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Mogul Stoke with Marcus Caston and Jonny Moseley - Return of the Turn Pt 1
- Thread starter Tricia
- Start date
I love this video. Here's to a rebirth of moguls!
To Ski Resort Management: If you leave some moderate trails ungroomed--so moguls can form--you're providing prime terrain improving skiers are seeking. Don't wipe out those moderate gateway challenges.
To Ski Resort Management: If you leave some moderate trails ungroomed--so moguls can form--you're providing prime terrain improving skiers are seeking. Don't wipe out those moderate gateway challenges.
Ok @Philpug I'll bite... who is the guy Marcus approaches at the beginning of the video?
I was aghast at Jonny's comment though saying he couldn't give somebody a good reason to ski moguls. What? Does powder get better after more people have skied it? No. Do groomers get powder after more people have skied it? No. But bumps... they just get bigger, the lines get more fun, it just gets to
(Ok, I might be a bump skiing addict...)
I was aghast at Jonny's comment though saying he couldn't give somebody a good reason to ski moguls. What? Does powder get better after more people have skied it? No. Do groomers get powder after more people have skied it? No. But bumps... they just get bigger, the lines get more fun, it just gets to
(Ok, I might be a bump skiing addict...)
It is a friend of ours, John Lyons.Ok @Philpug I'll bite... who is the guy Marcus approaches at the beginning of the video?
I was aghast at Jonny's comment though saying he couldn't give somebody a good reason to ski moguls. What? Does powder get better after more people have skied it? No. Do groomers get powder after more people have skied it? No. But bumps... they just get bigger, the lines get more fun, it just gets to
(Ok, I might be a bump skiing addict...)
I do like Marcus's unique way of skiing bumps.
I remind people of this all the time. Marcus was an exceptional ski racer, one of the top ranked in his age group in the country. He was not far away from the USST system. He grew up in SLC, and his "home hill" was Snowbird. He was never one of these kids who just "trained gates" on some rock hard small hill.
So the "fusion" of his skiing is a deep love of skiing, experience beginning when he could walk at skiing every inch of Snowbird and Alta, and rock solid technique developed as an elite racer. Combine it with his love of life, his desire to express himself through his skiing, his ability to throw down in ANYTHING, and his skiing is just so much fun to watch.
Marcus is a very hot ski commodity.
Interesting that one of the kids in the film clip is a racer who Marcus started coaching summers at Mt. Hood a number of years ago.
Marcus is a "skier", and he believes in developing kids to become the same. Become skilled, and just LOVE it.
I hope that Return of the Turn becomes a huge hit!
So the "fusion" of his skiing is a deep love of skiing, experience beginning when he could walk at skiing every inch of Snowbird and Alta, and rock solid technique developed as an elite racer. Combine it with his love of life, his desire to express himself through his skiing, his ability to throw down in ANYTHING, and his skiing is just so much fun to watch.
Marcus is a very hot ski commodity.
Interesting that one of the kids in the film clip is a racer who Marcus started coaching summers at Mt. Hood a number of years ago.
Marcus is a "skier", and he believes in developing kids to become the same. Become skilled, and just LOVE it.
I hope that Return of the Turn becomes a huge hit!
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Another conversation ongoing about this video over here: https://forum.pugski.com/threads/te...s-post-your-favorites.6351/page-3#post-153310
I'd prefer to see most people lose "racers" and "bump skiers", "park skiers" and think about well rounded "skiers."
Note what his choice of skis for bumps are. And that he normally skis everything in a Tecnica 9.3 Doberman. Often filmed in other Tecnica boots, as it's his job.
I've seen video of him shredding a GS course on long fat skis. Watch some powder video. Not a lot of these guys carve their turns like that in deep pow. He's kind of like Chris Davenport, who was a hell of a ski racer.
Come to think of it, that Rahlves kid can do it all, too! Wow. And Svindal, and Hirscher.......
Skiers. Think that should be the goal for all.
Note what his choice of skis for bumps are. And that he normally skis everything in a Tecnica 9.3 Doberman. Often filmed in other Tecnica boots, as it's his job.
I've seen video of him shredding a GS course on long fat skis. Watch some powder video. Not a lot of these guys carve their turns like that in deep pow. He's kind of like Chris Davenport, who was a hell of a ski racer.
Come to think of it, that Rahlves kid can do it all, too! Wow. And Svindal, and Hirscher.......
Skiers. Think that should be the goal for all.
Great video thanks!
So I guess we have our answer to the eternal question of "can racers ski bumps"?
I've also seen a USSA Men's U18 Moguls Champion beat some pretty hot racers on a GS course.. One of the racers was skiing the pro tour at the time..
I've followed Henri Duvillard skiing bumps. He rips. Our coach beat him in a pro race. Our coach was a racer. He ripped bumps, too. Matter of fact, most of the race kids could ski bumps well. It made everyone better skiers.
Thanks Tricia, what a fun video. Enjoyed the hilarious rejection script asking "Do you want to ski some bumps?"... Ahh get away from me freak!
Those huge steep Chute 75 moguls scare me even more than those on West Face. Such bumps usually have me slow and defensive not willing to commit to fall lines unless I'm on top of my game easing in to such terrain on previous runs. Though such afternoon spring slush bumps are more slow and forgiving.
Those huge steep Chute 75 moguls scare me even more than those on West Face. Such bumps usually have me slow and defensive not willing to commit to fall lines unless I'm on top of my game easing in to such terrain on previous runs. Though such afternoon spring slush bumps are more slow and forgiving.
Mosley makes it look easy. Caston makes it look like perilous fun with his skis in the air as much as on the snow, tips up and out all over the place hahaha..
Truer words have never been spoken....you might even sell some lessons to someone above Novice once in a while!
Unfortunately the mindset of those in control of resort grooming in the vast majority of our western ski areas for many years has been to eliminate moguls everywhere they are able to drive grooming machines except on steeps only fit for experts. Their excuse has been that there were decreasing numbers of mogul skiers so the public wanted more groomed slopes. But that was just a lame disguise for their real reason. The below had been thoroughly discussed on web boards mogul skiers used and I'll use this thread as an excuse to bring such up again. And note this is about moguls in The West and not the East where such has always been popular.
Of course there was always a schism since the 60s between freestyle enthusiasts that have never had any resort power and SOME racing enthusiasts that were from earliest eras entrenched in ski area managements and rightly so. Unlike ski racing that skiers at any level can thrive at, skiing moguls just enough to cope is one of the most difficult athletic challenges of any sport. Accordingly there have been large numbers of accomplished racers and other career ski resort skiers that never ever were able to ski bumps adequately. Many that had the raw athletic abilities never really tried, content to isolate themselves from gnarly parts of mountains and culture, and simply relate they disliked bumps so avoid them. But years of watching others ski moguls well obviously has tended to grate against the psyche of SOME of those advanced skiers that has been aggravated for decades by some individual's chest pounding and skiing media. In any case from the earliest days there have always been some racing enthusiasts and resort career people that absolutely enjoyed moguls without any issues. In fact many of our best mogul skiers have racing backgrounds.
When shaped skis, all mountain enthusiasts, and snowboarders began to dominate advanced skiing interests, SOME of those in management began to groom away lower gradient mogul slopes more and more that was an understandable balance. Some apparently noticed there were not many complaints given the all mountain shift. I will speculate that some in managements figured out if they eliminated the lower gradient mogul slopes that over years there would be even fewer skiers in bumps especially younger skiers. At first just a few resorts did so and as they did bump skiers would complain just at those resorts. Usually what they did given resort choices was to stop visiting such resorts and do their skiing elsewhere. Gradually over years that distilled places that did not groom lower gradient bumps to a few resorts like Maryjane at WP. All the while the numbers of competent mogul skiers has decreased dramatically without new blood.
If resort managements that control their grooming crews were reasonable, they would allow at least some lower gradient slopes to mogul up naturally. And not just at some obscure slope out of sight, out of mind because such slopes will never have enough skier traffic to create good moguls. Nor at the lower gradient runouts below steep mogul slopes, Good moguls especially as snow conditions become firmer, requires regular traffic by mogul skiers to keep loose snow about and the only places that usually occurs is within sight of chairlifts especially below.
Of course there was always a schism since the 60s between freestyle enthusiasts that have never had any resort power and SOME racing enthusiasts that were from earliest eras entrenched in ski area managements and rightly so. Unlike ski racing that skiers at any level can thrive at, skiing moguls just enough to cope is one of the most difficult athletic challenges of any sport. Accordingly there have been large numbers of accomplished racers and other career ski resort skiers that never ever were able to ski bumps adequately. Many that had the raw athletic abilities never really tried, content to isolate themselves from gnarly parts of mountains and culture, and simply relate they disliked bumps so avoid them. But years of watching others ski moguls well obviously has tended to grate against the psyche of SOME of those advanced skiers that has been aggravated for decades by some individual's chest pounding and skiing media. In any case from the earliest days there have always been some racing enthusiasts and resort career people that absolutely enjoyed moguls without any issues. In fact many of our best mogul skiers have racing backgrounds.
When shaped skis, all mountain enthusiasts, and snowboarders began to dominate advanced skiing interests, SOME of those in management began to groom away lower gradient mogul slopes more and more that was an understandable balance. Some apparently noticed there were not many complaints given the all mountain shift. I will speculate that some in managements figured out if they eliminated the lower gradient mogul slopes that over years there would be even fewer skiers in bumps especially younger skiers. At first just a few resorts did so and as they did bump skiers would complain just at those resorts. Usually what they did given resort choices was to stop visiting such resorts and do their skiing elsewhere. Gradually over years that distilled places that did not groom lower gradient bumps to a few resorts like Maryjane at WP. All the while the numbers of competent mogul skiers has decreased dramatically without new blood.
If resort managements that control their grooming crews were reasonable, they would allow at least some lower gradient slopes to mogul up naturally. And not just at some obscure slope out of sight, out of mind because such slopes will never have enough skier traffic to create good moguls. Nor at the lower gradient runouts below steep mogul slopes, Good moguls especially as snow conditions become firmer, requires regular traffic by mogul skiers to keep loose snow about and the only places that usually occurs is within sight of chairlifts especially below.
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Regarding leaving some moderate trails ungroomed... One of the things I like about Stowe is that they do exactly this -- there are a number of trails that are left to bump up. Varying trail width, varying trail lengths, varying steepness, varying fall-lines, varying snowcover (natural vs. snow guns), etc. Some get groomed out weekly or so (so the moguls never get very big), some get groomed out more rarely, and some have never seen a groomer.
The Front Four get all the marketing fame and they're usually just a sea of big moguls, and they're the ones you see from the lift, but there are other great bump runs all over the mountain.
Stowe does get the snowfall to keep their bump runs from turning into a teeth-rattling ice cubes (usually...) Other areas aren't so lucky; I'd like to think there would be more New England bump runs if there was more consistent snowfall / snow quality. Skiing icy bumps is an acquired taste.
I was surprised to read in the Gathering thread that bumps at Snowbasin are hard to find. I've noticed the same at other western area I've been to as well; bumps aren't that prevalent. I figured it was because skier traffic is spread across such a huge area that you don't get the condensed traffic required to get classic bump lines going (i.e., not so much becuase of ski area management decisions).
The Front Four get all the marketing fame and they're usually just a sea of big moguls, and they're the ones you see from the lift, but there are other great bump runs all over the mountain.
Stowe does get the snowfall to keep their bump runs from turning into a teeth-rattling ice cubes (usually...) Other areas aren't so lucky; I'd like to think there would be more New England bump runs if there was more consistent snowfall / snow quality. Skiing icy bumps is an acquired taste.
I was surprised to read in the Gathering thread that bumps at Snowbasin are hard to find. I've noticed the same at other western area I've been to as well; bumps aren't that prevalent. I figured it was because skier traffic is spread across such a huge area that you don't get the condensed traffic required to get classic bump lines going (i.e., not so much becuase of ski area management decisions).
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