Look Pivot remount with Attack 13

[gilgamesh0]

I have some Atomic Vantage 100s mounted on the factory line with Pivot 12 bindings. I'm considering remounting the Vantages with a pair of Tyrolia Attack 13s (and using the Pivots on another pair of skis). Will I be able to have the Attacks also mounted on the line, or would they have to be moved (and by how much)? Anyone have experience remounting a ski from Pivots to one of the Attacks? (seems like maybe the Attacks 12+ all have the same mount pattern..?)

Eyeballing it (I have the Attacks in hand), the heel piece looks for sure like it wouldn't conflict, with the Pivot mount point being several inches forward (for that famously short Pivot mount pattern). But the toe piece -- though the Pivot toe does give up some of its short mount by extending a couple inches north of the Attack's stubby toe piece -- it looks like the screws for the Attack would sit at pretty nearly the same level as those on the Pivot.

Grateful for any input.. I've never had a remount done, so I'm also curious if there are any other considerations, besides the cost for the extra mount (plus in this case an extra set of brakes.. I've got the 85s, am assuming/hoping a 95 brake width for the Attack should work ok for the Vantage 100).

 

[Freddo Bumps]

You should be able to pull some paper templates off the internet and line them up. That’s what I’ve done, anyway.

 

[GregK]

As long as you have 7-8mm between the center of the old holes to the center of the new holes, you’re good. Some go by the 1cm/10mm rule but many tests done show 7mm plus and you’re 100% golden.

The installer will fill the old holes with top sheet color matching plugs(if possible) and then try the jig with your boot size on the line. The back should be fine as you thought but the front might be close as you have seen. Worst case on hole overlap, you move it a touch back or forward to get that 7mm plus clearence. You can reuse holes if they are the same width and just drill 2 new holes for a toe in the case of a Salomon to Attack swap but think you need 4 new holes in your case. Honestly think you should be very close to the line still with the binding swap as you’re using the same boot size. Most binding companies are just a bit different to prevent hole conflicts.

The harder issue and the reason why people show previous mounts bindings and boot sizes in used ski ads is when you want to change bindings AND boot size. Have to deal with front toe AND back piece hole issues then.
Lots of binding templates online that you can print out and look at your boot size for your exsisting bindings and new bindings to figure out hole conflicts and how much forward or back you need to move them to get that 7mm clearance.

Most places just charge $5-10 more for a “re-mount” vs a “mount” to seal up the old holes and clean up the ski before drilling the new holes. 95mm Tyrolia brake will be fine on that ski.

 

[gilgamesh0]

Great, thanks for the insight, so much good info above. Using those, it looks like the toe will probably need to move about up about 0.5cm, or else down maybe 1cm (too bad it's not the other way around, all else being equal I'd prefer back). I gather with Tyrolia the adjustability is all in the heel, so it's not like they could place it higher and then adjust back for the boot fit.

Now I know the implications, so guess it's just down to whether I resist the optimization impulse. The other ski is a Brahma (180, as is the Vantage) - I got them with the Attacks, but now that I look at getting them mounted, I can't help thinking that the bindings may work better the other way around, with the Pivots on the Brahma.

Not that I haven't been enjoying the Vantage 100 with the Pivots, I have - but they can be a pain to get back into in deeper snow or awkward slopes, which the Attacks should be much better for.. plus the Attack's lighter weight might be a better fit for how I often use those (relatively playful, some trees and moguls), whereas the heavier Pivots might jibe better with how I'll be, er, attacking rougher snow with the Brahma.

Some of it is admittedly just aesthetic "fit" as well -- that wide Attack toe does practically hang over the sides of the Brahma, whereas it seems to fit so nicely on the Vantage. I've followed with interest that thread exploring the performance impact, if any, of a wider binding toe platform for wider skis -- from that it sounds like in this case it would probably more aesthestics than actual effect. Still, having trouble resisting that urge, that this might be the better pairing.

 

[Josh Matta]

just quiver kill them and dont buy the attacks...

 

[Philpug]

just quiver kill them and dont buy the attacks...

Or just get another pair of Pivots.

 

[gilgamesh0]

just quiver kill them and dont buy the attacks...

Already have the Attacks though. Have just been slow to get to doing something with these Brahmas, finances were such for a while that I thought I might sell them.

"quiver kill them"..?

 

[Bill Talbot]

Or just get another pair of Pivots.

FORZA Pivots that is!!!

 

[Freddo Bumps]

Already have the Attacks though. Have just been slow to get to doing something with these Brahmas, finances were such for a while that I thought I might sell them.

"quiver kill them"..?

Threaded stainless steel binding inserts from Quiver Killers or Binding Freedom that allow you to quickly swap bindings between skis. You would need one insert per hole times the number of skis between which you are sharing bindings and also one set of binding-specific screws (not the screws that come with the bindings).

 

[gilgamesh0]

Threaded stainless steel binding inserts from Quiver Killers or Binding Freedom that allow you to quickly swap bindings between skis. You would need one insert per hole times the number of skis between which you are sharing bindings and also one set of binding-specific screws (not the screws that come with the bindings).

Ah cool. Learn something new here every day (or multiple times a day). Snowboards I know typically have screw housings for the bindings, makes sense to make something like that available for skis.

Cool suggestion, though per above I do already have the Attacks (though I guess it doesn't mean I couldn't still do it ).

I do think though maybe the Attacks could provide some advantages on the Vantages -- sometimes I feel like I wouldn't mind lightening up the setup a bit, since I've been getting a bit more playful with my skiing on them (expecting to use the Brahma more often when I want to charge hard more). And they're what I use in deeper snow (I don't have a dedicated powder ski), and the Pivots have proven to often be a chore to get into when the snow is deep.

 

[gilgamesh0]

FORZA Pivots that is!!!

I couldn't do them justice.

 

[Philpug]

I couldn't do them justice.

Not with that attitude.

 

[gilgamesh0]

Not with that attitude.

Hehe, fair enough. (I'm a tall lightweight though, so no matter how much I rage around, couldn't justify over the lower DIN Pivots.)

 

[Philpug]

Hehe, fair enough. (I'm a tall lightweight though, so no matter how much I rage around, couldn't justify over the lower DIN Pivots.)

I have some RS19's..they are a 2-6...I mean you have to start somewhere.

 

[gilgamesh0]

A maybe silly question: If you remount with a different binding and then want to go back to the original binding, can they be mounted again back in the original spot? It sounds like the original mount holes are typically filled with epoxy (or something of the sort), are they usable again after that?

 

[Chef23]

Already have the Attacks though. Have just been slow to get to doing something with these Brahmas, finances were such for a while that I thought I might sell them.

"quiver kill them"..?

Why not put the Attacks on the new skis and leave the Pivots where they are?

 

[bjohansson]

The Attack toes will definitely conflict with the Look/Rossi toes. I wouldn't mess with the mount point enough to offset that conflict. I had a similar plan and had to buy new Looks. I have the Attack 13s still sitting on my workbench.

 

[gilgamesh0]

Why not put the Attacks on the new skis and leave the Pivots where they are?

Just the instinct that they might go better the other way around -- per above the Pivots can be awkward to get into in deeper snow (and I wouldn't mind having the lighter Attacks for trees etc.), while the weightier Pivots would fit well with how I expect to use the Brahma. Basically if I were to choose again from scratch, that's how I would choose.

But for sure I can, and starting to accept that I probably will keep it simple and just put the Attacks on the new skis.

 

[gilgamesh0]

The Attack toes will definitely conflict with the Look/Rossi toes. I wouldn't mess with the mount point enough to offset that conflict. I had a similar plan and had to buy new Looks. I have the Attack 13s still sitting on my workbench.

Thanks, that is good to know (if a bit disappointing). Does that mean then though that you were able to remount the Pivots using the original holes without issue? If only for future reference..

 

[bjohansson]

Sorry for the tardy reply...I don't have any issue with remounting bindings in existing holes if they are in good shape. I use epoxy when I do that just to make sure they hold. You need to use care to not cut new threads when reusing old holes. Do not press down hard on the screwdriver.