Interesting CNN article about downhill training

[Sibhusky]

CNN: American downhillers: A need for speed.
https://www.cnn.com/2018/11/16/spor...wnhill-coach-john-mcbride-spt-intl/index.html

It involves way more than skiing.

 

[HardDaysNight]

I wonder what the track record of hypothermia (long periods in ice water until turning blue) and cerebral hypoxia (holding breath under water until passing out) in developing downhill racers actually is. Do Svindal or Janssrud do this? How about Paris, Innerhofer and Meier? If they don’t then perhaps focusing on more traditional coaching elements, such as line choice, great gliding and not opening up in the air, might be more fruitful.

The idea that these bizarre regimes actually lead to team cohesion that improves results seems far fetched to say the least.

 

[KevinF]

I read the article and all I could think about -- to @HardDaysNight point -- was that these training methods sound like a lawsuit waiting to happen.

I agree that mental toughness is a key component to elite athletic performance, but I'd also think that there are ways to develop that trait that don't draw parallels to the Spanish Inquisition.

 

[HardDaysNight]

I read the article and all I could think about -- to @HardDaysNight point -- was that these training methods sound like a lawsuit waiting to happen.

I agree that mental toughness is a key component to elite athletic performance, but I'd also think that there are ways to develop that trait that don't draw parallels to the Spanish Inquisition.

“Our main element is fear, fear and surprise. Our two main elements are...”

Also, just to be sensible, if one has not developed a high degree of mental toughness by the time one has ascended to the USST’s downhill squad then it might be too late for made-for-reality TV strategies.

 

[Corgski]

This sort of training seems to reflect thinking that was popular more than thirty years ago. All research that I have seen points to specificity in training (@HardDaysNight's point) and suggest transferability of benefits from very different activities does not exist for those already at a high level performance.

There is the possibility that this was just a small diversion from their usual training, after all these guys do the same thing year after year. There may be space for doing something that is challenging in a different way. My inclination for now is not to take the article too seriously, the context could easily have been misrepresented.

 

[Ross Biff]

This sort of training seems to reflect thinking that was popular more than thirty years ago. All research that I have seen points to specificity in training (@HardDaysNight's point) and suggest transferability of benefits from very different activities does not exist for those already at a high level performance.

There is the possibility that this was just a small diversion from their usual training, after all these guys do the same thing year after year. There may be space for doing something that is challenging in a different way. My inclination for now is not to take the article too seriously, the context could easily have been misrepresented.

Context is everything and the reality TV reference brings to mind sneaky editing of promo's with little regard for context. It does sound a little like it could come from the coach Gene Hackman and racer Robert Redford era!

 

[Primoz]

Honestly, I'm not sure how much of this is really true and how much is just fictional to make it sound much cooler then it really is. I believe special forces training camps have some reason... for army. But skiing is still "just" sport and methods you need to make someone dumb, without any will or need for his own thinking and making him machine who will obey orders regardless on what they are, has very little to do with what you need in sport. So personally I don't think killing someone personality and his way of thinking with methods they use during army boot camps are needed to develop "next Body Miller".
There's whole bunch of researches out proving, even for team sports, which skiing isn't, that such drills have zero or even negative effect on athletes and their "team spirit", and instead of building up better athlete and better team, you end up with fuc**ked up team and destroyed athlete. I doubt US coaches are stupid, so I would say this is pretty much just a PR stunt or tv story or whatever should be called, and not what they really do

 

[Corgski]

It does sound a little like it could come from the coach Gene Hackman and racer Robert Redford era!

Obviously not appropriate for the female athletes, they follow more of a Jane Fonda style routine:



I love retro style marketing, I just hope its effective with the younger crowd...

 

[ScotsSkier]

Fake news...

 

[Pete in Idaho]

Interesting opinions. Highly trained, i.e., Navy Seals aren't mindless robots that will do anything they are brainwashed into believing. There are obviously exceptions to the rule but who would you rather have on YOUR team, a highly trained razor sharp person who performs at the highest level or ....................... who doesn't.

 

[Primoz]

@Pete in Idaho I assume that was question for me, as I mentioned that What team are we talking about? Team who would carry me out of danger zone while being shoot at? Or team that would fight for Olympic gold? In first case definitely some special forces guys (not necessarily Navy Seals as in training they have with other special op forces from around the world, they don't really perform that great, that I would want to trust them my life , but if we are talking about team that would fight for Olympics gold, I certainly wouldn't want to have anyone who would ever be close to any kind of army training But that's just me, some might pick different, and if anything in this article is really true, US coach would certainly pick different then me... not sure results show BS like this is necessary to win WC race

 

[Started at 53]

Fake news...

Beat me to it

 

[BGreen]

"Alpine skiing is a European sport, so there's a different cultural piece there, with different support from the community and national level.

"The financial piece is always a challenge. In this country it's an extremely expensive sport and it's tough for families to make that their primary goal in life to support their children in ski racing.”

There it is.

 

[Primoz]

@BGreen it's not any different anywhere else. 20 or 30 years ago things were different, and you could be training basically for free. Honestly, I don't remember I (or actually my parents) would need to pay for for single pair of skis, or boots or poles, and even less some coaching fee. And that went up to my 26 or 27th year when I quit, even though I was never in World cup team. Today, things are different, and costs of season for U10 is some 5-6000eur. Cost of season for someone around 20 and not in A team is somewhere between 15 and 20.000eur. In last 2 or 3 years, at least WC team members don't need to pay anything, but before that, they still needed to pay some 7 to 8000eur/season. Considering average salary in Slovenia is around 1100eur netto, you can imagine who can afford to pay 10.000eur/season for their kid Same thing goes for pretty much every other European country, including Austria. Yes even in Austria days when everything was free and kids at 13 got their first contracts with ski companies are over. Now if you are in B or C team in Austria, you need to pay your share.

 

[Pete in Idaho]

@Pete in Idaho I assume that was question for me, as I mentioned that What team are we talking about? Team who would carry me out of danger zone while being shoot at? Or team that would fight for Olympic gold? In first case definitely some special forces guys (not necessarily Navy Seals as in training they have with other special op forces from around the world, they don't really perform that great, that I would want to trust them my life , but if we are talking about team that would fight for Olympics gold, I certainly wouldn't want to have anyone who would ever be close to any kind of army training But that's just me, some might pick different, and if anything in this article is really true, US coach would certainly pick different then me... not sure results show BS like this is necessary to win WC race

Probably but not necessarily.