Instructor might quit because he still sucks at skiing.

[Blue Streak]

Instructor might quit because he still sucks at skiing.

Just a reminder: we all suck, but some of us aspire to "suck at a higher level" (homage to Bergie).
Sounds like you would fit right in.

 

[Wendy]

I taught at Bear Creek in PA for 2 seasons. I feel your pain. However, we had a very good ski school with a very involved (sometimes, too involved) technical director. There were instructor clinics at 7:30AM on weekends and weekdays (instructors got on snow before the mountain opened up) and most evenings. So, it was easy to find a clinic if it fit your schedule. We had clinics specifically geared towards those pursuing their Level I, II, and III certifications.

However......if you are (and you are) a working adult like I am, it was very difficult to get enough free-skiing/practice time outside of my ski work schedule. I had to be available every weekend, especially holiday weekends and two nights a week. With a very demanding high school teaching job, this was difficult, and I was exhausted and sick most of the winter. Despite loving my colleagues at Bear Creek, and generally enjoying the work, I had to quit to preserve my sanity. Plus....I taught all day every weekday (chemistry)...then I'd go and spend my time off teaching again (even though it was skiing, that much teaching can be tiring).

Some posters here have recommended taking PSIA clinics. While this is good advice, it's difficult when one is working full-time. It was nearly impossible for me, since most clinics are offered during weekdays and I couldn't take school days off to do them. During one year when I was on sabbatical, I took a few. They were good, but....

I have found that my skiing improved more AFTER I stopped teaching, because I simply had more time to practice and ski more varied terrain. Taking clinic after clinic isn't that productive if you don't have time to really practice and internalize what was taught, IMHO. Since there's so much muscle memory involved, that takes a lot of repetition.

So, for the @VAski , I think you need to ask yourself what you want out of your teaching experience. If it is primarily to improve your skiing, I think there's better ways of doing that (given especially the lack of training and mentorship on your hill). If you really enjoy the teaching part, perhaps find another mountain to work at, if that's possible.

Personally, I feel that PSIA is more geared towards people who do not have other full time jobs, unless you are entering as an already very advanced skier. The training time and learning curve don't mesh well with full-time job and family responsibilities. Something has to give.

 

[VAski]

I definitely do. I wish you lots of luck. I know others who haven't been as happy at teaching. I also know people who find it very fulfilling and have had their skiing taken to much higher levels. If it's not fun for you then perhaps taking a break isn't a bad idea. However, as someone said above, if you feel it's something you are good at then we need you so don't give up. I've always been told that the best way to get better at skiing is to teach someone how to do it. Do you primarily teach kids or adults. I've had the opportunity to teach both and definitely love each for different reasons. Does your mountain give you a preference? Are they strict with your hours. Perhaps you can segue to another mountain and see which works best for you. While I loved the mountain where I started, I like my vermont much better for a variety of reasons. Mentors at both mountains have made huge difference for me. I like to always think there are options. Can you talk about any of this with the director of your ski school or perhaps one of the supervisors, maybe they can help?

I suppose everyone has different motivations for being an instructor. I was recruited with the idea that my skiing would improve. I really had no idea what it meant to be an instructor or what it entailed.

Instructing has been enjoyable. The moment you see someone get it or the light turns on is worth all the effort. It's a part that I can definitely get better at, but I think I'm pretty decent what I do. There are definitely better and worse instructors at my mountain. I believe I fall somewhere in the middle.

I teach level 1 - 6 students. I would say the majority of my lessons are probably level 2, 3 and 4's. That includes adults and children. The very youngest children (3's and 4's) are a challenge for me, but I do have success with them. Our mountain does give you a choice, or should I say age ranges, but when it's busy... everyone is working. They are pretty strict with the hours. If you have signed up to work, you are expected to be there. They don't like "day offs".

Funny you mentioned Vermont. I thought about helping out at Mt. Snow last year when the call for help with the Brits went out. Probably should have done it, but was already scheduled to work at my local hill.

 

[at_nyc]

I was recruited with the idea that my skiing would improve.

While many reported improvement of their own skiing from becoming an instructor, I suspect if you dump the same number of hour into purposely skiing, you’ll improve even more.

I also did 2 season of instructing nd quit. My reason for quitting wasn’t from anything negative. Just simply I can’t find enough time.

I did improve my own skiing as a result. But a lot of it actually came from skiing the right way. I know my students (especially kids) were copying my every move. So I make sure I don’t cheat with lazy skidded turns, even if I was just getting from point A to point B. Day in and day out of that, it started to replace my old bad habits!

 

[surfsnowgirl]

I became an instructor at my home mountain at the time because I saw an poster that they were looking for instructors and would give you free training. I admit my reasons for doing were twofold. I love teaching people and share my enthusiasm of skiing. I get a lot of satisfaction from seeing someone get that light in their eyes when they get something. I also wanted to improve my own skiing and I'd read that teaching was the best way to do that. I too had no idea how busy I'd be and all that teaching entailed. I was very enthusiastic my first season. Last season I was still enthusiastic but tired because it's taxing being run all over the place. I admit to not getting a whole lot from clinics my first 2 years at my home mountain because once we got busy the clinics seem to have fallen by the wayside. I was lucky to have a couple senior instructors, one of them is a Level 3 who sort of adopted me and spent hours of one on one time with me. I'm grateful for every second of the experience. I know I'm also lucky because the mountains where I work just ask us to give them a schedule. We tell them when we can work and turn in our schedules at the beginning of the season.

One thing that was always important to me is I didn't want to instruct every weekend. I like to ski other places and just have fun and I'm grateful to have found a balance for that. I wanted to teach in vermont but I also didn't want to bite the hand that fed me so I stayed at my home mountain while I tested the waters at the other mountain where I ski a lot. I love teaching there a lot, more in fact so next year I'll just teach in Vermont. I'll give them a little more of my time but I'm very adamant about having personal skiing time so I'll still structure my schedule to allow for plenty of other weekends elsewhere.

Sounds like you enjoy instructing and that's great. I like what you said "Instructing has been enjoyable. The moment you see someone get it or the light turns on is worth all the effort. It's a part that I can definitely get better at, but I think I'm pretty decent what I do. There are definitely better and worse instructors at my mountain. I believe I fall somewhere in the middle".

Seems like you like teaching and are good at it so perhaps another mountain would be a better fit for you to meet your needs.

I remember that PSIA email about the Brits coming to mount snow. I was tempted as well.

 

[PTskier]

If you enjoy what you're doing, keep doing it. Go elsewhere for improvement...like post videos here or find a weekend clinic somewhere when you take time off your teaching hill. (On a side note, I've found way too many PSIA clinicians, even on the division payroll, to be poor instructors. They were born with the physical ability to easily pass the exams. They don't understand what they're demonstrating, don't understand why it is difficult for others, don't know how to get we klutzes to accomplish what they show us. And, I've worked with a few, very few, excellent clinicians.)

If you pass L2, would any pay increase more than cover the cost of the exams? If not, forget about L2.

 

[LiquidFeet]

....
Funny you mentioned Vermont. I thought about helping out at Mt. Snow last year when the call for help with the Brits went out. Probably should have done it, but was already scheduled to work at my local hill.

Before signing up to teach Brits at a mountain where you're not already an employee, check out the workmen's comp situation should you get injured while teaching, and the liability coverage should one of your teenage charges get injured and the parents sue you and the mountain. If the mountain comps your work with a season pass and don't actually pay you money, and if they don't do the social security thing, they probably don't cover your injuries nor your liability. Just check.

At one of the mountains where I have worked, the number of injuries on the mountain is multiplied by a big number when the Brits show up. Ski patrol gets to do their thing more often.

 

[crgildart]

What is it that you want to improve about hour skiing? If you want to improve your own skiing and ski schools in our area aren't offering avenues to do so then maybe you are right in quitting. I doubt that you "suck at skiing" though if you passed the L1s.. The bar is still fairly high to get hired by most ski schools isn't it? You may not be able to consistently lay down Platinum NASTAR runs but I highly doubt you are slower than Silver on a bad day.

Either you aren't putting in enough time to get better, you're not skiing with the right people to get better, or there is some gear problem like cant being off which keeps a really good skier from being a fantastic skier. The regular Thursday night instructor clinics helped my skiing every bit as much as the ski team coaching did the other nights of the week when I lived near a ski hill.

If the clinics aren't offered, perhaps check out some camps with coaching or other mentoring options discussed. But, ya, if your ski school isn't helping with that the only other reason to teach is financial.. gear discounts and free skiing. Visiting L1 can get you a free ticket at some of the places I ski around here. Other than that I'd probably also be looking to leave your current gig.

 

[VAski]

Before signing up to teach Brits at a mountain where you're not already an employee, check out the workmen's comp situation should you get injured while teaching, and the liability coverage should one of your teenage charges get injured and the parents sue you and the mountain. If the mountain comps your work with a season pass and don't actually pay you money, and if they don't do the social security thing, they probably don't cover your injuries nor your liability. Just check.

At one of the mountains where I have worked, the number of injuries on the mountain is multiplied by a big number when the Brits show up. Ski patrol gets to do their thing more often.

hmmmm.... hadn't thought of that. Glad you mentioned something. Makes sense about ski patrol.

 

[VAski]

What is it that you want to improve about hour skiing? If you want to improve your own skiing and ski schools in our area aren't offering avenues to do so then maybe you are right in quitting. I doubt that you "suck at skiing" though if you passed the L1s.. The bar is still fairly high to get hired by most ski schools isn't it? You may not be able to consistently lay down Platinum NASTAR runs but I highly doubt you are slower than Silver on a bad day.

Either you aren't putting in enough time to get better, you're not skiing with the right people to get better, or there is some gear problem like cant being off which keeps a really good skier from being a fantastic skier. The regular Thursday night instructor clinics helped my skiing every bit as much as the ski team coaching did the other nights of the week when I lived near a ski hill.

If the clinics aren't offered, perhaps check out some camps with coaching or other mentoring options discussed. But, ya, if your ski school isn't helping with that the only other reason to teach is financial.. gear discounts and free skiing. Visiting L1 can get you a free ticket at some of the places I ski around here. Other than that I'd probably also be looking to leave your current gig.

I need help in bumps. I haven't skied them a lot. I feel as though I have plenty of groomer time at work and with the family on vacation. The bumps or anything with variety is calling me. If I could check off that box, I'd suck less.

I wish you were there to witness my level 1 exam. Trust me, the bar isn't very high for that exam (at least at mine.) We had one instructor that had only ever skied a black slope once or twice before. The bar isn't very high to get a job either. I'd have to think about this for a second, but I think they might hire someone fresh out of a wedge that could somewhat consistently ski parallel. Could be wrong, but I'm probably not far off.

Well, the gear discounts are nice and there is some free skiing thrown in there.

 

[surfsnowgirl]

I need help in bumps too. I just started skiing bumps last season and spring bumps at that. At this point that's enough bump fun for me. My level 1 exam in Sugarbush was an entirely different animal. Everyone in my exam group was an excellent skier, a couple of them were experts. We skied with our examiner who was very tough and it was 2 days of blood sweat and tears. I took it as an intense 2 day clinic and whatever happened happened. I learned A LOT. I'm not saying it was ridiculously hard but a friend of mine recently told me they'd upped the anti on the level 1 and that it wasn't as easy as it used to be. As far as getting hired, I'm an intermediate skier but I had to ski in clinics for 2 days with my bosses and supervisors at both my mountains before I was even hired. Perhaps these things vary depending on where the exam/school is. The gear discounts and free skiing is indeed nice. I'll take the lunchtime discounts too . I only teach part time and make sure I have plenty of time for free skiing at other mountains. I'm adamant on maintaining that balance between teaching and free skiing so that neither instructing or my personal growth suffers.
My favorite part of teach might just be beer o'clock at the end of the work day.

 

[Mike King]

I think you should consider three things: your objectives, your time, and your opportunities.

I started instructing to become a better skier. I had recently retired, had the time, and had what I thought was a good opportunity: teaching part-time at Breckenridge. Teaching part-time allowed time for my own self-coaching and training. But I didn't figure out how to sign up for the training at Breck, nor did I find the few training sessions available to be that useful.

When I had the opportunity to teach part-time in Aspen, I jumped for it. The training here is incredible. I've managed to have more training hours than teaching hours in each of the three seasons I've been here. The terrain is great, and I often ski with other instructors/trainers outside of training to work on my skiing.

I've also discovered that I enjoy teaching. Well, part-time teaching, that is. There is something special about sharing your passion with others.

But, back to the question, is teaching the pathway to ski improvement? It can be. But it also can be a diversion as well.

Josh Fogg, our training manager and a demo team member, thinks that training for Level 3 can be a slow path to ski performance improvement. That's because there's a bunch of work that isn't really relevant to improving one's own skiing. Learning to teach skiing, formulating a lesson plan, and even some elements of movement analysis might be a distraction.

All of this is a round about discussion to come to the point: what's your objective in teaching? If what you really care about is improving your skiing, then I'd fully suggest that you quit teaching and invest the time and effort into working on that. Find a coach who connects with you. Buy private lessons with the coach. And turn your effort into serious training to focus on improving your deficiencies. Invest your time wisely.

If you see a payoff from teaching that is separate from your own skiing, then the suggestions above are appropriate.

Good luck on your journey!

Mike

 

[T-Square]

If you enjoy what you're doing, keep doing it. Go elsewhere for improvement...like post videos here or find a weekend clinic somewhere when you take time off your teaching hill. (On a side note, I've found way too many PSIA clinicians, even on the division payroll, to be poor instructors. They were born with the physical ability to easily pass the exams. They don't understand what they're demonstrating, don't understand why it is difficult for others, don't know how to get we klutzes to accomplish what they show us. And, I've worked with a few, very few, excellent clinicians.)

If you pass L2, would any pay increase more than cover the cost of the exams? If not, forget about L2.

Sorry to hear you had a bad experience. I’ve found PSIA clinics to be the complete opposite otherwise I would not have participated in around 100 or so over the past 20 years. During those clinics I’ve never had a bad clinician.

Now, back to the discussion at hand.

 

[crgildart]

I need help in bumps. I haven't skied them a lot. I feel as though I have plenty of groomer time at work and with the family on vacation. The bumps or anything with variety is calling me. If I could check off that box, I'd suck less.
.

Take a week and check out one of those Chuck Martin Mogul Logic Camps at WP/MJ. I think there may also be some weekend camps up at Sugarloaf if you can't venture west.

 

[mdf]

I'm not an instructor, but I remember people talking about Pro-Jam.
https://www.psia-e.org/ev/feature-events/masters-academy-snow-pro-jam/
For example,
Event -- Open To -- Dates -- Cost
Alpine Snow Pro Jam -- Reg, Level I or II Members -- December 11-15, 2017 -- $465
Alpine Level II Skiing College -- Level I (With Director’s Signature) -- December 11-15, 2017 -- $465

That's cheaper than anything open to the general public.

 

[jimmy]

Been there. I used to say that the Alpine Level 1 was the only pin that you earned after they gave it to you. Don't quit now; I'll bet you are a much better skier/instructor now than you were four years ago.

You do need a mentor.

You need a clear understanding of what needs to be better in your skiing and the best time to practice is while you are in a lesson with novice skiers. Don't worry about how long it's been. It took me five years from the first Exam Prep to passing part 2 and trust me my skiing probably had way farther to go than yours.

You don't say which mountain in Mid-Atlantic you work at, not that it matters. I taught three days per week at Timberline for nine years. I am working two days at Canaan Valley Resort and a day at Tline this year. Timberline had an unbelievable training program when Bobby Snyder was the director. Full time technical director, three Area Resort Trainers and the workload gave us time to ski err, Clinic . It was nice while it lasted. Canaan has a great teaching area with a magic carpet, segregated triple lift and beginner terrain, good clientele and a Director who is all about quality lessons, training and having fun. Don't know if Tucker County WV is the wrong direction for you but let me know if you want to check us out.

Someone mentioned boot fit don't let that hold you back.

@mdf mentioned ProJam. Time and money but they have bumps at Killington and they know how to use them. Top notch coaching, you could take a five day skiing prep, you could take Level 2 College (with your director's approval). I think you'd know what to work on and how by the time it's over

Speaking of your director, can/have you taken your concern to her/him?

I think that if this was just about your personal skiing you would have been gone already. We get such a thrill when a student get's it, it is addicting and you will miss the thrill, we both know it.

Good luck!!

 

[Josh Matta]

I think what a lot of instructor miss, is that when skiing at other skill levels it should be YOUR skiing at their skill level. Learning body awareness while teaching should lead to better skiing at the instructors skill level.

If you can do a L3 passing wedge turn your actually skiing will not be that bad......

 

[KevinF]

I think what a lot of instructor miss, is that when skiing at other skill levels it should be YOUR skiing at their skill level. Learning body awareness while teaching should lead to better skiing at the instructors skill level.

If you can do a L3 passing wedge turn your actually skiing will not be that bad......

Can you clarify what you mean by the bolded part? Do you mean if you're teaching a "level 3" student that you're making "level 9 precision movements to mimic a level 3 turn"?

 

[Josh Matta]

yes that is what I mean but it goes beyond

A L3 is a wedge turner who we are looking to get to matched skis... so they will be skiing somewhere between a Wedge, spontaneous parallel and open parallel.

While demoing the above turns I want to ensure the 5 fundamentals are in my wedge turns, and I make them look like skiing, and not like a demo. I will be directing balance towards the outside ski, I will be moving my body with my outside skis do it does nt look stally or like I am posing. I will make sure my legs are turning and tipping under a stable upper body(for the pedantic that is pelvis bone upwards).

Bob Barnes said it best "wedge turns are the embryonic turns of future expert skiers"

 

[wutangclan]

Let me offer another possibility: you've actually improved, but because you've matured as an instructor, you've become more aware of your own deficiencies and thus your perception of your own ability has worsened. In other words, you're in the middle of the curve of the infamous Dunning-Kruger effect. So cheer up ... it can only get better from here.