California/Nevada I80 to Squaw this coming Sunday?

[skinavy]

Coronas of assorted varieties aside, we're flying in to Sacramento late Saturday evening, plan for now is to drive to Squaw early Sunday... which seems like it will coincide with a fairly nice dump. Yes we are renting a 4WD. I hope a saving grace is that fewer people will be making the same drive on a Sunday, vs Saturday, although it seems like there's a lot of pent up demand for any freshies out there right now.
We'll be staying in Tahoe City for a full week (doing the Ikon-Epic swing through) - no FOMO - plenty of time to circle back and hit up something we passed by earlier.

Questions for the learned locals, if I may:
- As the weather is setting up now, for that Sunday specifically, do you recommend Squaw or Alpine (or even N*)? Looking for crowd/liftline avoidance; it's our 1st trip to Tahoe so I suspect we will find cool stuff anywhere we go.
- What can we expect road/traffic wise on 80? Seems like Donner Pass is the primary bugaboo- what other sporty spots can we expect? - How's the comparison vs I70 on the Denver-Summit county run?
- We've got CalTrans and CHP Truckee facebook bookmarked and ready to check; how quickly do they react and update status?
- Traction laws seem similar to CO and UT; is the specific requirement for M+S tires on 4WD also? This may be a challenge on a rental out of Sac, probably only have "all season."
- This seems like a "small" storm by Tahoe standards; when does CHP start shutting stuff down?

Many thanks in advance!

 

[raytseng]

Answered inline

Questions for the learned locals, if I may:
- As the weather is setting up now, for that Sunday specifically, do you recommend Squaw or Alpine (or even N*)? Looking for crowd/liftline avoidance; it's our 1st trip to Tahoe so I suspect we will find cool stuff anywhere we go.

Cannot tell, it maybe good everywhere it maybe a bust. The 3 resorts have tradeoffs.
Northstar is lowest elevation so potential rain or least snow, but most protected for wind closures.
Squaw has higher elevation but may not open, but best terrain if it can be covered.
alpine has fewer lifts and less awesome terrain than squaw but best chance more is opened.
If you want to throw in sugarbowl: not on ikon/epic and on west side of crest so potential for most snow.

Ski where you want to ski. if its very terrible pull the trigger to move resorts even midday.

If skiing sunday during the storm, warning it maybe very challenging since you don't know the layouts and vis maybe poor.

- What can we expect road/traffic wise on 80? Seems like Donner Pass is the primary bugaboo- what other sporty spots can we expect? - How's the comparison vs I70 on the Denver-Summit county run?

Also cannot tell. if the trucks get stopped and they all decide to wait until daylight to roll, the backup may long. If people crash it may stop. bring supplies including patience and podcasts.

- We've got CalTrans and CHP Truckee facebook bookmarked and ready to check; how quickly do they react and update status?
decently quickly. download or bookmark caltrans quickmaps site as well. use both the chaincontrol and chp layer. the chp layer is direct feed of dispatch so is as real time as you get, but is more for accidents and hard to decipher.

- Traction laws seem similar to CO and UT; is the specific requirement for M+S tires on 4WD also? This may be a challenge on a rental out of Sac, probably only have "all season."
You can just check that it has good (full) tread. Allseason / oem tires count as m+s. use good judgement, ultimately you need to not crash.

- This seems like a "small" storm by Tahoe standards; when does CHP start shutting stuff down?
Forecast timing may change.
chain controls will go up quickly, and will likely be up in Sunday, especially since snow is forecast SAT overnight. As reference they had controls even for the 4inches ministorm last Saturday.
the question is exact timings how warm the storm may come in and if Sunday daylight will have decent vis and warmth from the sun so people crash less. The saving grace is this is not a huge storm series, so roads are starting dry and don't have a crust of frozen ice on them from a storm series.

 

[Eleeski]

In a storm, the lower mountain at Squaw is the best bet. One hour of powder (and lines) then fun crud and soft bumps for the rest of the usually mellow crowds day. The lower mountain is well protected from wind and holds the best terrain - anywhere.

I've had fun long lasting powder at Homewood. Rose gets windy but is higher if it's a warm storm.

Tahoe is a fantastic area. With a good refresh, you are assured of a good time.

Eric

 

[SSSdave]

If storm timelines remain like they are now, I would not bet even money on Sunday morning at mid storm, driving I80 given usual mayhem from18 wheelers getting over Donner Pass. On the positive, all roads are currently quite dry and so warm that it will take a fair amount of cold air and snow before it begins to pile up. In any case, given the pent up hunger from lack of fresh powder days, and it being a weekend, many Reno/Carson City skiers will be driving up at the same time in the opposite direction of I80 that rarely closes that may make the last SR89 highway miles painfully frustrating.

Since you note Epic too, a fallback plan could be to take US50 from Sacramento to South Lake Tahoe and ski Heavenly because that highway tends to stay open and has far fewer big trucks. If Heavenly, ski the Nevada side and consider parking at the Boulder parking lot that is almost always near empty. Although a longer drive, that gets you to the wind protected side of the resort where there is much more powder tree skiing whereas California side lifts sometimes close due to wind and visibility. After skiing, you would need to drive around the lake CCW to Tahoe City to your accommodations where I would recommend skiing Northstar Monday especially if you want to ski untracked haha.

 

[skinavy]

Thanks all! We were just chatting about the possibility of taking 50 to Heavenly as an alternate, for the exact reasons you mentioned. The Nevada side tip is exactly the kind of stuff that makes local knowledge so valuable- thank you!

 

[Pequenita]

IMHO, the descent into SLT on 50 can be really hairy in weather. It’s a somewhat narrow 2-lane road with a cliff on one side.

If going to north lake up 80, get an early start. If you are not in Truckee by 7:15am, it will take you an hour to hour and a half from the exit onto 89 to Squaw or Alpine, on a weekend storm/powder day.

 

[luliski]

- As the weather is setting up now, for that Sunday specifically, do you recommend Squaw or Alpine (or even N*)? Looking for crowd/liftline avoidance; it's our 1st trip to Tahoe so I suspect we will find cool stuff anywhere we go.

Depending on timing of the storm, you'll probably find some lines anywhere (it is a weekend). If you could drive up Saturday evening (hopefully before the snow, and if it ends up being a bigger storm, you might get lucky in that some won't end up going "up the hill."

- What can we expect road/traffic wise on 80? Seems like Donner Pass is the primary bugaboo- what other sporty spots can we expect?

On Sunday morning it shouldn't be bad driving through Sacramento. The area around Norden (west of Donner Pass) frequently has poor visibility. As others have mentioned, 89 on a powder morning can be slow and frustrating. If you can, get to Tahoe on Saturday night. Stay in Tahoe City or at Squaw or Alpine.

- How's the comparison vs I70 on the Denver-Summit county run?

No idea, I've only done that in the summer. But the drive Sacramento to Tahoe is longer (about two hours).

- We've got CalTrans and CHP Truckee facebook bookmarked and ready to check; how quickly do they react and update status?

I've found CHP Truckee FB page to be very reliable, in fact I never check CalTrans. I have also FB messaged CHP Truckee and they responded promptly.

- Traction laws seem similar to CO and UT; is the specific requirement for M+S tires on 4WD also? This may be a challenge on a rental out of Sac, probably only have "all season."

All the all season tires I've ever had said "M+S" on them so you should be fine with all-seasons. Just keep your distance and watch your speed.

- This seems like a "small" storm by Tahoe standards; when does CHP start shutting stuff down?

I hope not . As @raytseng said, they shut things down when people start to spin out. In my experience, spin outs happen more going "down the hill," so hopefully you'll get up there without the road closing. But ideally, you'll be there before it starts snowing (go up Saturday)!

Many thanks in advance!

 

[raytseng]

Another note is don't follow googlemaps or waze detours in the coming storm if you don't know exactly where it goes.
As BA stated, this is shaping up to biggest storm of this season.
Use good judgement

 

[skinavy]

Yes; good general advice for any weather situation. We do a lot of heavy weather driving to accommodate this sport, very respectful of who is in charge, and it ain't me. No, my wife isn't, either
The timing to Truckee for crowd avoidance is useful- thanks!

 

[Pequenita]

@skinavy - I came through Truckee at 8am on a powder day the Friday before MLK and it took 45 minutes from the 89 exit to the Squaw parking lot. I can't remember exactly, but my drive from Sacramento that time was around 2:30 to 3 hours, which I'd say is typical timing on a storm day. The worst drive I've had was 4 hrs, and that was because I did it on a Friday night. The lowest I've seen chain control has been about 45 minutes outside of Sac. There could be some wiggle room with morning timing on Sunday, but my guess is that a lot of weekenders will already be up in the area and trying to funnel onto one road all at the same time. Moral of the story, on a powder day (or day that you think everyone else will perceive as a powder day), give yourself way more time than you think you need. Good luck, and have fun!

 

[raytseng]

Keep in mind that resort parking will likely hit capacity this weekend.
The best way to monitor if they're going to be turning people away is via each resort's operations twitter accounts. Similarly that's the earliest place they'll announce they're shutting everything down and only the magic carpet is running.

 

[GettingThere]

Tahoe Daily Snow Forecast | OpenSnow

The Tahoe Daily Snow provides the best snow forecast, written by a local Tahoe forecaster. Find snow conditions at ski resorts in Tahoe.

opensnow.com

^^ This is the best blow by blow you can get as far as timing, snow, winds etc.

Given above Alpine would be a safer bet (monitor squaw app if possible to see projected lift openings). Any chance you can leave late Sat from Sac? M/S (all season) qualifies (all cars except those with summer tires) so you should be ok in a rental. This is shaping up to be an unexpectedly big storm. Cal Trans does not shutdown unless blizzard/whiteout or spinouts. Roads are warm but this storm is coming in cold with low snow levels. Snow level dictates where chain control is set up. Post chain control traffic moves at 20-35mph. If traffic, then chain control checkpoint creates a back-up.

My two cents would be to leave Sat or super early Sun so that there is less chance of traffic snarling on 80. I'd also stick to 80 (and not follow waze detours). Pow day, 89 exit to Squaw could be 45min - 1hr after 8am.

Also many airlines are permitting penalty free changes due to covid, If possible at all, I'd get in sooner and make the drive up to Tahoe earlier on Sat to not have to deal with the uncertainty.

Good luck and hope you have a great trip!

(Disclaimer: Free advice is worth what you paid for it)

 

[skinavy]

All good advice- the pow day "leave extra margin" being true in all markets. For traffic and parking.
With other folks and moving pieces involved, we won't be able to get in earlier (if it were just wife & me, we'd be there Friday!)- so I think the plan remains to be rolling buttcrack early Sunday and hope we are closer to the front edge of the surge. We have jetlag working in our favor that morning- pre-5AM departure will just feel like normal drive time for us.
Winds look extra sporty; we may take @SSSdave 's suggestion and head to NV side of Heavenly. Dunno.
Appreciate the assurance re: tires. We do travel with traction straps (not our first rodeo), just in case.

 

[raytseng]

haha, the more likely plan is waking up ready to roll, seeing the closed on the map and then spending 30minutes drinking coffee refreshing road conditions updates and noaa forecasts deciding your backup plan.

Then if you get in, you'll sit in the lodge spending 30min looking at noaa forecasts and refreshing lift statuses and making a plan to go to northstar or stay.
Northstar is still the standout for protected skiing and exceeds HV's protection. The suggestion to go to southlake is largely to hedge 80 being shut down.
Hope your gear is good, this will be the weekend that is going to test whether you've made investments in apparel or cheaped out.
Now that totals are in double digits at Squaw/Alpine there good chance you won't be skiing or can't see anything. Given how the season is going; mtn ops has not had to work hard for the last 6weeks+. I've heard rumors on the chairs of seasonal layoffs already, I don't have faith mountain ops is running at 100%.

 

[luliski]

We do love our Tahoe dumps

 

[skinavy]

So I'm not going to take credit for the storm, but we've been bringing deep freshies with us each trip this year!
Hit 10" early Dec in VT, then a foot at Copper a week later. I had 16" at Alta on a Monday in late Jan, and then was in Summit County again for the multi-foot dump before Valentine's. We weren't chasing for any of this; they were all pre-planned trips!
And now this.
Skiers throughout the United States, you are welcome. Sometimes I am that good.

 

[skinavy]

After watching the forecast grow and grow, we all managed to get our flights shifted to Reno, landing a few hours earlier to boot. Figured easier (and shorter) drive on the backside of the mountains, and the possibility of getting to the house Sat evening.
...and of course within an hour of changing all the reservations, several of us started changing our minds about traveling at all. "But 3 feet of pow" is a powerful counterweight to many perfectly rational arguments, but the group had too many for even that most awesome of reasons to go. There may be no friends on a pow day, but I'm not sure that applies to transcontinental jaunts with your college kids during a pandemic. Thus, our 1st Sierra adventure must wait.

So, I thank all of you for your input and showing me several options, but I leave this storm to you. We'll bank our airfare for next season.

 

[Pequenita]

It must have been difficult to come to this decision, but I think everything is a crapshoot at this point. Hope you’re well-stocked, wherever you are!