Hybrids - The New Winter Tire

[cosmoliu]

Near as I could tell when I was shopping for the car, BMW doesn't even ship anything less than 20" rims on the m40i. At least not to the West Coast. The sales manager even checked, supposedly, dealers all the way up to Oregon to see if he could arrange a dealer trade. That, as well as the combination of options I wanted, including a donut spare tire so I could widen my choices for rubber, made it so that the most sensible thing was to order the car from the factory. And even then, the smallest rims available were 19". This big wheel thing has gotten out of hand.

 

[cantunamunch]

. This big wheel thing has gotten out of hand.

I fought back - and the proof is that I went from 19" to 17" to fit the Terrain Contacts pictured above.

 

[Shawn C.]

Since I suck at this (even after reading the vast majority of the previous 18 pages) I'm just going to ask for some tire options for my 2018 Subaru Outback.

I live in Ogden, UT and have a season pass to Powder Mountain. For those who have never driven the road up to there it is like the World Freeskiing Tour of roads. Black diamond driving for sure! So, I need a tire that can handle the up/down of that + my 12 mile each way commute to work. I've never had a problem commuting in the snow even with the OEM Bridgestone Duelers but I know they suck. I've never had a dedicated winter tire on any of my Subarus so I really don't know what I'm missing but would love to have a tire that is safer for winter driving.

So... 1) I am fine with storing summer tires in the garage if I have to. 2) Do I even need a "snow tire" or would a set of all-weather tire be Ok for year-round driving.

I really appreciate any advice. The more research I do the more confused I get.

 

[Shawn C.]

P.S. I do a pretty good amount of driving on unpaved forest service roads in the summer, if that is a factor.

 

[François Pugh]

Since I suck at this (even after reading the vast majority of the previous 18 pages) I'm just going to ask for some tire options for my 2018 Subaru Outback.

I live in Ogden, UT and have a season pass to Powder Mountain. For those who have never driven the road up to there it is like the World Freeskiing Tour of roads. Black diamond driving for sure! So, I need a tire that can handle the up/down of that + my 12 mile each way commute to work. I've never had a problem commuting in the snow even with the OEM Bridgestone Duelers but I know they suck. I've never had a dedicated winter tire on any of my Subarus so I really don't know what I'm missing but would love to have a tire that is safer for winter driving.

So... 1) I am fine with storing summer tires in the garage if I have to. 2) Do I even need a "snow tire" or would a set of all-weather tire be Ok for year-round driving.

I really appreciate any advice. The more research I do the more confused I get.

Yes you need two sets of tires. You may have been fine, but accidents can still happen, and one accident saved is well worth the price of the extra winter grip.

Assuming you are allowed studs, Nokian Hakkapaliitta 9. Also these aren't bad. http://www.skstuds.ca/2019/02/14/20...est-winter-tires-tested-by-the-naf/#more-1170
or if you are on a tight budget, maybe Nokian Nordman 7.
If not allowed studs Hakkapaliitta R3. 2nd no stud choice Michelin X-ice 3.

 

[pete]

If not allowed studs Hakkapaliitta R3. 2nd no stud choice Michelin X-ice 3.

I like the X-ice 3 on my Explorer but for me they seem best suited for plowed roads, less so on deep snow. Noting this in case @Shawn C. route to Powder Mtn or daily drives be in heavier snow totals.

On plowed and icier routes, the X-ice 3 are great.

 

[tball]

Do I even need a "snow tire" or would a set of all-weather tire be Ok for year-round driving.

P.S. I do a pretty good amount of driving on unpaved forest service roads in the summer, if that is a factor.

Lots of folks get by with all-weather or AT tires for what you are describing. Even with 3PMS tires, they are not getting the snow and ice performance of proper winter tires.

There are lots of tradeoffs with winter tires, but the difference in ice braking is what's crucial in my view. Here's a great video that highlights the differences and tradeoffs of various tire types in all conditions:

Full data: https://www.tyrereviews.co.uk/Artic...l-Weather-Winter-Nordic-and-Studded-Tyres.htm

These are the snow braking results:

I'm most concerned about ice braking, as icy roads are where so many accidents happen:

To a large degree, you can compensate for the few extra meters of wet and dry braking winter tires require with careful driving.

It's impossible to compensate for the extra 20 or 30 meters of ice braking required by all-season, all-weather, and even mild winter tires. Unless you get lucky, you'll probably hit something in an emergency braking on ice without good winter tires.

That's also a good reminder for those of us with proper winter tires to keep an eye on the rearview mirror when braking!

 

[crgildart]

P.S. I do a pretty good amount of driving on unpaved forest service roads in the summer, if that is a factor.

The "M" in M+S is for "mud".

 

[James]

If you want less $ tires than the Hakkas, Continental Viking Contact7. Did very well in snow. Actually rated higher than the Hakka R3 in the Norwegian test.
Check out GigaTire For prices.

If you can use them, meaning they fit, the Suv versions of some of these tires have kevlar reinforced sidewalls.


One thing I don't get is load ratings. Once upon a time it meant number of plys. Not now. Not sure how to factor those in to choose between two tires. The Nokian Wrg3 all weather tire I have is an xl and 103 load rating. The new version, Wrg4, is now not xl, and rated at 99.

 

[pete]

That's also a good reminder for those of us with proper winter tires to keep an eye on the rearview mirror when braking!

but I have Hupy and Abraham ....

law firm with pretty humorous commercials

 

[Shawn C.]

You guys rock! Thanks so much for the advice and recommendations!
I came into this thinking maybe a 17” aftermarket wheel with a beefy hybrid tire would be good for all season traction. After reading this I think I’m now on the right track in getting dedicated winter tires in the stock 18” wheels as the Pow Mow road is a real bear.

 

[djetok]

My wife got another nail in the tire of her all season tires that did ok in the snow. We never had a snow chain law implemented, we have chains though. They just did not feel secure or stop the best. I opted for a new set of tires. The Continental terrain contact, its a 3 peak tire and seems to be a good tire for our use. We drive about every other weekend to the mountains from Oklahoma. The first run with them will be Thursday to Crested Butte. There is little to no snow forecasted, but we shall see.

 

[cantunamunch]

The Continental terrain contact, its a 3 peak tire and seems to be a good tire for our use. We drive about every other weekend to the mountains from Oklahoma. The first run with them will be Thursday to Crested Butte.

Mine did really well in the freezing rain. Didn't engage ABS at all - unlike with the stock tires. No snow yet to speak of

 

[James]

I had pretty good performance last night in the snow, freezing rain, rain, with the Nokian Wrg3 all weather. After 42,000 mi their standing water performance is diminished, and I’m looking to replace them for full snows this winter then put back on for summer.

 

[martyg]

Since I suck at this (even after reading the vast majority of the previous 18 pages) I'm just going to ask for some tire options for my 2018 Subaru Outback.

I live in Ogden, UT and have a season pass to Powder Mountain. For those who have never driven the road up to there it is like the World Freeskiing Tour of roads. Black diamond driving for sure! So, I need a tire that can handle the up/down of that + my 12 mile each way commute to work. I've never had a problem commuting in the snow even with the OEM Bridgestone Duelers but I know they suck. I've never had a dedicated winter tire on any of my Subarus so I really don't know what I'm missing but would love to have a tire that is safer for winter driving.

So... 1) I am fine with storing summer tires in the garage if I have to. 2) Do I even need a "snow tire" or would a set of all-weather tire be Ok for year-round driving.

I really appreciate any advice. The more research I do the more confused I get.

I couldn't be happier with my studded Nokians. There were noisy at first, but settled in after a few hundred miles. So far this year I've taken several trips from SW CO to the I70 corridor for various clinics this year. I've managed to hit snowstorms every time, driving over Wolf Creek or Red Mountain Pass routes.

The most compelling aspect of these tires.... Punching a throttle on a vehicle that does 0 - 60 in five seconds, and having only the slightest waver on hard packed snow and ice. Tenacious.

I've have Ice-X on another vehicle that is FWD. It is not apples to apples, but the Nokians feel much more secure.

FYI we had an instructor who lived in Silverton (her husband managed Silverton Mountain). She drove over two passes to get to work each day, and swore by her Outback with snows.

 

[djetok]

Mine did really well in the freezing rain. Didn't engage ABS at all - unlike with the stock tires. No snow yet to speak of

The contis were awesome. Quieter than stock, no mpg change , handled dry roads fine, no as smooth (to be expected, and handled snow great we didn't see a lot of ice and snow, except in cb

 

[cantunamunch]

Yep, positive experience here too,. Really liked them on dirt roads (thanks Google) and mud parking lots. Quite nice on packed snow and warmish granular; there was one tilted driveway 3 point turn that would have had the stock tires sliding out sideways.

One downside ? They are truly frightening on grooved steel bridge decks at anything over 25 mph. Squirmy, jumpy, wild, barely able to keep to the lane. I am planning a return route that takes me anywhere other than steel. Gah.

 

[Wilhelmson]

The Conti DWS are a great all season tire that could blast through as much snow or slush that the car could clear, but I never felt relatively safe on ice until buying snow tires.

 

[johnnyvw]

Shawn C: look at it this way...the skiing is at it's best when the driving is at it's worst. I've been up that road, and if I was facing your choice, hands down it would be for snows. All of the brands mentioned on this blog are pretty good, and everyone will have a personal favorite. After using most of the brands available, my personal favorite are the Blizzaks, as they give me the most of what I buy a snow tire for. YMMV.

 

[Chickenmonkey]

Ok, I think it is time. I am at 6 mm tread remaining on my Michelin Ice-X winters.

I am planning on going AT with either the Falken Wildpeak AT3w or Cooper AT3 4s. I am not sure the Falken comes in my size. Seems inconsistent on different sites. I have 245 65 17 tires on my Highlander with aftermarket 17” x 7.5” rims.

I do the Bay Area to Tahoe drive so a bunch of dry/wet roads before we hit the snow. Any advice on choosing assuming I get get both?