ski by shortening its leg and tipping its ski to flat then onto its new edge. Not all instructors will do this, as it's harder to teach than the leg extension initiation. People cling to their initiation strategies strongly here and some will argue with me on this. You get to decide which you want to do. Fun!


7.  shoulders tilt as outside leg lengthens, strengthening the push agains that outside ski.png

4. Middle of the turn. This is the apex of turn where skis point down the fall line. At this point in the turn you can probably feel yourself leaning sideways, tilting your inside shoulder downward and raising your outside shoulder, straightening and lengthening that outside half of your body from the shoulder down to the foot in order to press strongly outward on that outside ski. Weeeee! But. This is a movement pattern you'll need to replace, even though it "works," because it has an unwanted consequence - it causes your outside ski to let go of the snow. It is common, and often bundled with the upper body rotation and the extension of the new outside leg. Instead, you need to hold your upper body stable, facing more downhill, as your skis and legs rotate to point across the hill. By "upper body" I mean everything from hips up. This is the "separation" mentioned upthread and above. Work on this with an instructor; for some people separation is hard to do and it helps to have someone by your side walking you through it. That separation will allow you to easily lift the inside shoulder upward (and the hip below it) as I mentioned above, so your shoulders will be "level." Level shoulders will help your outside ski grip the snow and stop the downhill slipping you have been experiencing.


8.  skis turn, with skier leaning in and weight on the inside ski.png

5. Turn finish. Your skis are parallel in the bottom half of the turn, which is good. But your upper body is facing the direction your skis are pointing and it is leaning in (banking). Your ultimate goal will be to have upper body (hips included) facing more downhill and shoulders "level." Feeling the level shoulders can happen by lifting the inside shoulder, or by trying to keep your upper body upright instead of allowing it to tilt. Again, get an instructor to work with you on this.

6. Summary:
--Start the turn with a release: do this by shortening/flexing the new inside leg and by tipping that ski from flat to its new edge... not by lengthening/extending the new outside leg. This probably needs instruction to work well. A flexion release will help you enter the turn with parallel skis, and it discourages pushing outward on the outside ski.
--Add separation: keep upper body facing more downhill as skis and legs turn to point across the hill. This probably needs instruction to work well. Separation fine tunes your overall balance, both lateral and fore-aft. It moves the control from the upper body to the feet/legs, where it should be, which results in more precise control over the skis.
--Add angulation: lift inside shoulder and the hip below it to keep shoulders level instead of leaning in. Angulation helps the outside ski grip the snow.

You have some work to do. With your youth, passion, athleticism, and determination to improve, you can replace these problematic habits before they get deeply embedded, and move ahead into higher levels of skill soon.

Don't wait.
This is important: it takes a TON of work to replace a habit that has been reinforced during days and days of intense skiing. Fear/thrills embed habits so deep they are hard to overwrite. Take lessons soon, and be sure your instructor is giving you what you want.

Then work on embedding new habits on GREEN runs after your lessons. Working on new skills on blues and blacks, because you enjoy the thrills that speed and higher forces bring, is a recipe for defeat. Those thrills will cause the old habits will return and block the new ones from working. Delayed gratification is important at first if your early skiing has been invaded by body rotation, leaning in, and pushing laterally on that outside ski.
 
Last edited:

mdf

entering the Big Couloir
Skier
Team Gathermeister
SkiTalk Supporter
Joined
Nov 12, 2015
Posts
7,288
Location
Boston Suburbs
You can replace these problematic habits before they get deeply embedded, and move ahead into higher levels of skill. Don't wait. This is important: it takes a TON of work to replace a habit that has been reinforced

Quoted for truth.
Right now you just have to learn on a path that will lead to expert skiing.
If you wait, you will first have to un-learn the old way, and then learn the new way.
 

T-Square

Terry
Admin
Moderator
SkiTalk Supporter
Joined
Nov 12, 2015
Posts
7,593
Location
Enfield, NH
12 days. Pretty good skiing. A lot of good stuff to work with. I agree with "lowering the gravity" a bit and getting on a milder slope to practice. I recommend that to start out with you get with a good instructor (Level II or Level III) for a lesson. You are at a position where you are ready to advance and with proper instruction you will learn quickly. Your self analysis is very good. Being able to notice those things in yourself will help you improve. Based on that, you have the beginnings of a good instructor.

I also highly recommend that you go in for a boot fitting. Boots are your most important piece of equipment and you are ready for your boots to fit your skill level. A proper fit and adjustment may solve or improve some of the issues you noted.

There are a bunch of exercises you could do. Right now concentrate on engaging your edges across the hill all the way from side to side. Don’t worry about turning. Get to a point where you can make a swooping curve across the hill from side to side with both edges engaged by tipping your skis up the hill. Practice tipping your skis up and down the hill a bit at a time and watch and feel what happens.

Also practice side slipping, both directions. This will teach you how to release both edges at the same time.

Then once you have those mastered, try side slipping from one of those swoops across the hill and see what happens.

Enjoy, you’re off to a magnificent start.
 
Thread Starter
TS
A

AchtungSki

Putting on skis
Skier
Joined
Feb 27, 2019
Posts
48
Location
Midwest
Thank you to everyone who's responded, lots of great advice thus far. @LiquidFeet , that breakdown was particularly awesome and super illustrative! Your CSI enhance skills are top notch :roflmao:. Noted on the video of course, when I get a chance to take some footage again I'll make sure we do it better.

I have a few follow up questions so far:

  1. When you flex to release does that your old inside leg stays flexed the same throughout the transition while your old outside retracts, only extending the new outside leg once your skis are just about to get on their new edges? And are you just tipping the new inside or are you consciously tipping both simultaneously? What's the sensation I should be looking for?
  2. I assume that if I'm banked up hill with little separation or angulation the above doesn't work? Hence needing to lever myself up and over using my new outside leg. Is that what you were getting at by saying without separation nothing else works @Josh Matta?
  3. The pushing the outside ski sensation resonates with me. That being said towards the later part of the day some turns I was making were a bit different, more like the skis were tracking together parallel straight across the hill and I had the feeling of my skis rocking over to the other edges while continuing straight before the next turn. Is that indicative of flex to release or merely simultaneous edge change? I'm assuming that's at the least a good feeling and something to shoot for?
  4. On the boots, is this a question where I can walk into a ski shop and ask them to evaluate the fore aft alignment of my boots? Does it look like the cuffs need to be angled forward more and need to ask them for that specifically? I don't know very much about how ski boot adjustments are made or what the options are. I did get fitted for my boots in person but that was in Seattle so not super practical to go back to that store unfortunately.
I will definitely try to find an instructor though. I think I'll have to pony up for some private lessons as in my admittedly limited experience with one hill it seemed like instruction was heavily biased towards never-evers or racing specific.
 

mister moose

Instigator
Skier
Joined
May 30, 2017
Posts
667
Location
Killington
I will definitely try to find an instructor though. I think I'll have to pony up for some private lessons as in my admittedly limited experience with one hill it seemed like instruction was heavily biased towards never-evers or racing specific.
Private instruction is good in that it is focused and intensive. Also important is frequency. While your list of questions is good, your brain can ask more than your body is willing to deliver all at once. Ideally you need many days on snow with some frequent coaching. Is there a local hill within an hour drive? Do they offer a weekly program? Can you do night skiing? Look into what options are available.
 

Scruffy

Making fresh tracks
Skier
SkiTalk Supporter
Joined
Nov 16, 2015
Posts
2,443
Location
Upstate NY
I will definitely try to find an instructor though. I think I'll have to pony up for some private lessons as in my admittedly limited experience with one hill it seemed like instruction was heavily biased towards never-evers or racing specific.

Once you get some basic carving skills, look into what called "Beer League Racing". Usually held at night if they have night skiing and it's just a group of amature people attempting to race like the pros. They're usually a fun loving group that welcomes newcomers and helps them with skiing and racing tips. Racing will make you a better skier, even if you don't care about ski racing.
 
Thread Starter
TS
A

AchtungSki

Putting on skis
Skier
Joined
Feb 27, 2019
Posts
48
Location
Midwest
Is there a local hill within an hour drive? Do they offer a weekly program? Can you do night skiing? Look into what options are available.

I've got about 4 in that range actually. I believe most of them have some sort of ski school and night skiing is available at all of them. I think the issue with frequency is more financial than access.

Once you get some basic carving skills, look into what called "Beer League Racing". Usually held at night if they have night skiing and it's just a group of amature people attempting to race like the pros. They're usually a fun loving group that welcomes newcomers and helps them with skiing and racing tips. Racing will make you a better skier, even if you don't care about ski racing.

I've seen advertisements for those around the resorts so I know they're out there, I'll have to give them a look.
 

T-Square

Terry
Admin
Moderator
SkiTalk Supporter
Joined
Nov 12, 2015
Posts
7,593
Location
Enfield, NH
Don’t second guess your boot fitter by trying to guess what needs to be done with your boots. Boot fitting is both a science and an art. A good boot fitter knows the science. A great boot fitter understands the science and the art to make the boot perform at its best for you.

Find a good fitter locally. Someone you trust. Ask some Level II or III instructors or serious racers what boot fitter(s) they use. Walk in and ask him/her to evaluate your boot fit and set them up for you. Also, if you don’t have them, ask about some custom foot beds. They make one heck of a difference in you ability to control your skis. Since you did not buy the boots from them expect to pay for the setup.

If you buy new boots and foot beds from a boot fitter the fitting is part of the cost.
 

Henry

Out on the slopes
Skier
Joined
Sep 7, 2019
Posts
1,242
Location
Traveling in the great Northwest
Liquidfeet has a great description. Here are a few things that relate:

You need to do things that are counter intuitive. They will seem really odd, maybe scary. The problem is that what you're now doing is limiting. You'll never get better.

What should be (need to be) the first body parts down the hill? Your head & shoulders. Try this...stand sideways on the hill, your skis across the fall line. Look at the angle your skis make to the snow. Lean your uphill shoulder toward the hill as LF says you're doing. Your skis flatten on the snow. Now lean your head & shoulders down the hill. Your skis make more of an angle to the snow. That's more than good. That's essential to progress.

You know where your parka zipper pull is. Where should it be in relation to your skis? Do this--position your zipper pull over the ski brand name on the front of the outside ski in the turn. Even better, position the zipper pull about over that brand name at the very beginning of the new turn. For a, say, left turn, you want to start with your zipper pull over the name on your right ski. (I know, if one actually got their zipper over the ski label that would be way too far. But...few of us actually move as far as we think we do. Check your own videos. When one thinks their zipper pull is over the label is really not that far, but it's moving in the right direction for both angulation and counter.)

Challenge yourself on either technique or terrain. Not both. You can get better at one or the other, but not both at the same time. That run is too steep for you to improve your technique. Improve your technique first, then gradually increase the terrain difficulty while maintaining the good technique.

Hand position can rarely do much good but can do a lot wrong. The correct position for your hands is the natural balancing position you body puts them in. Imagine yourself walking across the slickest sheet of ice. Your hands automatically move a bit up & a bit out in a natural balancing position. That's where you want them for skiing. Add in the slope of the hill, and you want the inside hand & shoulder high & forward. You want the outside hand & shoulder back & low. This is what LF and others are telling you.

Feet--the only reason to have your feet so far apart is if you're sloppy in your boots. If that's the case, fix that. You want your feet walking width apart where your body has been balancing yourself since you were a year or two old. You do not want one foot ahead of the other. We talk about balancing in the center of the skis. If you push one ahead, then whatever weight you put on that ski is on the tail which is a no-no. We want most of our weight on the outside foot from the very beginning of the turn through the very end. This is done by lightening the inside foot, not pressuring the outside foot. It does make a difference. The wider the feet are apart, the more difficult that is.

Don't think about opening or closing the ankles. Think about where the center of the skis are in relation to your body's center of mass. The CoM is somewhere in your trunk. For me that means that I'm skiing on the balls of my feet. If I'm on my heels, I'm back, so I strongly pull both feet back to get centered. I hinge from the ankles. I start my turn way forward and end the turn centered. Others have their own way. In any case, get your center of mass over the sweet spot of the skis a bit forward of the toe bindings. We can get a little bit forward by contracting the weak ankle flexor muscles. We can get farther forward and quicker using the strong hamstring muscles in the backs of the legs pulling the feet back.

Get on an easier run. Try one new thing at a time. When that is working well for you, add one more new thing. This isn't quick nor easy except for those born with extraordinary innate athleticism. That ain't me.
 

Josh Matta

Skiing the powder
Pass Pulled
Joined
Dec 21, 2015
Posts
4,123
  1. I assume that if I'm banked up hill with little separation or angulation the above doesn't work? Hence needing to lever myself up and over using my new outside leg. Is that what you were getting at by saying without separation nothing else works @Josh Matta?

So yes you are banking, but its not the separation I am talking about. Your legs should turn more than hips, and your legs should turn before your hips. Right now your hips(+upper body) twist into the turn and you look into the turn, instead of just your legs from the femurs down twisting into the turn
At the level you are currently at, tipping moves, and balance moves are second to being able to get your legs to twist separately of your hips. The fact that not one other person mentioned it is sad.

@Henry mentioned it, but there are issue with parka zipper idea, 99 percent of people when asked to do this with out knowing the proper movements will twist their hips from the spine while their shoulders face down the hill, instead of twisting your legs while your hips face down the hill. If you want to think of zipper think of the one on your pants, not the one on your jacket.

The deal with the angulation you speak of, ideal angulation means specifically legs tips more than hips, can only happen once their is rotational separation. IE the legs turning more than the body

ID stop reading about or trying flex to release, its not that it is not useful, but right now it will do more harm than good since your legs are still moving as one with your body.

your post indicates to me that you like to feel things this can be an issue sometimes as searching for what feels right, can lead down paths of wrong with out knowing what right is. I would learn this movement


and feel how to replicate on the snow. Focus on just turning the outside ski first, the inside ski will fall into place if you do nothing extra.
 

Josh Matta

Skiing the powder
Pass Pulled
Joined
Dec 21, 2015
Posts
4,123
the problem with all of those @François Pugh is you cna twist your hips and still accomplish them....the majority of people will twist their hips.

I know people would rather instructions be less technical. but as someone who does it a ton, jsut telling people the correct movements and having them feel it is way more effective than many drill. In fact i am hesitant to tell many drills online because of how many can be messed up. I generally only talk about the ones that are basically uncheatable.
 

LiquidFeet

instructor
Instructor
Joined
Nov 12, 2015
Posts
6,717
Location
New England
@AchtungSki you posted these questions upthread. My responses are in red. The numbers got messed up so just ignore them.

  1. When you flex to release does that your old inside leg stays flexed the same throughout the transition while your old outside retracts, only extending the new outside leg once your skis are just about to get on their new edges? Yes, exactly Do not attempt to "pressure" or press on the new outside ski. Many people get this message when instructors talk about pressure, but it's a misunderstanding. Pay attention to shortening the new inside leg; as you shorten it, tip the ski to flat and continue to tip it onto its new downhill edge in one smooth movement; ignore the new outside leg becaue it will do its thing on its own. Pressure will arrive under that outside ski when it needs to. And are you just tipping the new inside or are you consciously tipping both simultaneously? If you were in a lesson with me, I'd have you focus exclusively on doing things with the new inside foot/ski and leg. We'd go through a number of runs simply focusing on that ski/foot/leg, with some enhancements or drills on the side that haven't been mentioned to help you do it without extending/lengthening that new outside leg. What's the sensation I should be looking for? You want your skis to turn. That's an external focus, not a body sensation. An external focus is hard to misinterpret, so that's good. Turning skis is the result you are looking for. For a sensation, you can focus on NOT feeling the new outside leg lengthening to press outward on its ski. Then again, one focus at a time is best. Focus on the new Inside Ski (NIS) - and NIS leg and NIS foot - for the win.
  1. I assume that if I'm banked up hill with little separation or angulation the above doesn't work? Flexing and tipping that ski/foot/leg will work better at starting a turn if you turned your skis/legs more than your upper body in the previous turn, and if you are not banked but holding your torso upright. You can even lean your head over the outside/downhill ski. It makes everything works better if your skis and knees are pointing to the trees at the end of the turn, while your pelvis/hips and shoulders are pointing more downhill, and if your upper body/torso is more upright instead of leaning in. Pay attention to the video above that Josh posted with two people in boots trying to do this movement in the shop with no skis on. You can work on doing this movement at home in front of a mirror, keeping your upper body (pelvis and above) facing more towards the mirror as you point your toes to the side. Josh is pointing out that this movement needs to be learned first in the progression of changing the way you currently ski. I won't argue with that. But if you are leaning back, that's going to complicate things too. Seek out an instructor after trying this stuff on your own. Hence needing to lever myself up and over using my new outside leg. Is that what you were getting at by saying without separation nothing else works @Josh Matta?
  1. The pushing the outside ski sensation resonates with me. That being said towards the later part of the day some turns I was making were a bit different, more like the skis were tracking together parallel straight across the hill and I had the feeling of my skis rocking over to the other edges while continuing straight before the next turn. Is that indicative of flex to release or merely simultaneous edge change? Sounds like simultaneous edge change. I'm assuming that's at the least a good feeling and something to shoot for? If you focus alone on the new inside ski tipping along with flexing that leg, the new outside ski will tip on its own. Given your current habit of lengthening that new outside leg to start a turn, I'd be hesitant to encourage you to do anything with that leg/foot/ski intentionally, because of the likelihood that the current habit of extending that leg would return and overpower the new movement pattern you're trying to build. But since you asked, heading across the slope and tipping both feet/skis to their downhill edgs, without pivoting them at all, can initiate a carved turn. Having you focus on making carved turns that way is premature. But it's in your future.
  1. On the boots, is this a question where I can walk into a ski shop and ask them to evaluate the fore aft alignment of my boots? Yes. That part is free. Take your skis with you, as the way your boots interface with the bindings counts. Does it look like the cuffs need to be angled forward more and need to ask them for that specifically? A GOOD bootfitter (not a shop attendant tasked with selling boots) will be able to evaluate this, but not us on the internet. I don't know very much about how ski boot adjustments are made or what the options are. I did get fitted for my boots in person but that was in Seattle so not super practical to go back to that store unfortunately. Good. In addition, as mentioned above, a custom-made footbed will probably help you control your skis with more precision so that's worth thinking about. Well-fitted boots that fit snugly in all three dimensions are essential for controlling your skis. A boot needs to fit length-wise, width-wise, and volume-wise (ceiling height over forefoot). You might want to know that sometimes skiers go through several boots (and bootfitters) before they get this issue dialed.
I will definitely try to find an instructor though. I think I'll have to pony up for some private lessons. I think the issue with frequency is more financial than access. If you go on a non-holiday weekday and purchase a group lesson, you might get a private lesson since no one else will be there. You are the perfect student for a technically-minded ski instructor who enjoys teaching adult learners.
 
Last edited:

dbostedo

Asst. Gathermeister
Moderator
Contributor
SkiTalk Supporter
Joined
Feb 9, 2016
Posts
18,306
Location
75% Virginia, 25% Colorado
^^^
The red is non-italics stuff, right? I have trouble seeing thin red text... though bold makes the color obvious.
 

Long Hair Hippy

Getting on the lift
Skier
Joined
Sep 22, 2016
Posts
101
Dude…nice job for the limited time you have on the snow!

Sounds like you are forever hooked!

I’m not an instructor and offer no advice in terms ski instruction but as a “forever student of the sport” I can offer some insight for you.

I’m very familiar with the area you were skiing in the video. I agree with others, the hill you were on is probably a bit too steep. Becoming a better skier often requires doing a series of boring drills and skiing on flat terrain rather than just doing reps up and down the hill. Be patient, once you master skills on the flat stuff, it will transition over to the steeper stuff. Next time you are there go to the #1 lift area and work on the terrain along the fence. It’s longer and mellower.

I know lessons and lift tickets aren’t cheap! Here are a couple of tips to save you some dough or at least maximize your time there!

If you can financially swing it, sign up on-line for a full or half day group lesson during the week. I’m betting you will pretty much get a private as they’re usually not too busy mid-week.. They are advertising a full day mid-week group lesson (10am-3pm) for $79.00 w/ an add on $20.00 lift ticket. Make sure you are clear about your goals with the instructor. It will be money well spent.

Another tip…

Once the season gets into full swing, the ski patrol and the race programs train on Sunday mornings. Follow them around for a-while or watch them from a lift and study their movement patterns. Watch some of the drills they are doing. Obviously the drills are better accompanied with full instruction and in proper context , but if you are on a budget…..it never hurts to poach out a few pointers.

Good luck!
 

Sponsor

Staff online

Top