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jmeb

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Denver got hammered last weekend. Have to say, my Falken's AT3W's have been killing it. They aren't much on pure ice but I've never met a tire that really is unless it's studded. They are monsters in deep slush. On Sunday morning got to pull out my neighbors big ole truck with my van and dog-leash made from climbing rope.

Pulling out the un-plowed trailhead after 10-12" of fresh was no problemo.
8KKtPqm.jpg
 
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dirt heel pusher
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^^^^totally agree. We made a good call on this tire.

One of the historical considerations against the one tire quiver was the compound freezing up for the "3 season" tire or the excessive warm temp wear of the one season tire.

Advances in silica based compounds have really eliminated the three-season-freeze issue. Like the BFG AT ko2, the Falken AT3W is excellent in very cold temps. Couldn't make them slide at -10F in packed powder, standing on the brakes, and excellent in cold soapy high traffic areas that are often seen in the intermountain west, especially on long high passes to ski areas.

The rise of the hybrid continues.

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The value of that class leading tread depth...

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dirt heel pusher
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Slow drivers now keep left. So the nice, high traction, unplowed right hand lane is the new passing lane. Gotta love that deep tread, like it isn't even there.

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dirt heel pusher
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Interesting no comments/love for the Nokian WRG3 SUV tire on here...

Just ordered a set...

How do you like them? The WRG3 is too car-like for me (obviously) and a tire has to have offroad aspirations to be made in the large sizes I use, but I had the first gen WRs on a '02 Subaru Legacy wagon and thought they were a great tire for typical plowed roads. So much that the Hakka's that followed on the minivan that followed were a serious disappointment.

Things I have changed since then (everything is better than it was), but even the WR had a 50K treadlife warranty for year round use. I'd put that WRG3 on an AWD with some power in a heartbeat with the idea of biasing to dry pavement performance in cold temps. That's pretty much the design intent of the tire, IMO.
 

Jed Peters

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How do you like them? The WRG3 is too car-like for me (obviously) and a tire has to have offroad aspirations to be made in the large sizes I use, but I had the first gen WRs on a '02 Subaru Legacy wagon and thought they were a great tire for typical plowed roads. So much that the Hakka's that followed on the minivan that followed were a serious disappointment.

Things I have changed since then (everything is better than it was), but even the WR had a 50K treadlife warranty for year round use. I'd put that WRG3 on an AWD with some power in a heartbeat with the idea of biasing to dry pavement performance in cold temps. That's pretty much the design intent of the tire, IMO.

I think you have to read this:

First multi condition test of my new Nokia WRG3 SUV tires on my 2010 Range Rover HSE.
I can report that the tires performed excellent in snow, ice, slush and heavy rain while at Tahoe yesterday.
We like to gas it, and apply the brakes hard (where it's relative safe) to test the situations looking for breaking the tires loose or sliding.
Pleased to report no significant slippage.
Yes, these tires seem to have a fairly aggressive sidewall tire pattern. I think that has a lot to do with the great performance.
Also to mention I live in the SF Bay Area and wanted a good all around tire but aggressive enough for the trips to Tahoe.

My father is the one who purchased....

I run ice-x on my family minivan....
 
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Ken_R

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How do you like them? The WRG3 is too car-like for me (obviously) and a tire has to have offroad aspirations to be made in the large sizes I use, but I had the first gen WRs on a '02 Subaru Legacy wagon and thought they were a great tire for typical plowed roads. So much that the Hakka's that followed on the minivan that followed were a serious disappointment.

Things I have changed since then (everything is better than it was), but even the WR had a 50K treadlife warranty for year round use. I'd put that WRG3 on an AWD with some power in a heartbeat with the idea of biasing to dry pavement performance in cold temps. That's pretty much the design intent of the tire, IMO.

Awesome info nay. Wow.

Read through and still a bit undecided on what to get for my Honda Pilot AWD SUV for year round use. I drive very very long stretches of mostly dry or wet highway in between the areas where I see cold and snow and also drive on some gravel roads (nothing extreme 4x4 but typical roads to get to trailheads). Some of the hybrids look too much 4x4 performance oriented no?
 

James

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If tread depth is one's priority it seems you'd want to swap out for winter instead of wearing tires down all year.
 

jmeb

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Awesome info nay. Wow.

Read through and still a bit undecided on what to get for my Honda Pilot AWD SUV for year round use. I drive very very long stretches of mostly dry or wet highway in between the areas where I see cold and snow and also drive on some gravel roads (nothing extreme 4x4 but typical roads to get to trailheads). Some of the hybrids look too much 4x4 performance oriented no?

I'd seriously take a look at the Cooper ATW. Its a winter-focused version of the AT3 which has very good highway manners. I've spent some time riding in my buddies SUV up/down i70 a lot in them and they ride/perform very much like an all-season when its dry and kill it in the snow.
 
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I'd seriously take a look at the Cooper ATW. Its a winter-focused version of the AT3 which has very good highway manners. I've spent some time riding in my buddies SUV up/down i70 a lot in them and they ride/perform very much like an all-season when its dry and kill it in the snow.

X2.

For a pilot I'd stay p-metric and a somewhat lighter duty tire. I would also look at the Kumho AT51 if budget has some weighting. That tire replaces a tire that was well known for good winter performance and is seriously right priced.

The Michelin's noted here would also serve very well. But if you are biasing to winter with just limited trailhead summer driving, the Cooper probably deserves first look.
 
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If tread depth is one's priority it seems you'd want to swap out for winter instead of wearing tires down all year.

You might. The idea here is these tires don't suffer excessive summer wear, and some of them have very deep tread out of the factory.

The Falkens on my Sequoia have a 20/32 tread depth in the LT 34" size. That's in the category of dedicated offroad tires, but they don't suffer from tread squirm. TIme will tell on longevity. The BFG ko2 on my Cruiser have about 27K now and they are showing very little wear. That tire in a 37" was something like 16/32, so more like a traditional all terrain tread depth. Performance has not deteriorated as the tires have worn, which was another long standing complaint.

So if you have a truck, the value proposition can be very high performance to longevity across all four seasons. I use to hate all terrains as your classic great at nothing tire that suffered from winter temp fluctuations, but they have come so far it has now become difficult to justify needing more when they are so ridiculously civilized on dry pavement.
 

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I see, more truck oriented. But does a Honda Pilot Awd fit that usage?

What's the weight comparison of these to off road tires or street tires?
 
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I see, more truck oriented. But does a Honda Pilot Awd fit that usage?

What's the weight comparison of these to off road tires or street tires?

Most of these tires account for this in offerings in p-metric sizes for more road oriented/lighter duty use and LT for the heavier duty vehicles and/or offroad use. The LT load range E tires I run are 73 lbs (ko2) and 63 lbs (Falken) per tire, but both are significantly oversized and intended for offroad use. They also both have low rolling resistance - I get the top end of the EPA fuel economy guidelines for the Cruiser on the ko2 in a 37", although when you look at those guidelines, they are laughable by modern standards (14 mpg highway).

The Falkens are a highway cruiser's dream for being relatively aggressive in tread design and very aggressive in depth. The Sequoia on those 34's is way more quiet than our minivan on snow tires. The truck is quieter generally being a large body on frame SUV, but it's a material difference and the minivan uses a p-metric 225/60/17.

Tires we've discussed here that are offered p-metric include the Falken AT3W, Hankook Dynapro, Toyo AT2, Nitto Terra Grapper G2, probably all of the Michelin's and Coopers, Kumho AT51, and I'm probably forgetting some. This assumes a fit with Pilot tire sizes.

A lot of SUVs and even minivans come in p-metric designations, so there wouldn't be a major weight penalty. Primary rule of thumb I would use for a pilot would be to avoid anything LT load rated and anything more offroad oriented. But there are plenty of relatively tame tires here that are designed precisely for good winter and very light car camping/trailhead access type usage.
 
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jmeb

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I would say I've not been impressed with my buddy's Kumho AT51 from a wear perspective. He's had them for ~20K on a suburban. Not sure if it is the tires or if he doesn't care for his suspension enough.
 
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I would say I've not been impressed with my buddy's Kumho AT51 from a wear perspective. He's had them for ~20K on a suburban. Not sure if it is the tires or if he doesn't care for his suspension enough.

LT or p-metric version, just out of curiosity? The p-metrics don't tend to work well for longer term wear on heavier SUVs in my experience, although some people seem to do ok with them. But since p-metrics are typically $40+ less a tire in the big SUV sizes, if you don't have a heavy duty requirement they can be compelling.

I personally like the load range E tires, because you can lower the PSI a bit without sidewall deformation, and they actually end up delivering a more comfortable ride.
 

jmeb

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LT or p-metric version, just out of curiosity? The p-metrics don't tend to work well for longer term wear on heavier SUVs in my experience, although some people seem to do ok with them. But since p-metrics are typically $40+ less a tire in the big SUV sizes, if you don't have a heavy duty requirement they can be compelling.

I personally like the load range E tires, because you can lower the PSI a bit without sidewall deformation, and they actually end up delivering a more comfortable ride.

I'd have to check -- and again, may be the fact that his suspension is pretty damn old (though I think he replaced the front end) rather than poor tire build.
 

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I just put a set of Nokian Rotiiva AT's on my new pickup and have driven over dry, wet, slush, mud and unpacked 2" snow so far with them (and they have only been on 2 days!) and have been very satisfied. They are a little noiser than the Goodyear Wrangler's that came as standard equipment, but are far better in all conditions mentioned above, with the exception of dry pavement, and can even take some light duty off road use, which I wouldn't dare do on the Goodyears.
 
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Well, the season is far from over, but I'm ready to mail in the ballot that the Falken AT3W is a winner.

Had them in all conditions from glare ice to deep snow, slush to packed powder. Quiet and smooth on dry pavement at interstate speeds up to 85 mph. Still look pretty much new at about 13K ski season miles, no extra tires in the garage, no summer swaps.

The BFG AT ko2 continued their winter performance as well. At 28K traction remains like new, still nice and quiet and round. Great tires in this category.
 

Ken_R

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My Cooper A/T3's just owned everything this winter and kept me from sliding when most people were (except those with chains!) going up the infamous NM532 up to Ski Apache right after a storm. 12 miles continuous snow and ice with grades up to 11%. They were quiet and comfortable on long drives (700 miles plus!) on the highway. They had incredible grip on dirt / gravel roads. Honestly a no brainer tire choice for trucks and SUVs.
 
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graham418

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Just got new tires for my truck , Michelin Defender LTX M/S. They are replacing the LTX MS2's (same tire, new name) that had 140,000 kms. Still had tread on them , but were getting weatherbeaten (6 years old). they are the only tires I use , summer or winter . I get the LT version , load range E, not so much for load carrying but for sidewall durability and puncture resistance on construction sites.
 

surfandski

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This winter we will be driving out from Florida to Colorado for a 9-10 week ski trip and we bought a brand new Subaru Outback for the trip and are disappointed to learn that the stock tires on that vehicle are crap in the snow (actually crap on anything it appears). So my 2 options are to look for some cheap used snow tires on Denver Craigslist when we get out there and then put the stock ones back on for the drive home, or buy some good all seasons here in Florida. What I don't want is to get some winter-biased tires here that are only going to get winter-used for a few months and then be a compromise the rest of the year. If anything, I'd prefer them to excel in out of snow conditions but still be capable for the few months we'll be using them in CO. We will be skiing almost daily and especially on the big snow days so we don't want to be under-gunned on those days but also realize those days are rare. Also, we'll be staying in Georgetown and mostly skiing Luv on snow days so it will be a short distance but up a fairly steep pass (I grew up in Tahoe/Mammoth so I have snow experience).

So I've read good things about the Michelin LTX but I'm a little confused because some here are recommending the Premier and some the Defender. The premier doesn't appear to have nearly as gnarly tread pattern (actually, doesn't look that different than the stock Subi tires) so it would probably be better for other conditions but the Defender definitely looks to be better in snow. However, the defender's look way overkill the rest of the year. So what do you think will be best for our scenario? 1. Get a dedicated snow tire when we get to Denver. 2. Get a winter-biased all season that crushes it in the snow but then is a compromise for the rest of the tire's life. 3. Get a tire that is better for the 90+% of it's life but is a compromise in the snow (but hopefully not as much compromise as the stock Bridgestone Dueller AS that are on it).

Our Limited Outback has 18" which makes the options a little more expensive than the 17" versions. Thanks for your help!
 

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