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Mahre Ski Camps
- Thread starter martyg
- Start date
As a pupil or instructor? I'm familiar with DV instructors that help with that and have witnessed some of their activities even joining for a couple of runs. It isn't like attending PSIA clinics but that can be a good thing in some ways. The Mahre twins normally attend which for me would be worth the price. Steve waited for me as a single on a chair once and I passed before I realized it was him. I felt like such a stupid.
I've only heard good things about the camps from students' POVs.
I have not been to one.
I have not been to one.
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Thread Starter
TS
- Joined
- Nov 24, 2017
- Posts
- 2,235
Thx.
@martyg
I went to one in Dec 2014 - 3 day camp. I'm a recreational skier. It was huge for me... helped me actually start using edges and taught me a bunch of drills I do now. It inspired me to start looking at ski forums, starting with EpicSki, then moved here after it shuttered. I started looking at forums to learn about getting my own boots. Also some of the camp includes technical presentations that echo things I've seen here and at EpicSki.
I have not been back for another round. Many at the camp I was at had been to prior camps and went every year. I'm trying to get my wife to go, but there are only so many vacation days... work work... I think intermediate skiers can benefit significantly from the camp. Anyone wanting to really improve carving could benefit.
IDK if an instructor would get as much out of it...
I will say watching the Mahre brothers ski was quite amazing. They could get huge angles on green terrain I did not think possible. Seemed to make speed out of nothing.
I went to one in Dec 2014 - 3 day camp. I'm a recreational skier. It was huge for me... helped me actually start using edges and taught me a bunch of drills I do now. It inspired me to start looking at ski forums, starting with EpicSki, then moved here after it shuttered. I started looking at forums to learn about getting my own boots. Also some of the camp includes technical presentations that echo things I've seen here and at EpicSki.
I have not been back for another round. Many at the camp I was at had been to prior camps and went every year. I'm trying to get my wife to go, but there are only so many vacation days... work work... I think intermediate skiers can benefit significantly from the camp. Anyone wanting to really improve carving could benefit.
IDK if an instructor would get as much out of it...
I will say watching the Mahre brothers ski was quite amazing. They could get huge angles on green terrain I did not think possible. Seemed to make speed out of nothing.
Thread Starter
TS
- Joined
- Nov 24, 2017
- Posts
- 2,235
Thanks so much.
I've been skiing for 56 years now and still invest 10 - 20 days in clinics a year to improve my skiing and teaching. It is always good to experience a new approach. We're basically trying to get to the same place in the mastery of our craft. It all boils down to a few basics, and the better that you can do those few basics the better (more efficient) you will be.
Note on green terrain... it is actually easier for most skiers to look like they ski well at higher speeds, and on steeper terrain. The forces created act on your skis in a way that allows them to engage more fully. That person who is technically solid on flat terrain - that is often a very technically proficient skier.
I need an excuse to head up that way. This may be it.
There was some gate training in the 3 day sequence. I think there is more time in the 5 day sequence to get some 1 on 1 for a really advanced skier. Like gates work - with Olympic skiers... pretty cool IMO. I was worried more about passing the gates on the correct side, so I didn't get as much out of it.
Going in early December limited the open terrain to just groomers. I don't know if they do 3D snow in the later sessions.
Check out their facebook page. Looks like they have some videos/photos there with updates since 2016. There is a MTC masters group?? Not sure how that works -- maybe if you are super cool and carve circles on one leg, you can get invited to do those.
FYI the carve on one leg thing was a drill -- Mahre bros. are pretty good at it
.
There is a fair assortment of 'stupid human tricks' in the 3 day sequence. I actually almost quit after day 1 thinking I had learned nothing. But the subsequent days started to make more sense and by end of day 2 my skiing had improved quite a bit. They did try to warn me of this... but I am stubborn.
Essentially the morning of day 1, they said that during the 3 days, you would 'forget' how to ski. They break down your skiing until you question whether you ever even knew how to ski. You kind of forget what it feels like to make a turn. And by the end, they put you back together again, and you can ski - better.
Anyway, I recommend it. Reason I haven't done it again is time. So many other camps I want to do also that I just don't have time for!
Going in early December limited the open terrain to just groomers. I don't know if they do 3D snow in the later sessions.
Check out their facebook page. Looks like they have some videos/photos there with updates since 2016. There is a MTC masters group?? Not sure how that works -- maybe if you are super cool and carve circles on one leg, you can get invited to do those.
FYI the carve on one leg thing was a drill -- Mahre bros. are pretty good at it
. There is a fair assortment of 'stupid human tricks' in the 3 day sequence. I actually almost quit after day 1 thinking I had learned nothing. But the subsequent days started to make more sense and by end of day 2 my skiing had improved quite a bit. They did try to warn me of this... but I am stubborn.
Essentially the morning of day 1, they said that during the 3 days, you would 'forget' how to ski. They break down your skiing until you question whether you ever even knew how to ski. You kind of forget what it feels like to make a turn. And by the end, they put you back together again, and you can ski - better.
Anyway, I recommend it. Reason I haven't done it again is time. So many other camps I want to do also that I just don't have time for!
Heard good things, never been. If it were me I would just freeski as much as possible, focus on your own enjoyment outside of progression, and reevaluate at the end of the season. I know a lot of people who burn out hard from year after year of the obsessive training that comes with instruction, even if you are taking a break from being an instructor.
Something else you might consider, although it will be more expensive, is a masters program. You'll get a seasons length of coaching and focused training, but it will likely be only a few people in a group, and maybe some days just you. I know the masters at Northstar typically have 3-5 per group, and some days only 1 or 2. Also, masters starts at 18, and (keep in mind I'm just using N* as an example because thats what I know) can give you a broader range of people to ski with. I love coaching 8-18 year olds because it helps me keep the little kid inside me alive. That and adults don't thing its funny when you push them into the snow while they're standing around waiting for someone to do something.
Something else you might consider, although it will be more expensive, is a masters program. You'll get a seasons length of coaching and focused training, but it will likely be only a few people in a group, and maybe some days just you. I know the masters at Northstar typically have 3-5 per group, and some days only 1 or 2. Also, masters starts at 18, and (keep in mind I'm just using N* as an example because thats what I know) can give you a broader range of people to ski with. I love coaching 8-18 year olds because it helps me keep the little kid inside me alive. That and adults don't thing its funny when you push them into the snow while they're standing around waiting for someone to do something.
Paging @cbk to the Pugski Courtesy Phone. CBK has been to numerous Mahre Camps. Also @Bob Barnes who used to work closely with the camps when they were at Keystone.
Yes, I have in fact been to two MTC (Mahre Training Center) camps of the 3-day variety and I'm looking forward to doing my first 5-day in January! The rest of my comments here relate to the 3-day camps; it's my understanding that the 5-day camps have optional racing... One of the brothers will ski with each group for one half day which is cool; at the second one I attended, on two of the six half-days our group got to ski with Phil once and with Steve once. The camps have after-skiing tech sessions, and an awards session after skiing on the last day. The group coaches are among DV's best instructors, the two guys I had were both PSIA DECLs (Division Education Clinic Leaders) and one of them (@lswedish) is lurking around here somewhere. One thing I found interesting being a PSIA member is that while the PSIA seems to change things back and forth every few years like a pendulum, Steve Mahre told me after one of the tech sessions when a bunch of were just sitting around talking skiing that they hadn't changed anything in 30 years. Chris Katzenberger (DV ski school director) did a great job of grouping the students. The focus is really on basics, and particularly balance, but at different levels to match the students' levels. Morning is dedicated to covering a plane of balance (fore/aft, left/right, up/down) with relevant drills and practice; the afternoon is dedicated to skiing and putting those concepts and abilities to great use! And, if that's not enough, the brothers are just really approachable down-to-earth guys that view these camps as a way to give back to the sport they love. One funny thing, when I got an email from DV regarding these and realized it lined up with one of our timeshare weeks, I emailed an instructor friend of mine (the late Sue Hedgecock) to get her opinion, she wrote back "You'll love it. See you there." She was right, and also happened to be one of the camp coaches... Msg me if you have any other questions, if you're thinking about the January one also let me know!
In summary:
In summary:
Will elaborate a bit more on this having been to two now (Dec 2015 and 2018)...both three day camps.
Day 1: Fore/aft balance drills. Evening lecture on gear by shop tech (boots mainly).
Day 2: Lateral balance drills. Video + analysis. Evening lecture on ski theory (where to shift weight, pole plant, COM location in turns, etc. Much of this information is on this website, but hearing it in person in a coherent manner is nice too).
Day 3: Vertical balance drills and put it back together. Video + analysis. Evening dinner + 'awards'
Sometime during the 3 days, they do photos with the twins, coaches, groups, etc. You can $pay$ for the photos and videos.
In truth, we did not follow this progression exactly... We sort of mashed Day 1/2 together and did Day 3 on Day 2 with work on short turns for last day.
What drills you do depends on the level skier/group you are in. Also likely the coach. One of the twins will ski with your group and offer some additional coaching. For me, this was Phil on Day 2 and Steve on Day 3 - though unfortunately I had to leave early Day 3 to make it to the airport...
Itinerary shows instruction ending at 3pm each day, but we actually skied to last chair...you can always bail early if tired, etc.
The basic premise/mentality of the camp is to "teach you to fish." That is, they are aiming for you to learn how to feel sensations and self-diagnose to continue improvement well past the camp ending. I think in this, they are successful - at least with me personally. I learned new drills in the most recent camp. They were not the same I did 3 years ago. Notably absent was less work on 1-footed skiing. Maybe it was different coach, ability, or thinking toward that type of drill. Unknown. I have used the drills from the first camp to get 'dialed-in' and intend to incorporate the new ones.
I asked a bit to see if they do moguls in the later sessions. The answer is generally no. But we did actually do some work in them on the last afternoon - about 1-2 hrs there because I requested it... then had to leave early just when things were getting good :-(
Edit to add - I enjoyed all days of the camp greatly. Day 1 we did a skating drill that really clicked with me and made the entire camp worthwhile. Day 2 and 3 were bonus after that...
Day 1: Fore/aft balance drills. Evening lecture on gear by shop tech (boots mainly).
Day 2: Lateral balance drills. Video + analysis. Evening lecture on ski theory (where to shift weight, pole plant, COM location in turns, etc. Much of this information is on this website, but hearing it in person in a coherent manner is nice too).
Day 3: Vertical balance drills and put it back together. Video + analysis. Evening dinner + 'awards'
Sometime during the 3 days, they do photos with the twins, coaches, groups, etc. You can $pay$ for the photos and videos.
In truth, we did not follow this progression exactly... We sort of mashed Day 1/2 together and did Day 3 on Day 2 with work on short turns for last day.
What drills you do depends on the level skier/group you are in. Also likely the coach. One of the twins will ski with your group and offer some additional coaching. For me, this was Phil on Day 2 and Steve on Day 3 - though unfortunately I had to leave early Day 3 to make it to the airport...
Itinerary shows instruction ending at 3pm each day, but we actually skied to last chair...you can always bail early if tired, etc.
The basic premise/mentality of the camp is to "teach you to fish." That is, they are aiming for you to learn how to feel sensations and self-diagnose to continue improvement well past the camp ending. I think in this, they are successful - at least with me personally. I learned new drills in the most recent camp. They were not the same I did 3 years ago. Notably absent was less work on 1-footed skiing. Maybe it was different coach, ability, or thinking toward that type of drill. Unknown. I have used the drills from the first camp to get 'dialed-in' and intend to incorporate the new ones.
I asked a bit to see if they do moguls in the later sessions. The answer is generally no. But we did actually do some work in them on the last afternoon - about 1-2 hrs there because I requested it... then had to leave early just when things were getting good :-(
Edit to add - I enjoyed all days of the camp greatly. Day 1 we did a skating drill that really clicked with me and made the entire camp worthwhile. Day 2 and 3 were bonus after that...
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