Measuring Ski Edge Bevels

[SlideWright]

It's good to quantify the edge geometry on your skis. The REAL ANSWER to 'what's the factory spec' of my X, Y or Z skis question is, MEASURE THEM because variables exist. A case in point is a recent purchase were the 'factory spec' is 1:1 (1 degree base & 1 degree side). With the intent of skiing them as is first, then adjust, It's good to record the geometry so you know where you started vs where you may end up.

(On one hand, I almost wish I didn't know, so I could simply ski them without preconceptions or thinking about the edge geometry. If the bases are flat, the edges sharp, perform a few base prep and WOTD (wax of the day) cycles and get some vertical on your new rides.)

There are many options to measure edge geometry. The three I tried this go around were using a calibrated SVST Pro Bevel Meter, Digital Angle finder and magnet and edge guides with a Sharpie ink. The evenness of the ink removal relative to a given guide gives you a visual glue if the guide matches or not. All methods rely on a consistently flat base. So check your bases with a true bar first. All three methods provided generally consistent averages throughout the skis of around 1.5/2 vs the 1:1 'factory spec' FOR THIS PAIR OF SKIS.

 

[Jacques]

Nice. Most of the time I have found the above to be true so I just tune when new or new to me before I ski them.

 

[Josh Matta]

do you just put the digital edge finder on flush and its measures?

30 dollars is superior to 300 dollars......

 

[CalG]

A small machinist's square, some slips of copy paper and a hand glass with good light, will do better than all those "devices", shown.
Trigonometry is NOT rocket surgery, and if you can not "see" what you are measuring, uncertainty exceeds the precision and accuracy.

 

[SlideWright]

do you just put the digital edge finder on flush and its measures?

30 dollars is superior to 300 dollars......

I've had the best luck with a magnet securely on the base of the digital angle finder. Set it on a true bar to calibrate then place it on the base edge. You'll find digital variability along the edge and may need to recalibrate at different sections of the ski and average.

For side edges, if the ski is flat, the angle finder may tilt, so place the ski on edge, calibrate off the true bar then place on side edge. You'll read 90+the side edge angle. If you are certain the true bar has a 90° corner, calibrate on the end of the bar which should be zero.

 

[SlideWright]

Nice. Most of the time I have found the above to be true so I just tune when new or new to me before I ski them.

But then you lose the opportunity to learn by 'just ski 'em before you change 'em', then tweak and feel the differences.

 

[Jacques]

But then you lose the opportunity to learn by 'just ski 'em before you change 'em', then tweak and feel the differences.

Been there, done that. I remember feeling like I could not ski anymore. Base bevels were way bad. Tuned them up and then I could ski again.

 

[SlideWright]

Been there, done that. I remember feeling like I could not ski anymore. Base bevels were way bad. Tuned them up and then I could ski again.

In the cases of a smooth, sharp edges with different than expected or typically used edge geometry, we all might benefit from experimenting vs blindly changing the edge geometry without knowing why or performing a simple comparison. On a particular set of skis you may discover something unexpected and a benefit.

 

[PTskier]

Two other options, the FK side edge bevel gauge, $40:

And the FK Side & Base bevel gauge, $70:

For me, inking the edge then running a fine stone in a guide along the edge works. Find the guide with the angle that evenly removes the ink.

How does one recalibrate the SVST Pro bevel meter after one drops it to the floor?

 

[SlideWright]

How does one recalibrate the SVST Pro bevel meter after one drops it to the floor?

By loosening the set screws and move the gauges while the tool is against a 3-2-1 machinists block for each edge. This, after 50 lashes and a 1 week suspension for dropping the tool.

 

[Jacques]

In the cases of a smooth, sharp edges with different than expected or typically used edge geometry, we all might benefit from experimenting vs blindly changing the edge geometry without knowing why or performing a simple comparison. On a particular set of skis you may discover something unexpected and a benefit.

Yea, I hear you and think for learning it is an excellent thing to do. Good way to experience the difference better geometry can make,

 

[mdf]

Two other options, the FK side edge bevel gauge, $40:

And the FK Side & Base bevel gauge, $70:

For me, inking the edge then running a fine stone in a guide along the edge works. Find the guide with the angle that evenly removes the ink.

How does one recalibrate the SVST Pro bevel meter after one drops it to the floor?

So I went to look at the FK gauge. I see an odd comment on a link, "Bevel Gauge instructions PDF here Hopefully they prove useful."
This is what it links to....

Ohhhhh....

Actually I think I might buy one.

 

[BGreen]

Does anyone remember what the Montana edge bevel meter is called? I would really like to find a working one. I have only seen one in the wild.

 

[cantunamunch]

Does anyone remember what the Montana edge bevel meter is called? I would really like to find a working one. I have only seen one in the wild.

I thought I knew but it turns out I was thinking of the Sidecut base only one:
https://www.sidecut.com/product/BEBM.html

 

[BGreen]

I thought I knew but it turns out I was thinking of the Sidecut base only one:
https://www.sidecut.com/product/BEBM.html

Yeah, I may buy one of those. I think MBAS makes them. Very accurate, but very slow. The Montana is instant read, just push a button. I think it bounces a laser off the edge.

 

[ScottB]

I am a race coach and ski NE on a lot of hard snow. Sharp edges and edge bevels are everything to anyone skiing on hard snow. Most skiers don't realize it. I expect most on this forum to be pretty "tuned" into it.

The method I use to measure bottom base bevel is the 60mm rule, using a marked true bar and some feeler gauges. Its dead easy to do and you can almost calibrate your eyeball after doing it a few times.(assuming a flat base) It doesn't work for side edge angle. For that I generally use my file guide and match the guide to the side angle by eye. I do have an adjustable file guide that I sometimes put loose against the ski edge and adjust it till it matches the side angle.

I know where I want my bevels, so I just get them there and I am done. Once I get them where I want them to be, I don't measure them much anymore. For hard snow, 0.5 base / 3.0 side works well. Most people like 1.0 base, but if you are an advanced skier on hard snow, I guarantee you will like 0.5- .75 more than 1.0, it makes the skis more precise. If you don't like precise, then stick with 1.0.

My 2 Cents.

 

[Cwunder]

I've had the best luck with a magnet securely on the base of the digital angle finder. Set it on a true bar to calibrate then place it on the base edge. You'll find digital variability along the edge and may need to recalibrate at different sections of the ski and average.

For side edges, if the ski is flat, the angle finder may tilt, so place the ski on edge, calibrate off the true bar then place on side edge. You'll read 90+the side edge angle. If you are certain the true bar has a 90° corner, calibrate on the end of the bar which should be zero.

I have the same digital angle guage but can't for the life of me get it to measure either the edge or base angle. Most of the difficulty seems to be getting it to actually balance on the edge vs resting on the sidewall or base. Any tips?

 

[Noodler]

I have the same digital angle guage but can't for the life of me get it to measure either the edge or base angle. Most of the difficulty seems to be getting it to actually balance on the edge vs resting on the sidewall or base. Any tips?

 

[oldschoolskier]

Here is a simple version that works well and costs a lot less.

https://www.kbctools.ca/products/search/Protractor

 

[Cwunder]

View attachment 119009

Thanks, that makes a lot of sense!

Do you have any tips for doing the side edge? So far my main difficulties have been:
A) Unlike the base, the side edges on most skis I work with are angled, so there's not really a flat point to go off of. I'm not sure how to determine if the ski is level and what my baseline/flat calibration point should be.
B) The side wall seems to get in the way for trying to position the true bar so that it matches the edge angle. (Also no good way to clap to the side as far as I can tell)