Cage Match Comparison Look Pivot 12 Dual WTR vs Salomon STH2 WTR 13

Philpug

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Vive la France

Sth2 vs Pivot 12.png

The French have been known for a lot of great things -- fries, toast, and kisses among them -- but not for technology. Cars? No. Threading? Never took off. Ski bindings? They got those right. Let's compare modern incarnations of two of the most iconic binding designs on the planet. The Look Pivot 12/14 and Salomon STH2 13 are two designs whose heritage dates to the 1970s, the Look Nevada and Salomon 727. These bindings are examples of why you don’t shortcut on the boot-to-ski interface. Both tout a tremendous amount of elasticity in the toes and heels; their numbers are within a very few millimeters travel of each other. There is no need to make a deciding factor out of such small percentages, these are the two best in that area, 1 and 1A depending on who you talk to and where their loyalty lies.

From 10 paces, the Pivot 12/14 doesn’t look very different to the average skier than its great-grandfather the Nevada, but as you get closer, the differences start to show. For 2017, all Pivot 12s are designated as "Dual," which means that the multidirectional toe with 180° release incorporates WTR (Walk To Ride), allowing the binding to accommodate that or a DIN sole with the turn of a switch. Look’s Dual system is pretty much foolproof and will not change the ramp angle of the boot. [Note: As of this publishing date, the Pivot 12 and 14 have integrated WTR compatibility but now are not compatible with GripSole.] The Pivot heel is unlike any other on the market. You can see that the mounting screws are actually under the heel of the boot; this short mount allows the ski to flex very naturally under the boot. With all of the mass so centered, the Pivot has a low rotational weight and feels very light.

Like the Look's heritage, the STH2 13 goes back to the Salomon 727 from 40 or so years ago. Its single-pivot toe and dual cam heel is a design that almost every major binding manufacturer has used at some point. Salomon’s Driver toe is one of the few that has manual adjustments for wing and height so you can fine-tune the boot-binding interface. Salomon also offers WTR, but it is the toe height that adjusts on the STH2 13, which does change ramp angle when going from one sole to another. Salomon offers a solid AFD whereas Look's is a sliding one. Getting back to the heel design, it is a simple function with an easy in-out mechanism, and it has more than 20 mm of travel so can accommodate different BSLs if needed.
  • Why choose the Pivot 12? Best if you switch from regular DIN soles and WTR regularly. Short mount distance means a very reactive binding.
  • Why choose the STH2 13? No fuss, no muss. It is easier to get in and out of in deep snow, has a ton of adjustability and the ability to fine-tune the interface, and brake widths are easy to change.
  • Other bindings in the class: Look SPX 12, Marker Griffon, Salomon Warden, Tyrolia Attack 13.

Edited to note that the Look Dual Toe pieces are now Gripwalk compatible.
 

Bill Talbot

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Every 'premium ' binding need a metal interface where the pole contacts the binding for a manual release. As this is a normal and daily happening, it should not cause cosmetic damage to the binding.
 

oswaldr2

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Is there any instruction available on how to change the STH2 between Alpine DIN boots and WTR boots?

EDIT - Did some youtubing, think I have it.
 
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CalG

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Binding release interface cosmetic damage is of no consequence.
Bindings "fall off" the indemnification chart and become obsolete. They are not "long lived".

Plus , release lever wear and tear is a show of "experience". Pristine equipment is contrary.
I step on the heels of both Pivots and the alternatives. The technique works well, but makes for some rapid foot work on icy off camber removals ;-)
 

Viking9

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Your right on with the ease of use and versatility of the Salomon , I have a few Rossi’s with the look bindings and one with the Salomon and stepping in the Salomon is a lot easier.
 
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Philpug

Philpug

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Please not that the original Cage Match has been updated to show that the Look Dual toe now accomodates Gripwalk.
 

John O

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Please not that the original Cage Match has been updated to show that the Look Dual toe now accomodates Gripwalk.
Woah, that's interesting. Does that make it the first non-touring binding that supports both?
 

John O

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Awesome, thanks for that. I didn't realize there were already so many bindings that supported both.
 

Andy Sainsbury

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Marker's sole ID bindings are fully compatible with alpine, WTR, or touring soles; and of course gripwalk soles.
 
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Philpug

Philpug

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Marker's sole ID bindings are fully compatible with alpine, WTR, or touring soles; and of course gripwalk soles.
Waiting for comformation from Marker on this. Thank you for bringing it to my attention.
 

Big J

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The French have been known for a lot of great things -- fries, toast, and kisses among them -- but not for technology. Cars? No. Threading? Never took off. Ski bindings? They got those right. Let's compare modern incarnations of two of the most iconic binding designs on the planet. The Look Pivot 12/14 and Salomon STH2 13 are two designs whose heritage dates to the 1970s, the Look Nevada and Salomon 727. These bindings are examples of why you don’t shortcut on the boot-to-ski interface. Both tout a tremendous amount of elasticity in the toes and heels; their numbers are within a very few millimeters travel of each other. There is no need to make a deciding factor out of such small percentages, these are the two best in that area, 1 and 1A depending on who you talk to and where their loyalty lies.

From 10 paces, the Pivot 12/14 doesn’t look very different to the average skier than its great-grandfather the Nevada, but as you get closer, the differences start to show. For 2017, all Pivot 12s are designated as "Dual," which means that the multidirectional toe with 180° release incorporates WTR (Walk To Ride), allowing the binding to accommodate that or a DIN sole with the turn of a switch. Look’s Dual system is pretty much foolproof and will not change the ramp angle of the boot. [Note: As of this publishing date, the Pivot 12 and 14 have integrated WTR compatibility but now are not compatible with GripSole.] The Pivot heel is unlike any other on the market. You can see that the mounting screws are actually under the heel of the boot; this short mount allows the ski to flex very naturally under the boot. With all of the mass so centered, the Pivot has a low rotational weight and feels very light.

Like the Look's heritage, the STH2 13 goes back to the Salomon 727 from 40 or so years ago. Its single-pivot toe and dual cam heel is a design that almost every major binding manufacturer has used at some point. Salomon’s Driver toe is one of the few that has manual adjustments for wing and height so you can fine-tune the boot-binding interface. Salomon also offers WTR, but it is the toe height that adjusts on the STH2 13, which does change ramp angle when going from one sole to another. Salomon offers a solid AFD whereas Look's is a sliding one. Getting back to the heel design, it is a simple function with an easy in-out mechanism, and it has more than 20 mm of travel so can accommodate different BSLs if needed.
  • Why choose the Pivot 12? Best if you switch from regular DIN soles and WTR regularly. Short mount distance means a very reactive binding.
  • Why choose the STH2 13? No fuss, no muss. It is easier to get in and out of in deep snow, has a ton of adjustability and the ability to fine-tune the interface, and brake widths are easy to change.
  • Other bindings in the class: Look SPX 12, Marker Griffon, Salomon Warden, Tyrolia Attack 13.

Edited to note that the Look Dual Toe pieces are now Gripwalk compatible.
Waiting for comformation from Marker on this. Thank you for bringing it to my attention.
I have skied most of bindings mentioned here and have never had a problem with any of them. I currently own many of them and in the past skied the Salomon 727 on ski patrol and had the Look N77 on a pair of Olin Ballet skis. I have the Salomon 727 on a pair of Rossi St-Comps and would not hesitate to ski them tomorrow if I had to. As Phil states there are many excellent bindings today with great pedigrees.
 
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