mostly wine stuff

[pete]

So, anyone try the WSJ wine club. I decided to give it a try due to low first case price and heck, who can say no to "Double-Gold French Pinot Noir", "94-Point Southern Italian Rarity", "Superstar California Cabernet" ...

Figure I'm not a high end wine drinker so thought why not as I'd guess they'd be least as good was I typically drink and branch out to vineyards unknown to me.

 

[skibob]

So, anyone try the WSJ wine club. I decided to give it a try due to low first case price and heck, who can say no to "Double-Gold French Pinot Noir", "94-Point Southern Italian Rarity", "Superstar California Cabernet" ...

Figure I'm not a high end wine drinker so thought why not as I'd guess they'd be least as good was I typically drink and branch out to vineyards unknown to me.

Years ago it had a stellar reputation. I have no idea how it is now.

 

[LKLA]

I don't want to spoil the party but we subscribed to it maybe 8-10 years ago and it was pretty bad. I think the worse part was the hoops we had to go through to cancel it. Anyhow, hope things have changed and that they are offering better wines. If it is still around perhaps that means that they are offering decent wines.

 

[SShore]

I will start by admitting that I am a skeptic. That being said, I have looked into a lot of these on line wine clubs and the thing that gets me is I have NEVER seen a single one of these labels in a store. And I shop for wine a lot. So the only conclusion I can draw is they are labels that are created specifically for these types of sales from bulk wine that is purchased around the world. What really raised my antenna on the WSJ one (at least what they had available in MT) is that of the reds, 27 were from California and only 4 from France. That in and of itself would keep me away. And the 4 from France were from the regions famous for making copious amounts of plonk.

 

[skibob]

I will start by admitting that I am a skeptic. That being said, I have looked into a lot of these on line wine clubs and the thing that gets me is I have NEVER seen a single one of these labels in a store. And I shop for wine a lot. So the only conclusion I can draw is they are labels that are created specifically for these types of sales from bulk wine that is purchased around the world. What really raised my antenna on the WSJ one (at least what they had available in MT) is that of the reds, 27 were from California and only 4 from France. That in and of itself would keep me away. And the 4 from France were from the regions famous for making copious amounts of plonk.

And from CA in particular, you can expect it to be a private label. There are only a handful of companies turning these out. They aren't bad per se. They just aren't particularly careful to maintain a reputation, as the label will be different next time anyway.

Your analysis is spot on. Most wine clubs that don't originate from the winery are using private label bulk wine. WSJ used to be different. I know that for sure. But I don't know when it changed. Before or after Murdoch took over.

As a winemaker, I've only ever considered joining two wine clubs. Navarro Vineyards (Anderson Valley) and Cardwell Hill Cellars (Willamette Valley Pinot). I don't get any money from recommending/have no ownership in either.

 

[Mendieta]

Your analysis is spot on. Most wine clubs that don't originate from the winery are using private label bulk wine. WSJ used to be different. I know that for sure. But I don't know when it changed. Before or after Murdoch took over.

Yes, the one thing that is popular in Cali is for wineries to have their own wine subscription, so you get discounts when you shop at their tasting rooms, etc. Also, a local retailer close to my home has a very neat wine club. They have connections to North Cal wineries and they are lovely people, zero snobbery, so the club give people a reason to stop by an socialize.

I wouldn't be surprised if the WSJ was good. That's a reputable publication and I don't think they would do something crappy. Overall, I think being in a wine club can be fun in that it will "force" you to try different things. But I am a bit of a wine geek so i produce my own "club". I like stopping at a winery, trying things, etc. Sometimes you'll find a wine at 25% of the retail value, already (and properly) aged (sometimes 10y or so). I love those deals!

 

[SShore]

I like stopping at a winery, trying things, etc. Sometimes you'll find a wine at 25% of the retail value, already (and properly) aged (sometimes 10y or so). I love those deals!

When my wife and I lived in NoCal many many years ago, we would go to Napa, (before it became wine Disneyland) or Sonoma for weekend jaunts. I remember stopping by Joseph Phelps once and they had a closeout on the first Syrah they ever made. I think they were selling it for $35 a case or something ridiculous like that. We bought a case and it was so good we went back the next weekend and bought two more. The wine was elegant, refined and very well balances. I don't think you can find deals like that anymore, and from what I have tasted at some high end Cali wine tastings, I don't think you can find wines like that from California anymore.

 

[skibob]

When my wife and I lived in NoCal many many years ago, we would go to Napa, (before it became wine Disneyland) or Sonoma for weekend jaunts. I remember stopping by Joseph Phelps once and they had a closeout on the first Syrah they ever made. I think they were selling it for $35 a case or something ridiculous like that. We bought a case and it was so good we went back the next weekend and bought two more. The wine was elegant, refined and very well balances. I don't think you can find deals like that anymore, and from what I have tasted at some high end Cali wine tastings, I don't think you can find wines like that from California anymore.

It gets harder every year to find wines like that.

 

[Mendieta]

When my wife and I lived in NoCal many many years ago, we would go to Napa, (before it became wine Disneyland) or Sonoma for weekend jaunts. I remember stopping by Joseph Phelps once and they had a closeout on the first Syrah they ever made. I think they were selling it for $35 a case or something ridiculous like that. We bought a case and it was so good we went back the next weekend and bought two more. The wine was elegant, refined and very well balances. I don't think you can find deals like that anymore, and from what I have tasted at some high end Cali wine tastings, I don't think you can find wines like that from California anymore.

You got this mostly spot on. But I didn't say where You are absolutely right, it seems like Napa particularly has become a wine-as-a-tourist thing where you go and you buy an ok wine for 50 bucks. And there is a lot of snobbery. These things, I really don't care for. Actually, in my trip to Napa this summer I mostly had (really good) beers.

I like to go to wineries off the beaten path: Central Coast, Mendocino, urban producers in Oakland/Alameda, etc.

 

[cantunamunch]

I like to go to wineries off the beaten path: Central Coast, Mendocino, urban producers in Oakland/Alameda, etc.

....Oregon

 

[skibob]

....Oregon

Second best place in the world for Pinot Noir.

 

[cantunamunch]

Second best place in the world for Pinot Noir.

Herself is open to Pinot Noir, so long as it's in a Blanc de Noir

 

[skibob]

You got this mostly spot on. But I didn't say where You are absolutely right, it seems like Napa particularly has become a wine-as-a-tourist thing where you go and you buy an ok wine for 50 bucks. And there is a lot of snobbery. These things, I really don't care for. Actually, in my trip to Napa this summer I mostly had (really good) beers.

I like to go to wineries off the beaten path: Central Coast, Mendocino, urban producers in Oakland/Alameda, etc.

If you go to anderson valley, you've really got to go to Navarro. Greenwood Ridge and Handley also worth a visit.

I may have mentioned Waxwing Wines in Belmont too. Owner/winemaker was first winemaker my wife worked under. Good guy, good winemaker.

 

[mdf]

Here in Massachusetts the wine stores have been allowed to do free in-store tastings for the last 5 or 10 years. Our local store tastes ~6 wines every Saturday. It's usually a store employee pouring and talking, but sometimes a wine distributor or even a visitor from a winery will be pouring. A few times a year they have a "Grand Tasting" where they have about 10 tables with 6-8 wines per table, with the distributors running the tables. I would say about 1/4 of the wines are actually quite good. If you include the ones that are admirable examples of styles I don't care for, it might be as much as half. Several other stores do the same thing, although on a smaller scale.

Anyway, my point is that we have so much fun buying wine retail that I don't want to be locked into getting it shipped to me.

Also, I am pretty sure I can often buy wine cheaper retail than at the winery. Which means you ought to stick to the quirky or limited-release stuff they don't distribute nationally. Or to small wineries without much distribution at all.

 

[cantunamunch]

Here in Massachusetts the wine stores have been allowed to do free in-store tastings for the last 5 or 10 years. Our local store tastes ~6 wines every Saturday. It's usually a store employee pouring and talking, but sometimes a wine distributor or even a visitor from a winery will be pouring. A few times a year they have a "Grand Tasting" where they have about 10 tables with 6-8 wines per table, with the distributors running the tables. I would say about 1/4 of the wines are actually quite good. If you include the ones that are admirable examples of styles I don't care for, it might be as much as half. Several other stores do the same thing, although on a smaller scale.

Anyway, my point is that we have so much fun buying wine retail that I don't want to be locked into getting it shipped to me.

Also, I am pretty sure I can often buy wine cheaper retail than at the winery. Which means you ought to stick to the quirky or limited-release stuff they don't distribute nationally. Or to small wineries without much distribution at all.

Yep, pretty much in the same boat. DC has had this since forever. Wine clubs market in this area incessantly and I wind up being the bad guy by saying 'We can get better for cheaper AND we can prove it by trying it'.


Unfortunately free tastings don't solve herself's problem.

The only way to know which wine she's reacting to is to *only* drink one, and have three glasses of it. So, since she doesn't want to walk out of the shop with a tinnitus migraine,she avoids the Pinot and Cab pours.

 

[Jilly]

Sh*t is that where my tinnitus is coming from? I thought is was loud music!!

I belong to a Canadian wine buying club - The Opimian Society. We buy stuff you can't get in the LCBO or other provincial stores. But I have 30 wineries in a 1/2 drive, so don't usually go for long without wine. Pinot Noir from Long Dog Winery in PEC is really good.

 

[cantunamunch]

Sh*t is that where my tinnitus is coming from? I thought is was loud music!!.

She calls the symptoms 'squishy ears' - ear pressure to where she can almost hear tones, dizziness, headache, inability to focus, facial flush (by that point she's ready for a lie-down). She'll know by the end of the second glass, normally. It's not from alcohol content and it's not from tannins - I've lost count of the number of ciders she's had a bad reaction to.

 

[Tony S]

Re: "Wine Clubs": Another skeptic here, to put it charitably.

Do you want to learn about wine and along the way develop a palate and figure out what you like and how to make an educated guess about which bottles are likely to satisfy and intrigue? If so, a local club - a real club - of enthusiasts who hold non-profit tastings can be great - especially if there are some truly knowledgeable people at its core.

With proper wine you can't step in the same river twice. That's one of the things that makes it real and good and interesting, rooted as it is in nature. It's not a commodity that you can just make more of. What comes from one vineyard in one year made by one person can't be reproduced. Even when you drink another bottle of the same wine a year later it's not the same wine anymore.

Meanwhile anyone trying to make a living selling you wine from a selection of six or twelve or twenty-four or a hundred and forty-four bottles needs you to come back for repeat purchases. Therefore it's in that vendor's interest to offer wines that are very consistent and unexceptionable, in the very middle slice of the bell curve of taste preference. In short, it's in his interest to offer boring wine. ... Or if not boring, at least missing the contrasting companion bottles that might captivate fewer tasters but which are essential for understanding the continuum of high level styles and tastes.

My advice: Learn the regions and producers that produce wine you tend to like, and follow your instincts from there. By that time you will surely have some, and they will be yours. That feels good in this day and age where it's so easy to Google what's "best." Find the local mavens, and calibrate your tastes against theirs. Then they will be able to make great suggestions for you.

 

[skibob]

She calls the symptoms 'squishy ears' - ear pressure to where she can almost hear tones, dizziness, headache, inability to focus, facial flush (by that point she's ready for a lie-down). She'll know by the end of the second glass, normally. It's not from alcohol content and it's not from tannins - I've lost count of the number of ciders she's had a bad reaction to.

Histamine. You mentioned she likes sparkling? The less ripe grapes are, the less histamine produced during fermentation. Sparkling wine grapes are the least ripe when picked other than a few oddities.

 

[cantunamunch]

Histamine. .

Yeh, you mentioned amine reaction up thread, it's our (only) working theory just now.