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Line Sakana?

DrGT

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Ok, another ski advice thread!

I bought a pair of Renoun Endurance 98 2 years ago. Unfortunately, love is not happening, even after 2 seasons. It is now way too late for their return policy. Somehow, they feel too heavy (I know they are light...) and not "alive" enough for me. They are good to charge hard, but not nimble nor playful enough for my taste elsewhere (trees, moguls). Maybe they are just too long, maybe it's their conception. I haver demo bindings and tried to change the binding position, with no real improvement.

Anyway, I am looking for a versatile ski too play in the tight trees, quite steep bumps, soft snow, but also groomers.
With time and experience, I understood that I seem to prefer short turn radius skis. Like my Armada ARV 116 and my Fischer RC4, 2 skis that I love, but that are not versatile. I love the feeling of carving, especially if it's easy done ;-)
I sometimes like to charge hard, but that's not my main type of skiing.
I think I am an advanced skier, skiing the East on a mountain with quite a bite of snow and rarely ice. I also ski the West once a year.

I came across the Line Sakana and they seem to fit that bill.
Anyone has experience with that ski?
 

GregK

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Have a friend who skis them in soft snow, new snow and loves them in Spring conditions. They love lots of turns and they aren’t a fan of higher speeds or longer turns but a fun, playful ski in softer snow. Huge conversation starter as EVERYONE asks about them when he skis them. Lol
EB37774D-D516-4FF9-A002-36BB6A111E0C.png

Good description here of them I think.
 

Philpug

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Line Sakana
Dimensions: 150-105-138
Radius: 15m@166cm
Sizes: 166, 174, 181
Size tested: 174
Design: All New

Philpug: Yes, this design has been around for a few seasons, but it is the first chance I have had to get on it. Shame on me. Say what you want about Eric Pollard, he is one hell of a skier. He is an artist, he has an accent that can impregnate a women if he so chooses, and he is a great ski designer. We can talk about the Bacons, but there are a dozen good skis that are similar in design; there is nothing out there like the Sakana (other than its brother Pescado). It is a fun ski with a unique personality that was just as good in 12 in. of powder as it was in a wooded bump run.
  • Who is it for? Nothing against Cindy Lauper, but these are for guys who also want to have fun.
  • Who is it not for? The close-minded. The tail could turn some off, which is their loss.
  • Insider tip: These ski their full length and then some. I had a ton of fun on the 174, it never felt lacking.

FairToMiddlin: Kudos to Line for thinking outside the box (sort of like last year’s Rossi Hero Elite Plus Ti). With an unusually spicy sidecut (15m radius in both 174 and 181, says the rep) and a tip-floating swallowtail, it looks anything but ordinary in the One Oh Something class, and would seem to be an exciting ski for talented skiers wanting to slash short-radius turns all over the mountain. Sadly, the engineers didn’t rise to the challenge of the architect, and the construction of the Sakana leaves it feeling a bit numb, with a vague flex that can’t "predictable-ize" the hookiness of the shape. Like a current-gen military fighter jet (F-22, Saab Gripen, et al) that has built-in instability to enhance its quickness, some real tech is needed for the pilot to manage the difference, yet Line just pressed in average materials, and called it good.

At lower speeds, and with an able driver, this ski can provide serious grins. The response of the sidecut when tipping into the turn is something usually reserved for mid-70mm carvers, so you should have a clear idea of what to do next; but when the speed picks up and the going gets tough, the Sakana cannot match the feel and confidence of the One Oh Something golden boys.
  • Who it is for? Skiers looking for the quirky and out-of-the-ordinary will find it here.
  • Who it is not for? Skiers seeking refinement and predictability won’t find it here.
 
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DrGT

DrGT

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Line Sakana
Dimensions: 150-105-138
Radius: 15m@166cm
Sizes: 166, 174, 181
Size tested: 174
Design: All New

Philpug: Yes, this design has been around for a few seasons, but it is the first chance I have had to get on it. Shame on me. Say what you want about Eric Pollard, he is one hell of a skier. He is an artist, he has an accent that can impregnate a women if he so chooses, and he is a great ski designer. We can talk about the Bacons, but there are a dozen good skis that are similar in design; there is nothing out there like the Sakana (other than its brother Pescado). It is a fun ski with a unique personality that was just as good in 12 in. of powder as it was in a wooded bump run.
  • Who is it for? Nothing against Cindy Lauper, but these are for guys who also want to have fun.
  • Who is it not for? The close-minded. The tail could turn some off, which is their loss.
  • Insider tip: These ski their full length and then some. I had a ton of fun on the 174, it never felt lacking.

FairToMiddlin: Kudos to Line for thinking outside the box (sort of like last year’s Rossi Hero Elite Plus Ti). With an unusually spicy sidecut (15m radius in both 174 and 181, says the rep) and a tip-floating swallowtail, it looks anything but ordinary in the One Oh Something class, and would seem to be an exciting ski for talented skiers wanting to slash short-radius turns all over the mountain. Sadly, the engineers didn’t rise to the challenge of the architect, and the construction of the Sakana leaves it feeling a bit numb, with a vague flex that can’t "predictable-ize" the hookiness of the shape. Like a current-gen military fighter jet (F-22, Saab Gripen, et al) that has built-in instability to enhance its quickness, some real tech is needed for the pilot to manage the difference, yet Line just pressed in average materials, and called it good.

At lower speeds, and with an able driver, this ski can provide serious grins. The response of the sidecut when tipping into the turn is something usually reserved for mid-70mm carvers, so you should have a clear idea of what to do next; but when the speed picks up and the going gets tough, the Sakana cannot match the feel and confidence of the One Oh Something golden boys.
  • Who it is for? Skiers looking for the quirky and out-of-the-ordinary will find it here.
  • Who it is not for? Skiers seeking refinement and predictability won’t find it here.

Yeah, saw that. Thank you!
I am looking for a max of info and advice before buying as I cannot try them.
If I had tried the Endurance, I would have not bought them. I gave them a try, but too long for the return policy. My bad.

The FairToMiddlin review frightens me a bit. A don't like words like vague and numb. Numbness (at least to me) is specificaly what I don't like about my Endurance...
But I am not looking for a hard charging tool, just a fun ski.
 

Winks

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I can tell you that the first time I skied the Sakana I immediately took it home with me. It is one of the most unique skis that I have ever been on. It is extremely playful which I did not expect at first but it does not hinder the experience. I will say that its not a ski to charge on or get into rough conditions but it floats well and slashes the hell out of softer snow. Its definitely not a ski where you can rely on the tails, the mount is further back and does not forgive if you get back seat on it. Stay forward and carve away. While I cannot speak much on the vague or numbness that was previously pointed out it does not have a ton of that snap out of a turn feel. It really is quite a difficult ski to describe as I think about writing this.
Some of my final thoughts are that Eric Pollard does not disappoint when it comes to ski designs.
 

Josh Matta

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Tight tree with powder+soft snow+ cream wind buff they could be awesome...I havent skied them. But tight trees with any bit of packed snow, catchy snow, or bump Id be be wary of them as I am all ski with extreme sidecut.

Lots of sidecut only means the skis turns quick when the sidecut can come into play, which is not often in tight trees....

AS you ski the east, some ideas for tight trees skis would be.

Blizzard Bushwacker/brahma Ca - one of the best easy going nimble tree and bump skis out there. The new one has tight radius and feels better on groomers with out giving up the playfulness of the first gen Bushwacker. I ski a brahma its better on harder snow but feels significantly less floatly than the bushwacker for me due to its stiffer flex. If I did not have the E93 I own bushwacker.

Nordica E93/santa Ana 93 - If I had to choose one ski to ski woods with at Stowe Vermont for the rest of my life this would be it. I ski a 185cm @200lb and its floats way better than my 180cm Brahma, its also feels easier to hold an edge on groomers, the long shallow rise tips really do a good job of floating despite is fairly small shape. Where it lack compared to the brahma is how quick it is in off trail hard snow situation, the Brahma is way better than that. If the flex is to much go punk and get the women's skis, you ll get better float and lighter feeling by trading in some hardsnow hold and stability.


I practically live on my E93 as Stowe generally gets ton of days of 4-6 inches of snow, so wood stay soft but not that deep, in fact they are the first ski I willing payed pro form for even though I have better deals on other brands of skis.

any ski I have skied 100mm plus will be much worse on packed snow than the above 2.

My 2 go to though are.

Enforcer 100 - great in light powder even up to feet of snow. I think of the E100 as a powder ski that does nt suck a on groomers but IMO get kinda of meh in skied out stuff, but so does almost everything in this size range.

4frnt Devastor - stupid stiff, really straight, but fully rockers, this odd ball can charge though shitty snow anywhere but especially trees, and is decent on groomers if there is some softness to them, its actually more nimble in skied out stuff than the E100 because despite is long 25m sidecut the ski can pivot at will because of its full rocker.

I would caution about looking at sidecut as indicated of nimbleness though, some of my most nimble soft snow skis are very straight, and on packed snow off trail IMO nimbleness is more about waist width than anything else.
 

Josh Matta

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I can tell you that the first time I skied the Sakana I immediately took it home with me. It is one of the most unique skis that I have ever been on. It is extremely playful which I did not expect at first but it does not hinder the experience. I will say that its not a ski to charge on or get into rough conditions but it floats well and slashes the hell out of softer snow. Its definitely not a ski where you can rely on the tails, the mount is further back and does not forgive if you get back seat on it. Stay forward and carve away. While I cannot speak much on the vague or numbness that was previously pointed out it does not have a ton of that snap out of a turn feel. It really is quite a difficult ski to describe as I think about writing this.
Some of my final thoughts are that Eric Pollard does not disappoint when it comes to ski designs.

do they do well in harder snow and trough lines? got some video of you skiing them?
 

Winks

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Unfortunately I spend more time thinking about skiing than I do thinking about turning on my go-pro for the videos but to answer your question they do not perform all that well on harder snow since they are a softer ski. Not saying they are completely unskiable or anything but they do not inspire confidence in harder or super chopped up snow. The idea for me has always been to bring them out during the softer stuff or spring like snow. I would love to see a burlier built version as the shape and design is unique.
 
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DrGT

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Tight tree with powder+soft snow+ cream wind buff they could be awesome...I havent skied them. But tight trees with any bit of packed snow, catchy snow, or bump Id be be wary of them as I am all ski with extreme sidecut.

Lots of sidecut only means the skis turns quick when the sidecut can come into play, which is not often in tight trees....

AS you ski the east, some ideas for tight trees skis would be.

Blizzard Bushwacker/brahma Ca - one of the best easy going nimble tree and bump skis out there. The new one has tight radius and feels better on groomers with out giving up the playfulness of the first gen Bushwacker. I ski a brahma its better on harder snow but feels significantly less floatly than the bushwacker for me due to its stiffer flex. If I did not have the E93 I own bushwacker.

Nordica E93/santa Ana 93 - If I had to choose one ski to ski woods with at Stowe Vermont for the rest of my life this would be it. I ski a 185cm @200lb and its floats way better than my 180cm Brahma, its also feels easier to hold an edge on groomers, the long shallow rise tips really do a good job of floating despite is fairly small shape. Where it lack compared to the brahma is how quick it is in off trail hard snow situation, the Brahma is way better than that. If the flex is to much go punk and get the women's skis, you ll get better float and lighter feeling by trading in some hardsnow hold and stability.


I practically live on my E93 as Stowe generally gets ton of days of 4-6 inches of snow, so wood stay soft but not that deep, in fact they are the first ski I willing payed pro form for even though I have better deals on other brands of skis.

any ski I have skied 100mm plus will be much worse on packed snow than the above 2.

My 2 go to though are.

Enforcer 100 - great in light powder even up to feet of snow. I think of the E100 as a powder ski that does nt suck a on groomers but IMO get kinda of meh in skied out stuff, but so does almost everything in this size range.

4frnt Devastor - stupid stiff, really straight, but fully rockers, this odd ball can charge though shitty snow anywhere but especially trees, and is decent on groomers if there is some softness to them, its actually more nimble in skied out stuff than the E100 because despite is long 25m sidecut the ski can pivot at will because of its full rocker.

I would caution about looking at sidecut as indicated of nimbleness though, some of my most nimble soft snow skis are very straight, and on packed snow off trail IMO nimbleness is more about waist width than anything else.

Thanks for the info!

Now, why not a Blizzard Rustler 9 or a Nordica Navigator 90?
They appear more playful, less demanding then the Brahma / Enforcer?
I want something playful!
I once tried the Bonafide and while I could ski them, I found they needed to much work
 
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DrGT

DrGT

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I can tell you that the first time I skied the Sakana I immediately took it home with me. It is one of the most unique skis that I have ever been on. It is extremely playful which I did not expect at first but it does not hinder the experience. I will say that its not a ski to charge on or get into rough conditions but it floats well and slashes the hell out of softer snow. Its definitely not a ski where you can rely on the tails, the mount is further back and does not forgive if you get back seat on it. Stay forward and carve away. While I cannot speak much on the vague or numbness that was previously pointed out it does not have a ton of that snap out of a turn feel. It really is quite a difficult ski to describe as I think about writing this.
Some of my final thoughts are that Eric Pollard does not disappoint when it comes to ski designs.


Problem is: I cannot try them around home to make sure that I like this hard to describe feel!
 

Winks

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Problem is: I cannot try them around home to make sure that I like this hard to describe feel!

Totally understand, my only advice would be just to give it a go. You will have a ski very few people know or understand. That also being said I also understand the risk of feeling like you wasted money. As for something more playful it truly depends on the type of ski you want. Twin? no twin? powder specific? all mountain?

Some of my favorites right now are the Fischer Ranger FR 102, Blizzard Rustler 10 or 11 and the Nordica Enforcer 104 free for something slightly burlier. Ultra playful would be Line Blends, Armada ARV 106 and 116 JJ.
 
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DrGT

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Totally understand, my only advice would be just to give it a go. You will have a ski very few people know or understand. That also being said I also understand the risk of feeling like you wasted money. As for something more playful it truly depends on the type of ski you want. Twin? no twin? powder specific? all mountain?

Some of my favorites right now are the Fischer Ranger FR 102, Blizzard Rustler 10 or 11 and the Nordica Enforcer 104 free for something slightly burlier. Ultra playful would be Line Blends, Armada ARV 106 and 116 JJ.

I already have 2019 Armada ARV JJ 116 (Zero series): They are a TON a fun. Even in conditions not made for them, like groomers, relatively high speed, trees and bumps without fresh snow. I love them and am looking for the same feeling in something narrower and more piste oriented
 

Winks

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I already have 2019 Armada ARV JJ 116 (Zero series): They are a TON a fun. Even in conditions not made for them, like groomers, relatively high speed, trees and bumps without fresh snow. I love them and am looking for the same feeling in something narrower and more piste oriented

Fischer Ranger 102 FR or 94 FR
ARV 96 maybe even the 96ti
 

GregK

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@Winks has lots of great skis listed that I think you would like. The Fisher Ranger 102FR and 94FR are a little more traditional feeling for a twin with a stiffer flex as well. The 94FR is like a stiffer Rustler 9 and the 102 FR is like a lighter but stiffer Enforcer 104 Free. The E104 would be more playful and forgiving but with it’s heavier weight, better in crud. The 102FR would have the edge on carving on hard snow though.

Armada AVR 96 or the stiffer and heavier ARV 96Ti are great options for someone who likes the 116. JSkis Master Blaster would be a little more forgiving than the ARV 96Ti but still very stable and damp.

Menace 98 is an old school wide park ski that has very little tip/tail taper, long flat tip/tail rocker and solid but playful flex and weight. Pivots on a dime yet grips when on edge. Very stable at speed and great in crud. Built for fun in trees and bumps. Best compromise of stable but playful with great groomer performance in this width range.
 
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DrGT

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@Winks has lots of great skis listed that I think you would like. The Fisher Ranger 102FR and 94FR are a little more traditional feeling for a twin with a stiffer flex as well. The 94FR is like a stiffer Rustler 9 and the 102 FR is like a lighter but stiffer Enforcer 104 Free. The E104 would be more playful and forgiving but with it’s heavier weight, better in crud. The 102FR would have the edge on carving on hard snow though.

Armada AVR 96 or the stiffer and heavier ARV 96Ti are great options for someone who likes the 116. JSkis Master Blaster would be a little more forgiving than the ARV 96Ti but still very stable and damp.

Menace 98 is an old school wide park ski that has very little tip/tail taper, long flat tip/tail rocker and solid but playful flex and weight. Pivots on a dime yet grips when on edge. Very stable at speed and great in crud. Built for fun in trees and bumps. Best compromise of stable but playful with great groomer performance in this width range.

Well, I am now even more mixed up :)

I once had Fischer Big Stix 98 (twin tip) that I loved everywhere but on piste. I demoed them and it was instantaneous love :))
Very easy and fun, pivots on a dime, soft flex that "follow" the terrain and don't kick you out of the moguls. Il really like the feeling of that ski. The only reason I changed it (in fact, I kept it for my friends who visits me) is that it doesn't carve / hold edge enough, especially when the run gets steep / icy. Still, I want groomer performance, but not a stiff ski. Not an easy choice!
So, the Fischer Ranger 94 FR might be interesting! I might give it a try.

Besides, I can easily try the Rustler and the Fischer, but not the others.
 

GregK

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Well, I am now even more mixed up :)

I once had Fischer Big Stix 98 (twin tip) that I loved everywhere but on piste. I demoed them and it was instantaneous love :)
Very easy and fun, pivots on a dime, soft flex that "follow" the terrain and don't kick you out of the moguls. Il really like the feeling of that ski. The only reason I changed it (in fact, I kept it for my friends who visits me) is that it doesn't carve / hold edge enough, especially when the run gets steep / icy. Still, I want groomer performance, but not a stiff ski. Not an easy choice!
So, the Fischer Ranger 94 FR might be interesting! I might give it a try.

Besides, I can easily try the Rustler and the Fischer, but not the others.

Took a quick look on the Big Stix 98 and looks like a fun ski but don’t think it was as heavy or damp as the Menace 98. Menace would have very good grip for a 100mm twin but not as good as more traditional tailed skis.

Had the Rustler 9 and switched to a longer length Enforcer 93 for better hard snow grip and afternoon crud performance. Try a length in the Enforcer 93 that’s shorter than the Rustler for great edge hold that’s still playful because the E93 is stiffer and heavier. ie 180cm Rustler 9 vs 177cm E93.
Also try the 177cm size E100 as you’ll give up a bit of hard snow edge grip but get a more playful/forgiving tail and more float.

Brahma 88 and the more playful Bushwacker should be demoed (in the same length as the Rustler 9) if harder snow and moguls performance is wanted. They have a great shape for both.
 
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DrGT

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Took a quick look on the Big Stix 98 and looks like a fun ski but don’t think it was as heavy or damp as the Menace 98. Menace would have very good grip for a 100mm twin but not as good as more traditional tailed skis.

Had the Rustler 9 and switched to a longer length Enforcer 93 for better hard snow grip and afternoon crud performance. Try a length in the Enforcer 93 that’s shorter than the Rustler for great edge hold that’s still playful because the E93 is stiffer and heavier. ie 180cm Rustler 9 vs 177cm E93.
Also try the 177cm size E100 as you’ll give up a bit of hard snow edge grip but get a more playful/forgiving tail and more float.

Brahma 88 and the more playful Bushwacker should be demoed (in the same length as the Rustler 9) if harder snow and moguls performance is wanted. They have a great shape for both.


The reviews about the E100 are very tempting. Playful in the trees and bumps, yet a good carver, even at speed. Doesn't need to be hard charging all the time, but can handle it and deliver if you want. Great.
Now, what length? I am 5'8" 165 lbs. Pretty good skier, moderately agressive.
I own a pair of Renoun Endurance 98. I was hesitating between 169 and 178 cm and ultimately went for the 178, but I think I would have been better win the 169 cm ... My Armada ARV 116 are 176 cm and are perfect for me, event with all that rocker.
I don't want to do the same mistake again ... Between too short and too long, I now choose too short!
 

GregK

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Sounds like you might have been on too long of a size on that ski for your size and aggressiveness level. What size are your big Stix? If they weren’t the 176cm size and just the 166cm, that would be too short on those which would explain why you didn’t love them.

I’d try both the Enforcer 93 and E100 in the 169cm size, Brahma maybe 166cm and 173cm, Bushwacker in 173cm, Menace 98 in 175cm.
 
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DrGT

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Sounds like you might have been on too long of a size on that ski for your size and aggressiveness level. What size are your big Stix? If they weren’t the 176cm size and just the 166cm, that would be too short on those which would explain why you didn’t love them.

I’d try both the Enforcer 93 and E100 in the 169cm size, Brahma maybe 166cm and 173cm, Bushwacker in 173cm, Menace 98 in 175cm.

My Big Stix is a 176 and is fine. My son has the 166 and I have tried it: it is more fun, but floats less, which is not really a problem since I have a dedicated powder ski that happens to be fun!
 

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