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Mentors or something damn near like it

Gerry Rhoades

mtcyclist rippin' again
Industry Insider
Joined
Nov 9, 2015
Posts
563
Location
Billings, MT
There is always a lot of talk about people getting lessons, especially new skiers, people returning after not skiing for several years, etc. Lessons, especially private ones, are very important and as a PSIA instructor, I am not about to say they're not good. But, for me anyway, what was more important to my development was a mentor, actually two of them, or something damn near like it

I started skiing in 1963 and being the age I was then, of course I didn't need lessons. I developed just about every bad habit imaginable over the next 40+ years. I sucked and I knew it. When our son entered high school in 2004 he wanted to get involved with an adaptive ski program, Eagle Mount, at Red Lodge Mountain. So we both signed up. The following season I met a husband and wife who were level 2 instructors and also worked with Eagle Mount. Bill convinced me to get new boots, that actually fit and I did. He and his wife started offering clinics to the Eagle Mount volunteers both in the morning and afternoon(volunteers only worked half day). I became their best client and that continued for four seasons. I was often the only person who showed for the clinic, so I got private lessons, a lot of them. He was sort of a drill instructor type and would make me do things over and over. He was able to explain skiing in a way that made sense to my analytic mind. Where he fell down was in his interpersonal skills. In August 2009 I ruptured my left Achilles tendon, had four surgeries by April 2010. During a large portion of that time I had a persistently draining hole in the back of my ankle. Somehow I could still ski and even got my level 1 certification in December 2009, when I was 65. I wasn't volunteering with Eagle Mount that season but did do some teaching. One day Bill came around and said we should go ski. I had become hyper-attentive to my fore-aft balance, because if I got even a bit back the pain was excruciating. We went out and skied a run and then went in the lodge for his critique. His critique was, "Your skiing looks contrived." I was stunned and then I suddenly realized that not once in the four seasons I had been skiing with him at every opportunity had he ever said, "Good job, you did that just right." I was never good enough no matter what and skiing with him had become not fun. It was always about drills on groomers, nothing else. I stood up and walked away without saying a word. I saw him a couple times after that, once when I was wearing my ski school jacket and he acted shocked. I haven't seen them in several years and there are rumors he quit and basically forced his wife, who was the better skier, to quit also. They skied only on 155-160 Atomic SL11 skis and he told me several times that was what I needed, and plug boots too. He'd get apoplectic if he saw my quiver and boots now.

So, while his interpersonal skills basically sucked, I unlearned my bad habits under his persistent gaze. If I had tried to ski Nordica Fire Arrow 84EDTs ten years ago, they would have thrown me down and beat me beyond recognition and I would have thought they were bad skis. I still do drills on groomers, especially early season, but only a couple of runs. But if I mess something up on a run, I'll often head back to a green groomer and do some drills.

My advice to anyone looking to improve is first try private lessons and if that doesn't work, try to find a mentor, someone you trust, who really knows how to ski and who also knows how to teach. Not every good skier is a good teacher.
 

Kneale Brownson

Making fresh tracks forever on the other side
Instructor
Joined
Nov 12, 2015
Posts
1,863
Finding a mentor is something I suggest for every ski instructor working on a certification. That's usually easy in a ski school. Much more difficult for a recreational skier.
 
Thread Starter
TS
Gerry Rhoades

Gerry Rhoades

mtcyclist rippin' again
Industry Insider
Joined
Nov 9, 2015
Posts
563
Location
Billings, MT
I forgot to mention that he encouraged me to join PSIA so I could attend clinics but when I later expressed interest in getting certified he was not encouraging about it. Strange little (figuratively) man.
 

Drahtguy Kevin

Après aficionado
SkiTalk Tester
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Nov 9, 2015
Posts
1,832
Location
Northern Colorado
I'm fortunate to have a mentor. I texted him recently looking to get some guidance and will when he gets back from business. A few runs, some drills and explanations of movements, mistakes, etc. will be welcomed. He'll explain things in a way I understand them, using few technical terms. I wholeheartedly agree a mentor is invaluable. Good post @Gerry Rhoades.
 

LiquidFeet

instructor
Instructor
Joined
Nov 12, 2015
Posts
6,718
Location
New England
There is always a lot of talk about people getting lessons, especially new skiers, people returning after not skiing for several years, etc. Lessons, especially private ones, are very important and as a PSIA instructor, I am not about to say they're not good. But, for me anyway, what was more important to my development was a mentor, actually two of them, or something damn near like it

I started skiing in 1963 and being the age I was then, of course I didn't need lessons. I developed just about every bad habit imaginable over the next 40+ years. I sucked and I knew it. When our son entered high school in 2004 he wanted to get involved with an adaptive ski program, Eagle Mount, at Red Lodge Mountain. So we both signed up. The following season I met a husband and wife who were level 2 instructors and also worked with Eagle Mount. Bill convinced me to get new boots, that actually fit and I did. He and his wife started offering clinics to the Eagle Mount volunteers both in the morning and afternoon(volunteers only worked half day). I became their best client and that continued for four seasons. I was often the only person who showed for the clinic, so I got private lessons, a lot of them. He was sort of a drill instructor type and would make me do things over and over. He was able to explain skiing in a way that made sense to my analytic mind. Where he fell down was in his interpersonal skills. In August 2009 I ruptured my left Achilles tendon, had four surgeries by April 2010. During a large portion of that time I had a persistently draining hole in the back of my ankle. Somehow I could still ski and even got my level 1 certification in December 2009, when I was 65. I wasn't volunteering with Eagle Mount that season but did do some teaching. One day Bill came around and said we should go ski. I had become hyper-attentive to my fore-aft balance, because if I got even a bit back the pain was excruciating. We went out and skied a run and then went in the lodge for his critique. His critique was, "Your skiing looks contrived." I was stunned and then I suddenly realized that not once in the four seasons I had been skiing with him at every opportunity had he ever said, "Good job, you did that just right." I was never good enough no matter what and skiing with him had become not fun. It was always about drills on groomers, nothing else. I stood up and walked away without saying a word. I saw him a couple times after that, once when I was wearing my ski school jacket and he acted shocked. I haven't seen them in several years and there are rumors he quit and basically forced his wife, who was the better skier, to quit also. They skied only on 155-160 Atomic SL11 skis and he told me several times that was what I needed, and plug boots too. He'd get apoplectic if he saw my quiver and boots now.

So, while his interpersonal skills basically sucked, I unlearned my bad habits under his persistent gaze. If I had tried to ski Nordica Fire Arrow 84EDTs ten years ago, they would have thrown me down and beat me beyond recognition and I would have thought they were bad skis. I still do drills on groomers, especially early season, but only a couple of runs. But if I mess something up on a run, I'll often head back to a green groomer and do some drills.

My advice to anyone looking to improve is first try private lessons and if that doesn't work, try to find a mentor, someone you trust, who really knows how to ski and who also knows how to teach. Not every good skier is a good teacher.

There is so much good stuff in this post I don't know where to begin. Thanks for telling your story.
 

markojp

mtn rep for the gear on my feet
Industry Insider
Instructor
Joined
Nov 12, 2015
Posts
6,629
Location
PNW aka SEA
Mentors are great! Sometimes they aren't about providing a load of technical input at all, but simply being supportive and giving you opportunities to succeed because they believe in you. My last SSD was in this category. Of course he helped my skiing, but it was the other stuff that made it fun to be on the hill.
 

Monique

bounceswoosh
Skier
Joined
Nov 12, 2015
Posts
10,561
Location
Colorado
I don't have a mentor, but there's a female ski instructor who really inspires me. She kicks ass, I gather used to do big mountain competitions, and it's fun to see her ski. It's just not that common to ski with a woman who skis at that level and that aggressively. Many female skiers have beautiful form, but I've never skied with another woman who has the combo of beautiful skiing and aggressiveness. Anyway, she is always encouraging me to push just a little harder, and I also see her doing great work with women of all levels. I know she sees it as part of her teaching mission to get women out there and have them ski the same stuff their husbands/boyfriends do, which in a lot of cases takes a lot of cajoling and encouragement. It makes me want to do the same (encourage the ladies to rip), although my patience with it is unfortunately extremely limited. For me, though, she's more on the "tough love" tip. Her latest feedback, which I've been trying to incorporate and is very hard for someone who overthinks everything like I do, is "Monique, stop trying to be so fucking perfect!" Apparently I need to accept that I will get tossed around, the snow won't be perfectly smooth, etc and that skiing is a series of recoveries - and just because someone looks smooth as silk does not mean they're not constantly recovering.

Now that I've typed all that, I guess even though she's not a constant presence in my ski life, she's still pretty much a mentor to me. She participates exactly zero in online stuff, but I gotta give a shout out to Jenn Losch at Breck.
 

Monique

bounceswoosh
Skier
Joined
Nov 12, 2015
Posts
10,561
Location
Colorado
Jenn used to compete in extreme skiing events.

She's said that, but I haven't been able to find any photos or video, unfortunately. Maybe she had a different maiden name?
 
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