Kore 105 as a touring ski?

[Rod9301]

You should think about the entire safety shirt off a binding.

The shift is much more prone to pre releases then the mtn, which as far as i know had none. Because the toe springs on the mtn are really strong.

Also, the bit rests on the brakes, so there's a pretty solid connection boot to ski.

 

[Slim]

You should think about the entire safety shirt off a binding.

The shift is much more prone to pre releases then the mtn, which as far as i know had none. Because the toe springs on the mtn are really strong.

Also, the bit rests on the brakes, so there's a pretty solid connection boot to ski.

The problem with the MTN with brakes is that it won't release properly. When Alpin tested them, they were unable to get a proper release torque, no matter which spring they used, when they had the brake installed. Without brakes installed, it worked properly.
So, I wouldn't pick a MTN if I wanted brakes. It also is heavier than most when you add brakes. Nice binding without brakes.

 

[Alexzn]

Do not look for the quiver, let the quiver find you...

Trust me, I met that quiver more than I care to admit... .

 

[Alexzn]

The problem with the MTN with brakes is that it won't release properly. When Alpin tested them, they were unable to get a proper release torque, no matter which spring they used, when they had the brake installed. Without brakes installed, it worked properly.
So, I wouldn't pick a MTN if I wanted brakes. It also is heavier than most when you add brakes. Nice binding without brakes.

Interesting article. They conclude that for any guarantee on safety you need to go to at least something like a Kingpin, none of the lightweight Pin bindings they tested passed their test with brakes. As a side comment, there is not a lot of weight difference between Shift and Kingpin, although I think Kingpin has a lot more metal parts.

 

[jmeb]

Interesting article. They conclude that for any guarantee on safety you need to go to at least something like a Kingpin, none of the lightweight Pin bindings they tested passed their test with brakes. As a side comment, there is not a lot of weight difference between Shift and Kingpin, although I think Kingpin has a lot more metal parts.

Don't take TUV certification to be end all and be all -- the truth is much more complex. TUV is a for-profit certification company, that test devices to meet various DIN/ISO standards. In all cases referenced, the standard TUV is testing to is DIN/ISO standard specific to ski touring bindings and not at all like the alpine binding standards. More indepth here: https://www.wildsnow.com/14843/din-iso-13992-binding-release-safety-testing-summary/

Interesting, it sounds like TUV doesn't even offer a current test: https://fritschi.swiss/en/faq_category/safety-en-4/ . Which is why previous iterations of bindings like the Vipec were "certified" and now they are not. Despite the fact -- if anything has changed -- they've gotten safer.

The shift does have a lot more (carbon-infused) plastic. Because it has a much larger (and more complex) toe piece in order to provide an alpine interface to the boot.

 

[Alexzn]

Don't take TUV certification to be end all and be all -- the truth is much more complex. TUV is a for-profit certification company, that test devices to meet various DIN/ISO standards. In all cases referenced, the standard TUV is testing to is DIN/ISO standard specific to ski touring bindings and not at all like the alpine binding standards. More indepth here: https://www.wildsnow.com/14843/din-iso-13992-binding-release-safety-testing-summary/

Interesting, it sounds like TUV doesn't even offer a current test: https://fritschi.swiss/en/faq_category/safety-en-4/ . Which is why previous iterations of bindings like the Vipec were "certified" and now they are not. Despite the fact -- if anything has changed -- they've gotten safer.

The shift does have a lot more (carbon-infused) plastic. Because it has a much larger (and more complex) toe piece in order to provide an alpine interface to the boot.

True. I think Shift is the only non-frame AT binding that is DIN-certified.

it is complicated. I know that people like Cody Townsend ski in minimalist AT bindings on gnarly lines, and I (and most people on this board) are no Cody Townsend... However the counterpoint is that if Cody wipes out he usually has to deal with a much wider spectrum of consequences and would usually prefer that his ski stays on his feet almost no matter what. So, I suspect he does not give a damn about whether his bindings are DIN certified or not, as long as they are bombproof and light.

 

[Rod9301]

And the release settings are so conservatives that is VERY unlikely you will break a bone before the bindings release.

It's unfortunate that we have some guys, like the knee binding inventor, that keep taking about various ways to break bones, without looking at real life experiences.

And pre releases with bad outcomes can happen to everyone, not just Cody

 

[Alexzn]

And the release settings are so conservatives that is VERY unlikely you will break a bone before the bindings release.

It's unfortunate that we have some guys, like the knee binding inventor, that keep taking about various ways to break bones, without looking at real life experiences.

And pre releases with bad outcomes can happen to everyone, not just Cody

I am actually not sure about that. I have seen more than a few cases of broken bones when the binding didn't work as intended. For various reasons of course, including other equipment deficiencies (poor fitting boots, etc). Sometimes binding is poorly adjusted and does not work as intended, sometimes a user screws up by over tightening it. No device is 100% fool-proof, especially complicated mechanical safety devices used by general public .

P.S. And I think Cody makes damn sure that he does not have a pre-release. In his line of work any fall can have dire consequences.

 

[dcs24]

I have a Kore 117 with Kingpins for my primary backcountry setup. It's not the lightest setup in the world, but if I'm doing the work to climb a mountain I want to optimize for the best snow. Even the 117s are so light that I find it totally reasonable for daylong backcountry excursions, and they rip on the way down.
FWIW I've seen other people out in the Tahoe backcountry with the exact same setup. If you go with a 105 I'd imagine you'll have a (slightly) easier climb up, at the price of a (slightly) less exhilarating trip down if the snow is fresh.

 

[Ron]

reading and learning, thanks folks.